Shuggob, Ghoul Sage

By sbmriatdh, in CoC Rules Discussion

I was just curious if his ability really is discard instead of destroy. I checked the FAQ and did not see it in there. I assume it was a carry over from agot and poor editing but I would like to have an official clarification. I am not really sure how to send questions to the developers directly.

In addition the rules state that when a character is destroyed all attachments on it are also destroyed. I am curious what happens to attachments when a character is sacrificed. I couldn't find anything in the rulebook, but I have been know to miss things. Yeah, both these questions stem from the fact that I am working on a Telepathic Chthonian deck =)

Discard, Destroy, and Sacrifice, all have the same end point, the card ending up in the discard pile, but how it gets there, and what can and cannot trigger off its leaving play is going to very.

When a card leaves play, any cards attached to it are discarded. There are no effects that trigger from a card being discarded from play.

When a card has more wounds than it can survive it is destroyed. A card is also destroyed if a card targeting says destroy target card. There are cards which trigger on a card being wounded or destroyed.

Sacrifice is an uncancelable effect where you are removing your own character (is there anything that sacrifices a different card type?) from playing and putting it into the discard pile. There are cards that require a sacrifice as a form of payment. There may be cards which trigger off a card being sacrificed.

If you ask me the three forms are created to give deeper design space in regards to triggering conditions.

Put into play and Play are both different ways of making a card enter play, but the mechanics that cause it and cards that respond to it are different. Just remember that they are different things and the cards which interact with that effect/mechanic will always call out exactly which it is supposed to be.

Penfold said:

When a card leaves play, any cards attached to it are discarded. There are no effects that trigger from a card being discarded from play.

Thanks for responding, but looking at the rulebook on page 4 it states "Exception: Cards that are attached to another card (most often
support cards) are immediately destroyed (put into the discard pile) if the card they are attached to leaves play for any reason. "
underneath the Support Cards heading. So it seems that attachments will trigger for the purposes of Telepathic Chthonian on characters whether they are sacrificed or destroyed, likewise if a character goes insane any attachments are destroyed. I find it interesting that you bring up discard because that term by my understanding isn't really used in Call of Cthulhu (unless it is from hand/deck, success tokens) and I feel that it must have been used in error on Shuggob. Horrid Dreams for MU could presumably force an opponent to sac a support.


This is not traditional wording for CoC, but in the rules we see examples where discarding is used to represent removing a card from play and putting it in the discard pile. In the section on Heroic and Villainous, for example, they tell us:

If for any reason a player controls both a Heroic character and a Villainous character at the same time, he must immediately choose one to be discarded.

Of course both destroy and sacrifice result in a card going into the discard pile. Perhaps the wording on Shuggob is intended to mean "this card is not being destroyed, nor is it being sacrificed, so effects that respond to either of those do not trigger. Just put it in the discard pile please."

I guess I must be really cynical to have assumed that this was a carry-over from A Game of Thrones and the editors never caught it. I just really find it hard to believe this one card gets this wording out of the whole day and night cards, it makes no sense and seems very awkward.

You may be right. You'd have to ask the designers. I doubt anyone here could answer it with anything more than "logicking" it out.