Yes Tolertis... Basicly other religions is lawfully accepted by the empire if not socially accepted by the empire. So far we know of two major ones such as space marines and the tech priests of mars. Is there any possibility of more that are hiding under the shadow of the Adeptus Ministorum that are just itching for a chance to fight back? Maybe... I know I made something similar to voodoo, but that is just home brewing.

With the current rules and setting is it possible to have tolertis? Is it even possible to give them some talents that is similar to pure faith? I mean if you are risking your life day in and day out for not believing in the imperial creed, but by your own faith that Imperial itself deems as safe would you be able to channel something out of it? You really cannot be a guy just faking it cause there is not much to gain and a lot more to lose so any tolerti would have to be faithful to say the least.

Oh yeah before I forget. I am not trying to pick and choose faith powers from BotM. No if I am going tolerti faith like powers I want them to be different than Ecclesiarchy faith powers cause that would better reflect the differance between the two.

First of all you need a REALLY powerful military lobby to have a deviating faith. Only the Space Marines (who are also the Emperor's Angels of Death which makes justifying an attack on them harder) and the Adeptus Mechanicus (who arm the other armies of the Imperium and control the titans as far as I know (I could be wrong there though)) have that.

And concerning the faith powers we had an interesting discussion in another thread because we simply have no idea what faith powers actually are. Some think that theoretically every human with true faith can manipulate the warp somehow to will miracles into existence while others think that the Emperor himself somehow works the miracles if he feels someone needs it.

I've read somewhere that pure faith is something working like daemon pact with the Emperor, what would make sense to why non-psykers can suddenly (I know, it doesn't happen suddenly) use inhuman powers.

And for other beliefs, many words of empire are feral worlds, each with tribes and their own gods (which I belive are treated as aspects of Emperor when poeple from these planets are picked up to be Inquisition acylotes or space marines)

Okay I can see feral worlds doing that since not many clerics are going to make planet fall and risk their lives. Though I would image underhives would be a safe haven too. Maybe having some powerful troops (nothing compared to what the major Adeptus have) as well.

Snowman0147 said:

Regarding feral worlds, yes it is nearly impossible to police every 2-bit primitive planet BUT most of them have had Clerics sent to drag them into the Imperial faith (there's a reason that in Rogue Trader the Missionary can have Pure Faith, for many there's no risk to great to spread the word), often ending up with a messy mixture of local and Imperial faith (like Iocanthus in the main rules) which and there's thousands of these semi-imperial faiths.

Obviously they can't be expected to convert every faith on every planet, they often rely on the populous to police it themselves and otherwise it likely to be too small or remote to spread off world.

The underhives are a haven for 'evil' cults, and you have to remember that to the Ecclesiarchy ANY other religion is an heretical cult whether it's Slaneesh or Buddhism.

So in other words unless you have a military force that says other wise there is no chance in hell that you will have tolertis... Well that sucks. So would imperial cults count as imperial creed, or just some hybrid of imperial creed and local influences?

There are many, many variations on the Imperial Creed; most of these started out as a hybrid of the "official" creed, and local beliefs. The Imperium has a million-odd worlds, and they don't all get along. Determining which variations are "acceptable" is the Ecclesiarchy's job...

...but in general, the 40K Imperium is anything but kind, loving, and forgiving. If your faith isn't acceptable, you'll burn as a heretic. And that can change suddenly when politics are involved. There are several cases of a formerly accepted group or cult suddenly getting labeled unacceptable, and being purged. (Astral Knives and Temple of the Saviour Emperor for starters.)

The only reason the AdMech and the Space Marines get away with beliefs that would be heretical is that they are too powerful, and too important to purge. Same reason that the Navigators are tolerated despite the official "no mutant" policy.

Cheers,

- V.

The standard way for the Imperium to convert a world to the Imperial Creed is to find them monotheistic faith on that world that best serves their interests. Then convince them that they have the name (and a fe other details) or their god wrong. His correct name is the God-Emperor. Then they help that religion spread across the planet. This process can take centuries and, since the Imperium doesn't care much about how they worship the Emperor, this leads to a lot of variation between loyal planets. You can do a lot within those broad restrictions.

Usually this is done by various miracles that help both goals. For example, think how useful real time orbital surveillance (an easy thing for the Imperium to setup) would have been to any force in history up to about WW2. With it, you can see any movement of your enemies armies and position your forces accordingly. No more need to risk sending out scouts, who can come back with inaccurate reports, or fail to come back due to something other than the enemy.

Even if they realise that it comes from technology, the smart generals will be willing to lie about that (and oppress anyone who openly disbelieves) because they can see how big of an advantage it is to have the intel that the Imperial Missionaries give them. For the next generation, you will have more believers, so you can introduce the next minor change to them.

And that's just one cheap tech.

Now think about how little a difference is needed for real world religions to start fighting (unless there is someone to stop them), and how easily the Imperium can guarantee which side eventually wins. Given a century and they can be very through at making sure everyone follows the creed.

The only exceptions to the Creed are groups who gained all their power with the backing of The Emperor and are now too embedded into the structure of the Imperium to be removed without tearing it apart.

I wonder if it is possible for a creed to get their own faith powers?

Snowman0147 said:

possible as GM you (or your GM?) can just make some up that better reflect that version.

The only thing that a version of the imperial cult really needs is to venerate the Emperor as a god or rather the One-True-God-Over-Them-All pretty much every thing else is up to local interpretation as ling as it does not fall into heretical practices etc.

many feral worlds believe in more than one god and as long as the Emperor is the biggest and best its all well and good, more or less. as far as I am aware.

What would normally fall under heretic practices other than worship chaos, xenos, and false gods?

Whatever implies an over developped freedom of speech, or goes against the way the Imperium works, I guess?

Okay the reason why I was asking these questions is that I can develope a character for a latter game. Basicly a remake as I felt I did the character and the setting wrong. So I am trying to make things right.

Is it possible to have a imperial creed that is more gentle to certain types of mutants? Like those who got covered in toxic waste without any warp corruption for a example. I know there is a larger branch in the imperial religion that is actually caring of mutants as long as the mutation is not that bad and know their place. I am thinking...

"Well this is my brother who got change into a freak because of the sewer accident. I know he is not evil and corrupted so he is okay unlike those mutants we saw at that space station. I don't know what made them like that, and judging by the fact that they just ate one of us I say the mutants are evil. Lets burn them. My brother had provided us with enough flame ammo to do it."

There are all sorts of varients of the Imperial Creed and some are wildly different from each other. There's nothing stopping a hive city or planet having greater tolerance for mutants, especially if mutant labour is proving useful. Of course, this runs the risk of a monodominant inquisitor deciding the planet is falling into corruption but them's the breaks. Not necessarily a huge risk, especially if other inquisitors think the planet's output is too valuable to disrupt by purges.

I don't have the book handy, but I seem to recall that the description of the planet Zillman's Domain says that the leaders are converts "in name only" to the Imperial faith, and the peasants still follow the old faith; the world simply isn't of enough strategic improtance for the Adeptus to intervene. That's not exactly "officially tollerated", but I'm sure that's a fairly common situation anong the "million worlds" of the Imperium...

You have the Temple Tendancy working to undermine the Ecclesiarchy, although they aren't really a distinct religion as such but more a true heresy.