Hi,

The Salamander Tech-marine in my kill-team just asked for a Thunderfire cannon ...

i sat down and came up with the following stats and would like to hear your comments:

Thunderfire Cannon
Type: Self-propelled Artillery Tactical Speed: 6m
Cruising Speed: 9kp/h Manoeuvrability: +0
Structural Integrity: 10 Size: Hulking
Armour: Front: 14; Side: 14: Rear: 14 Carry Capacity: None
Crew: Remote Controlled Renown: Distinguished (will onyl be issued to Tech-marines)
Weapon:
Thunderfire Cannon
Range 250 Heavy -/-/4 Dmg: see ammunition 36(internal) Reload 6 Full

The Ammunition can be set to 3 different explosion Types:

Airburst 3d10+6 pen 4 Blast (6) ;ignores cover

Surface Detonation 4d10+6 pen 8 Blast (4):

Subteranean Blast 2d10+6 pen 2 Blast (2): Double dmg and penetration vs. buildings ,

nice seem well thought out and will be handy vs hordes and nids

It's good.

The only thing I find odd is the large clip, going from the model there really isn't enough space for 36 shells.

I'd drop the clip to 4 or 8 and the reload to 1full or 2full. It just seems more reasonable.

If I remember correctly, the Thunderfire Cannon in the tabletop has something like twice the range of a Heavy Bolter, so the 250m range might seem a little short. Also, a Space Marine is already Hulking in size, so I would assume the TFC to be at least one size bigger.

Yes to both of the above, it's bigger than hulking obviously, can't comment on the range from here.

It wouldn't surprise me if it needs an MIU (connected to a remote, or even a cable) to control.

It looks like it might need need to be reloaded for each shot, you could give it a rule about being reload 1full if you use a utility mechandrite and pre-clipped in 4's like the model has. It certainly doesn't look like it has a massive internal magazine and a ammo selector.

Also carrying ammo is going to be an issue, on the table top there could a truck or rhino parked next to it full of ammo, for the table top you could carry some yourself and put some on the weapon or have servitors carry the load for you.

If it's supposed to be arty, isn't the range way too short? Does it fire indirectly? Even a light mortar has more range, so don't feel constrained by the tabletop rules.

I'd double the range. At least.

Thanks all for ypur replays

Increased Size by one category; range increase proportionlay to that of the standart bolter; dramaticly reduced clip-size: added rules for the ammo-clips;

Added special rules for the controll-range and the MIU

Thunderfire Cannon
Type: Self-propelled Artillery Tactical Speed: 6m
Cruising Speed: 9kp/h Manoeuvrability: +0
Structural Integrity: 10 Size: Enormous
Armour: Front: 14; Side: 14: Rear: 14 Carry Capacity: None
Crew: Remote Controlled Renown: Distinguished (will only be issued to Tech-marines)

Special: The Remote controller needs to be within 10 meter of the cannon to move and fire it; If the controller doesn`t have an MIU he takes a -20 to attack; The Cannon can move and fire without penalty

Weapon:
Thunderfire Cannon

Range: 500m Heavy -/-/4 Dmg: see ammunition 8(internal) Reload 2 Full (1Full if you have the ammuntion pre-clipped [1 Full to pre-clip})

The Ammunition can be set to 3 different explosion Types:

Airburst 3d10+6 pen 4 Blast (6) ;ignores cover

Surface Detonation 4d10+6 pen 8 Blast (4):

Subteranean Blast 2d10+6 pen 2 Blast (2): Double dmg and penetration vs. buildings ,

Thanks for the fantastic work chap.

Do you mind if I use this rules for my campaign as well and also: do you have any idea about how many requisition points this thing should cost?

Knightmare said:

Wouldn't mind in the least, i'd even would feel a bit flattered

About the point cost: I have no idea and i couldnt test the cannon in game, because my PRg party fell apart.

At hich cost did you hand the cannon out and have you tested it already?

Shouldn't it be like any other vehicle and have it only possible if the Kill-Team leader req's it?

In this case, if the tech marine is the kill-team leader and is of Distinguished or higher level, wouldn't it be available for free as long as it's the only craft they ask for?

Hey Knightmare, awesome work man!

I'll use your stats on my campaign too.

Thanx a lot.

Changing the subject, I tried to search the stats of the Hellbrute without a success, does any one have a clue about it?

Best wishes from Brazil!

Definitely using this in mine and thank you for creating it.

One question, should the Subterranean Blast not have more penetration? I realize it jumps up to 4 against buildings, but still that seems a little low.

No?

I might also give it the Devastating quality, or at least jot that on to one of the ammo types. This weapon seems pretty **** devastating.

Renown limits WITH "only this type of character can requisition one" make me laugh. As if the Watch Commander should be telling Techmarines how to uae THEIR stuff, of which he knows nothing about; suppose that's when the Master of the Forge steps in, and enforces Renown.

Very nice block, and I'd vote for 30 Renown. It's cool, but it's not a Conversion Beamer, so I'd say less than that. It's not in the TT, but i wonder if it would be lugged around by a Combat Servitor, and manned by it, under the instruction of the Techmarine?

It... is in the TT. Techmarine controls it.

It... is in the TT. Techmarine controls it.

Apologies, i meant it isn't lugged around via servitor in the TT. In the TT, there's no question how it got there, or ot set up, and the Techmarine can handle it. In RPG, they may have to man it, rather than do cool character stuff, and think of leaving it, if they get overrun, that sort of stuff. It's also big, so I was suggesting that, in the RPG, it could maybe be hauled by a Combat Servitor, and manned by it, the Servitor, who is controlled by the Techmarine, allowing him to do all the cool stuff he might otherwise do.

It... is in the TT. Techmarine controls it.

Apologies, i meant it isn't lugged around via servitor in the TT. In the TT, there's no question how it got there, or ot set up, and the Techmarine can handle it. In RPG, they may have to man it, rather than do cool character stuff, and think of leaving it, if they get overrun, that sort of stuff. It's also big, so I was suggesting that, in the RPG, it could maybe be hauled by a Combat Servitor, and manned by it, the Servitor, who is controlled by the Techmarine, allowing him to do all the cool stuff he might otherwise do.

As a GM, I can think of any number and manner of ways to implement it in my Deathwatch game. Most likely this will be introduced as a special piece of wargear already present on the battlefield that will have to be taken advantage of by the team (Techmarine specifically); but I would consider introducing it as a piece of battle-tech that the Watch Fortress might eventually allow the Kill Team to requisition.

What I am curious about are the ammo types. I would like to come up with all manner of them. The thing that excites me the most about Deathwatch is custom gear such as this - especially homebrew ammunition. It breaks up the monotony of requisitioning the same-old gear mission after mission. I am thinking inferno rounds made specifically to combat the Tyranid menace, some sort of EMP or Haywire rounds to help against the Tau, Cryo ammunition should the Necrons become a problem, etc etc.

Renown limits WITH "only this type of character can requisition one" make me laugh. As if the Watch Commander should be telling Techmarines how to uae THEIR stuff, of which he knows nothing about; suppose that's when the Master of the Forge steps in, and enforces Renown.

Except the Watch Commander has higher authority than the Master of the Forge and a broader responsibility, so he absolutely would have a say regarding how Deathwatch vehicles are deployed.

Though I think in most cases this should be a non-issue in a game, more appropriate for a novel or if there is a PC conflict over which PC is "in charge" of the vehicle.

While I see your point, I might've more meant gear, rather than vehicles. Saying we can't borrow a landspeeder or Land Raider is one thing, and I'd agree that it is his issue; they are important, and often used by the Deathwatch. When it is something more specific, like say a Servo-Harness, or maybe a Conversion Beamer, I'd argue that he can just keep his head in his bucket; HE can't even use those on the battlefield. Granted, the system leaves requisition vague enough that it isn't specific who turned you down, so it's not always "the Watch Commander is a prick", or something silly. Still, when there can't be THAT MANY Techmarines around, and out on a mission, it shouldn't always be so **** hard for them to get THEIR cool stuff.

I can't say anyone else really gets it easier, so I'm not trying to just whine about the system; it's just always an angle of gearing up that irritates me in games. No non-Psyker should have a say if a Librarian gets his Force Sword, Psychic Hood, or whatever, even if he's in charge, or keep the Techmarines from TM-only gear. Like most other "40K folks in charge", he can delegate to more reasonable choices of gear gatekeepers, and run the show, as a whole.

Changing the subject, I tried to search the stats of the Hellbrute without a success, does any one have a clue about it?

Best wishes from Brazil!

There are stats for the hel(l)brute in both Black Crusade and Only War. If I remember correctly, posting copies of FFG's published work is... frowned upon. Since it is essentially a Chaos Dread, the statline should be very much like the Astartes Dread, only with a very real chance of going insane every round.

Cheers,

- V.

As a super aside, are there any stats for Ork Mekks anywhere?

I ended up just creating a hybrid based off of Meganob stats in Mark of the Xenos. It would be nice to have something solid to refer to though.

Hey Guys,

have been asent from this forum for quiet some time.

The " will only be issued to Tech-marines " has 3 reasons for me:

1. Only Tech-marines have the knowledge to operate and care for such an aracane device

2. I wouldn't like to have my whole squad luggin' artillery about

3. In the TT it's Tech-marine only

One question, should the Subterranean Blast not have more penetration? I realize it jumps up to 4 against buildings, but still that seems a little low.

You are right, i upgraded it on the fly to "double damge and pen 6 against buildings.

The stats are just fine and work for play, however, they are not consistent with other DW stats when comparing to the tabletop . If one does not care about that, they probably work very well and one can safely ignore what I say below.

However, if one compares the DW stats to the TT, one finds that the surface mode is even slightly more powerful than a Krak Missile in DW. A S8 AP3 weapon in TT versus S6 AP 5. Also, the cadence is too low in comparison. It should have a similar ROF as Heavy Bolter - so a ROF of 5 to 7.

For reference, have a look at:

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/37819-adjusting-dw-weapon-stats-more-to-the-40k-tabletop-stats/

To clarify: this isn't a "you should use this, this is the only right way". It's more a "FFG translated these stats from the TT roughly into these values; do the same if you want relative consistency in comparison to the TT".

Note that these stats are pre-errata (though the errata didn't change that much about it) and that FFG adopted things suggested here in the errata (like HB ROF of 6).

Also I have 2 questions regarding the TC use in a RPG:

A. Would you think that the Full-Auto rules apply? I am not sure. It's something one would have to think through carefully because the TC operates very differently from an automatic rifle... there's probably pros and cons.

B. Don't you think the TC might take a full turn to prepare a firing position? Again, I am not sure about this.

Alex

I totally forgot about this. Playing a PbP, I have not had a chance to implement this yet. But I can see a certain nid invasion and Astartes Chapter in need of support who just lost their techmarine where this could come in super handy.

Kill.