On p136 of Edge of the Abyss it is mentioned how one NPC plunged a black crystal shard in the heart of his adversary. That man was then transformed in a vile blasphemity with alien hungers. The shard was a halo artefact. It is then mentioned that the artefact comes from the Yu'vath.

As far as I'm aware, there has not yet been an official link between Halo Artefacts and the Yu'vath. Or did I miss that one? I am more familiar with Dark Heresy than with Rogue Trader.

Curious to your views!

As far as i know it has not yet been revealed what alien civilization is responsible for Halo Artifacts, be it Yu'Vath or any other.

Personally i read that bit as stating that the specific Halo artefact was found in a Yu'Vath treasure trove. Though the Yu'vath aren't a bad choice to be the creators of the halo artefacts imo.

I always thought that they came from the Yu'vath since the demo adventures. As far as I remember the Halo artefact from the first introductory adventure (or whatever powers it set free) sent the ship into a Yu'vath trap in the second adventure.

I made a more elaborate post about this some time ago, let me see how well I can do it here.

"Halo Device" or "Halo Artefact" is a catch-all term for dark devices originating from the Halo stars. So far there are at least two different kinds:

1) Yu'vath devices these aretefacts were clearly and certainly created by the Yu'vath and are amonst the kind of devices constructed by that fell race known as "Dark Energy Constructs". the only so far known examble of Yu'vath Halo Devices is called a Psycharus Worm a glistening black brass maggot-like creation that take over a host with a strong connection to the warp (like a psyker or navigator) and starts to reanimate the dead and genenrate a powerful warp field to protect its bearer. these devices like all Yu'vath constructs are tightly connected to the warp.

2) The Halo Devices most often found in Calixis (or rather brought to calixis from the Halo Stars) are of another type entirely. Of unknown origin these can take various forms but are ussially small and inconspicuous. These devices are at least somewhat sentient and can bond to any bearer (unlike Yu'vath devices that require a strong warp connection) and in fact never bonds with a psyker or person with other unnusual properties (people with Dark Pacts, Untouchables, possessed etc.) as the device will tolerate no master or influence but itself. the device then starts to slowly transform the bearer into something else while bestowing wondrous and terrible abilities and transformations. Unlike the Yu'vath devices these Halo Devices however seems to have nothing to do with the warp or its denizens.

The Halo Devices in DoDG are described as coming from a long dead civilisation. One that died long before the Imperium existed, probably before mankind, maybe a civilisation that pre-dated the Eldar. Which rules out the Yu'vath, as they were wiped out by the Imperium relativity recently. But these are only one kind of halo device.

This is a good point. The Yu'vath do have a history of enslaving humans to do their bidding. However, I feel that "Halo device" is such a generic sounding term that they could have multiple sources. That, or perhaps they were ancient artifacts that were recovered by the Yu'vath. They would certainly have been interested in such devices if they found them.

The Halo Stars are the oldest stars in a galaxy which is about 13.8billion years old, compared to earth's solar system which is headed out towards the edge of the Milky Way that is 4.6 billion years old (depending on the source) ...so you're looking at whatever species created them being very ancient ones indeed. To the point I doubt something like the Yu'Vath which was only (probably) exterminated a few thousand years ago being the culprits unless they wandered very far away from their foundings.

Earth as a generalisation is out on the last 1/4 of the Milky Way disk and its still another 1000 light years to the edge of the galactic disk and the Halo Stars aren't actually part of the disk, thinking in 3D, they're surrounding the galaxy in a large oblong shape which is roughly 2500-3000 light years from the centre of the galaxy's bulge in the middle.

They really could have come from any species that far out about 3 x the age of the solar system.

Its a big place, quite humbling really!

I always assumed they cam from the Yu'vath in this part of the setting at least.

OTOH maybe it just describes their location and thats it. You could have a Halo artefact from the Stryxis, if you find it in the Halo stars.

Beyond that, maybe its just dishwashers created by the old ones. And no one knows how they work nowadays.

Bilateralrope said:

I agree. Plus, DotDG says that Halo Devices can't bond with psykers/sorcerers, and the Yu'vath were Chaos worshippers, so it would seem contradictory.

If I had to guess, I'd say C'tan...

Adeptus-B said:

I doubt it as there is several references to the fact that whatever race created them are now long dead (and we know that at least four C'tans are very much alive) and the Halo Devices bond with humans and then biologically transform them into monsters with does not match the C'tan's MO. As they seem to work with technology and such things as breaking and manpulating the laws of physics. The only place where the C'tans have meddled in biology was when implanting the Pariah Gene in the human genepool.

and it does not say that the Halo Devices cannot bond with Psykers but that they will not, indicating some form of sentience. Also a human in the Tertirary Phase is discrped as "the mind that once spiralled towards madness is gone and in its place is something else. It is something formed from an unholy union of intellects..." a posibility as that the Halo Devices is either a sentient entity or a gastalt union of several entities that take over the person with which they are bonded and while such a creation is not outside of what the C'tans are capable of it it does in no way match how they seem to operate.

Acernis Taine said:

where do you have that from?

Badlapje said:

That they have meddled or that that is the only time?

The information is more of a deduction than a specifically stated fact:

1) Those humans that are known as Untouchables carry the Pariah Gene which somehow courses them to have no soul as well as no pressence in the warp, this not only makes them completely immune to psychic and daemonic attack and phenomena but also distrupts any such activity in their vicinity. the new generation elite Necrons are know as Pariahs and it is expresively stated that the Necrons uses untouchable humens to turn them into these Pariahs.

2) The fact that it is the C'tan that planted the gene in the human genepool is indirectly stated by an Eldar Farsser in the Necron Codex, after he has hunted the Culexus Assassin Temple (the Culexus are Officio Assassinorum Operatives that carry the Pariah Gene and are thus untouchables). As he finds the temple he is about to order its destrcution but lets his mind scan the visions of the furture to see what consequeses would arise from the temple's destruction, he expects to seee a future of joy and free from these horrible abomination instead he sees only the destruction of his own Craftworld. He then turns his fleet away from the planet he has found while he contemplates what his vision showed him:

"How could the execution of the Mon-keight temple destroy Alaitoc? If it was within the power of the Imperials to destroy Alaitoc then they would have already done it for no purpose other than their ignorant hatred. The anwser must lie in the origin of the Culexus . Alladrios has walked many paths in his span and knew secrets that were otherwise the province of the Black Library alone.... Long ago, before the Fall, the Mon-kiegh were nothing .... that was before the God War between the C'tan-led Necrons and the Old Ones, supported by their successor races, had almost consumed the galaxy. in the aftermath of the conflict many worlds were devastated, and it took time to rebuild them. In this power vacum the lesser creations of the Old Ones, such as the Mon-keigh, developed in unforseeable ways... the Eldar had let them be, perhaps they were reluctant to harm what little life remained , but others were not. Legends said that the Devoured Ones had sown are terrible crop in ages past . Now it was growing to fruition and the harvesters were being readied"

the Devoured Ones are another Eldar term for the C'tan as explained elswhere in the codex. well that took longer than expected but there you do.

thanx for the info. I'm not convinced though.

That line from the necron codex can mean pretty much anything. It could simply mean that they increased the intelligence of the mon'keigh in order to make the souls taste all the sweeter once the C'tan come back out of stasis and start harvesting. The Pariah gene is clearly not even dominant and is described as perhaps one person per world per generation having it. Blanks are a bit more numerous but even then not very much. That's not really the makings of a vast and powerfull army.

One thing that i always find fascinating when 40k talks about Pariahs is that they are described as having no soul. Even in the secular imperium when the God-Emperor still walked around and tried to convince people that religion was just superstition they used that description. A highly religious description that basically says nothing of note in the 40k universe.

As far as i can gather the only thing a "soul" can mean in the 40k universe is the connection of most things to the warp. So in that sense they'd be correct to describe a pariah as soulless. However, if you look at the religious connotations of the word soul then i can't for the life of me fathom how they could be right.

When he talk about the origins of the culexus which amount to the same thing as saying the origins of unthouchables and then say how the C'tan planted a terrible crop in humanity?.

I doupt that an Eldar Farseer would dread and describe something that would make humans taste better to be a terror, but he has just mentioned what a horrible abomination blanks are. But of course untill it says black on white *the C'tans planted the pariah gene that makes some humans untouchable in the human genepool* it will always be open to interpretation.

But why else would such a story even be in the Necrons codex (and the full story takes up about two pages) if there were to no other purpose than saying well C'tan like to munch on humans? and that is not even hinted in that text.

About rarity it is mention that one human in every million is a psyker and one human in every billion is an untouchable, approxiamtely.

The necrons and C'tans are the epitomi of ageless patience, the Pariahs might not even need to be an army or perhaps many more blanks exists than humanity is aware of, as the only way humans can discover one is for a psyker to come into contact with him or her, their rarity might not even be an issure to the necrons, they likely have ways of tracking down untouchables that humans have not. And well in galactic terms in the current timeline necrons have barely been active for more than a few hundred years (or begun awakening in mass) and already dozens of tombworlds spots one or more groups of Pariahs.

"Now it was growing to fruitin and the harvesters are being readied" could easily mean that the pariahs gene have begone to riped in the human genepool so to speak and that it has either reached a suffifient nummber of potency to begun being used.

Well no matter how much I would love to discuss about the Necrons and C'tan perhaps we should get back to the Halo Devices?

all good points. Hm, i'll have to pounder this over as my current character is actually trying to create untouchables in order to combat chaos O.o (he's a genetor).

But yeah, back on topic.

Badlapje said:

Considering that 1 million space marines are enough for a relatively vast (as in present on most important battlefields) and all powerful army for 40k.

Yeah interpreted within the 40k internal logic, it is enough for an all powerful army.

(The real world would scoff at the insignificant number of forces, if 10% of the Space marine chapters would try to conquer this world, but thats 40k....)

Adeptus-B said:

Bilateralrope said:

The Halo Devices in DoDG are described as coming from a long dead civilisation. One that died long before the Imperium existed, probably before mankind, maybe a civilisation that pre-dated the Eldar. Which rules out the Yu'vath, as they were wiped out by the Imperium relativity recently. But these are only one kind of halo device.

they have said únknown race (probly dead, but don`t know for sure)

I agree. Plus, DotDG says that Halo Devices can't bond with psykers/sorcerers, and the Yu'vath were Chaos worshippers, so it would seem contradictory.

one type doesn`t have too mean the only type

If I had to guess, I'd say C'tan...

posibaly, we as player know there out there and all time stamps in ffg are befor the necron showed up, so ya its posibal

I doubt it as there is several references to the fact that whatever race created them are now long dead (and we know that at least four C'tans are very much alive) and the Halo Devices bond with humans and then biologically transform them into monsters with does not match the C'tan's MO. As they seem to work with technology and such things as breaking and manpulating the laws of physics. The only place where the C'tans have meddled in biology was when implanting the Pariah Gene in the human genepool.

again player knowlege is not charater knowlege, and how do you know they have or have not. the bonding thing sounds like wierd teck too me right up there ally (but hey your gm might say its something totaly difrant)

and it does not say that the Halo Devices cannot bond with Psykers but that they will not, indicating some form of sentience. Also a human in the Tertirary Phase is discrped as "the mind that once spiralled towards madness is gone and in its place is something else. It is something formed from an unholy union of intellects..." a posibility as that the Halo Devices is either a sentient entity or a gastalt union of several entities that take over the person with which they are bonded and while such a creation is not outside of what the C'tans are capable of it it does in no way match how they seem to operate.

seem too operate means there a plan behind it. what if its just a bit of random teck ppl find, have no clue what it is and try it and oops there your bonded with it. i`m not saying there no other posibal race or races it could be (becaus halo atifact is realy general) it doesn`t have too be just one race