This rundown by "InActionMan" on aintitcoolnews is the best summary I've seen. I've clipped some commentary out of it a bit.

-The knowledge of the creation of humans/Cylons is not completely known to the final 5 (6?) Cylons. They do know that:
- The thirteenth tribe of all Cylons left Kobol thousands of years ago for a planet they called "Earth".

The twelve tribes of humans left Kobol thousands of years ago for the colonies.

-The humanoid Cylons on Earth gave up resurrection for procreation.

-The humanoid Cylons on Earth created mechanical Cylons to be slaves to do the dirty jobs they did not want to do. The mechanical earth colons rebelled and apparently destroyed themselves and the humanoid Cylons on "Earth"

-The five humanoid Cylons on "Earth" rediscovered resurrection technology and used it to survive the holocaust on "Earth".

-The “Final Five” then traveled to the colonies without FTL technology to try to warn the 12 colonies not to build robots and repeat the cycle. Which took the “Final Five” thousands of years.

This is the part that probably went over the heads of most of the general audience. Less of a problem for us geeks, but Moore and company really should know that most people do not have even a basic understanding of general relativity. For a guy who keeps saying that he is trying to make a science fiction show that is accessible for the general public that is a major blunder.

For anyone that does not know about Einstein’s Theory of Relativity here is my best layman’s explanation:

One of the things Einstein says is that time is not a constant. Time is in fact "relative" or changeable and can be warped or adjusted by mass. When a spaceship starts to move faster and faster toward the speed of light it becomes more massive (i.e. heavy) this causes time to slow down. This slow down of time is not perceptible to the person on the space ship but, from the perspective of someone standing on a planet the spaceship person would seem to be moving very slowly. So it took the “Final Five” thousands of years from our perspective or the perspective of someone on a planet to travel from "Earth to the colonies. From the perspective of the five because time moved slower for them in their spaceship and it took years but not thousands of years to reach the colonies.

The “Final Five” arrived at the colonies too late to stop the colonist from creating robot Cylons and the war was already under way. The “Final Five” convinced the mechanical colony Cylons to stop the war in exchange for giving them “skinjob” technology and resurrection. The “Final Five” however did not teach the colony Cylons how resurrection actually worked. Ellen also apparently placed an “Easter Egg” about the “Final Five” into the resurrection process.

John/Cavil became angry because he felt that his humanoid body was limiting and because he was jealous that he was not Ellen’s favorite. Cavil killed the Sevens/Daniels. Killed the “Final Five” and allowed them to resurrect into new bodies with their memories wiped and deposited them in the colonies one by one over the last forty years. He wiped any knowledge of the “Final Five” from the memories of the 2s, 3s, 4s, 5s, 6s and 8s.

<snip some commentary unrelated to the rundown>

Finally apparently the colony mechanical Cylons came up with the idea of monotheism and the true nature of God and his hand in events has yet to be revealed.

How do we know that John/Cavil's change the Daniel #7's ambiotic (?) fluid didn't at some point change the dna makeup of #7, and eventually create a Danielle? After all, something has to account for Starbuck here, somewhere.

Nick, John didn't allow Ellen to keep her memories. She didn't get them back until she resurrected after Saul killed her. At least, that was the impression I got. I think his hope was that eventually the Final Five would all die, then be resurrected and decide that they were wrong about being "flash and blood" all this time.

And didn't they make reference at one time about the One True God being a centurion thing? The "revelation" didn't strike me as earth shattereing, because somehow I seemed to know it already. Or perhaps I subconsciouly figured it out through some things that were said.

I like this think of this as the Feast For Crows episode. Not much happeneing, but a set-up for the events to come. And I kept thinking about Matrix Reloaded. So much stuff gets dropped on you that you have to watch it a second time for all of it to sink in and organize itself (btw, I loved the Matrix trilogy, so this is in no way an insult in my mind).

Kennon--I too had a date that night (since my wife and I both ad to work on Saturday). That is why dvr is one of the best media inventions. I can set it up to record every episode and forget about it. Sci-Fi Rewind, though, works as well (that is how Nick-ler is watching the shows).

Simply amazing episode.

Mind blowing, revelatory, expansive - simply incredible.

So much now is clear, and I can sympathize with the Final Five. Like tamsyn, I initally had a lot of toruble with teh reveal and the identity of teh Final Five, but its paying dividends now. I still despise Cavil, Six and most of the other eight (along with all the centurions and raiders) but it looks like someone programmed the First Five in a thoughtful and useful manner. Maybe some sort of co-existence will eb possible in teh end.

And geez can someone stop Adama before he gives the whole fleet over to teh Cylons? Now he is turning Galactica itself into a Cylon of sorts. I knwo he loves the ship - but sometimes we have to let things go to be true to our principles. Once again, he disappointed me.

Great episode though. I'm going to really miss this show.

Hey all!

Firstly, on missing an episode. If you happen to miss the original airing, Sci-Fi replays the episode exactly 2 hours later. It's also available online the following day at www.scifi.com .

Last week's episode was definately a major revelation episode and certainly sets up this week's episode as a big-time follow up. I read that Ellen and John Cavil will be having more screen time in the next several episodes, so that's really saying something.

Anyone thinking that the series will end with the Cylons and the Humans colonizing a new planet (possibly Kobol) and starting the cycle over again?

-Ken

Fraak, couldn't stop myself from reading the spoilers. Tomorrow night I'll catch up.

Can we get back to talking about Starbuck (the best char obviously)?

tamsyn said:

Hey, we all know that Helo is the best character.

Oh, wait, are we talking the show or the game?

And I'm still curious to learn if it is possible that Daniel could have become a Danielle. Though that still wouldn't explain how Starbuck ended up in a new Viper, without her memories. Unless Ellen got ahold of her on the ResShip before John Cavil...

And Adama. Adama loves his ship. He trusts Tigh and Chief. His belief has sustained him thus far, and he is acting on his beliefs and trust. That is why he is allowing so much cylon tech into his fleet. At some point we will either learn that everyone is a cylon, or that the cylons and humans worked together at some point in the past, or...something. I don't know. There are so many possibilites in the series right now.

And, frankly, if Ellen and Boomer know how to find the Fleet, can Cavil and Co. be far behind?

Haha, for those who asked, the date went well. I'm sure we'll be out again sometime soon. Too bad Friday night is BSG night and Saturday night is AGOT. I'm screwed either way!

Lol, also, I did have it DVRed. We've been having little parties each Friday and the other watchers were out of town Friday anyway, so we just watched it tonight before Heroes.

Wow. They really are doing a superb job of tying this all together. I hate to admit it, but I was pretty scared...

About Adama letting Chief bring the Cylon bio-tech on board, maybe it's not so much Adama loosing it as finally making his own painful, halting steps towards reconcilliation. We've already seen how difficult it was for him to forgive Tigh, and this episode we saw him accept Chief, then almost immediately ask for the work crews to be exclusively human. I think he's trying, but it's hard to break years and years of feeling.

Stag Lord said:

It's a very common theme of science fiction, and a favorite of mine to see explored: the whole "at what point does your creation gain rights or sentience or the blessings of humanity."

Look at the old "toasters" even. We think them dumb robots, but they aspire. Hence the war. Hence the creation of the hybrids. Hence the deal they cut with the five. Hence their One True God.

Clearly Cavil does have a point about the grudge he has on his "centurion side of the family." They rebelled, and I really can't blame them. Creating an intelligence and making it a slave race for your wars and dirty jobs is not "moral." Not with centuians. Not with clone troopers.

I personally don't think the cylons would have created other cylons to do their dirty work. We don't create kids to do ours....

hmmm, ok. maybe some people do.

anyway, they are supposed to be enlightened and futuristic and surely not happy about being slaves themselves.

Eh. Yes quite a bit happened, but still I'd judge that a "filler" episode... and that's just inexcusable this close to the end!

Some good stuff, and superb acting, but not very good.

Here's hoping the utter lack of any action/battles/etc. these past two eps is letting them go nutso at the end!

I really enjoyed this episode. Apollo has been my favorite character for some time now, with Tigh in a close second, but it's getting harder and harder to keep Tigh in second place. I might have to reevaluate that.

Any thoughts on the "gods" now that we know Baltar is still seeing "Caprica?" A thought that I started bouncing off of some friends last night ties in with common theories now that there are no true humans in the fleet and that everyone we see is actually a form of Cylon, even though their race may have forgotten a few thousand years ago. What if the "gods" or possibly "Lord of Kobol" are actually the only true humans in the series?

Kennon said:

In a just world, Michael Hogan would be getting an Emmy, but he won't even be nominated.

I hate the Hollywood award shows.

madkasel said:

Too Frackin True! I also think Dean Stockwell (Brother Cavel) deserves a nod. His acting has been fantastic (see "No Exit").

I continue to be disappointed in how Adama's character contiinues to compromise and abandon his principles - ulness his priniples were always about hsi ship and his survival. At least tigh called him on it when they were drinking together.

And i agree - teh tigh character is extremely well acted and the most interesting character left. Like Kennon, i like apollo a lot too, and my hope for the final epdiodes is that Lee steps up, relegates his fatehr to the retirement yard, and takes the steps necessary to presevre humanity. He cna start with shipping the Cylons back to wherever they want to go and maybe finding some planets to settle.

The fact that the Caprica six model is still walking aorund on a Colonial military vessel galls me no end.

So nice to see that you are staying consistent Stags.

I'm starting to see things the way that Tigh put them: Pure human doesn't work, pure cylon doesn't work. The future involves co-operation. yet with only 4 episodes left, I'm afraid they won't have the time to tell the rest of the story. Or that I'll be disappointed. I want some sort of major action event to occur -- there are still the cylons out there who want to destroy the fleet, and that is going to come to one hell of an end. Either that, or the show is going to go all "Needless Things" on us, and that'll probably make me disappointed by the whole series.

What are the chances the last episode or two might be two-hours long?

So what are the mysteries left to be resolved?

1) Kara's origins/nature (though we're made to assume the lost "Daniel" line of Cylons was her)?

2) What'll happen to Cavel and the last Cylons.

3) Whether they'll find habitation.

4) If the "gods" are still out there.

5) Why Xena Warrior Princess saw the final 5 in the Temple of the Ancients.

6) The significance of "Hera".

Others?

Will the humans and cylons be able to live together? Honestly this is a big deal (as Stags like to point out). Even here on the foums there are people who side strongly on one side or the other of that debate, and it is reflected on the show -- otherwise, why were there so many people who were willing to go with Gaeta and Zarek.

Baltar and his followers -- what is going to happen here? Is Baltar going to be betrayed by one of his own? How are they going to feel about cooperation with the cylons. What role will Baltar hold in the future?

I see the end of the Adama/Roslin reign approaching. They are both weary of the burdens they have carried for so long, and are ready for rest. Roslin has already abdicated most of her authority to Lee, and Bill just needs to find someone to turn command over to. Tigh is perhaps the logical choice, if he wants to foster community between humans and cylons, but he is getting on in years as well, and most likely would turn things over to a younger commander. With Lee being a politican and not military anymore, it makes this choice that much harder.

Will Roslin die before the end of the season? She's supposed to have terminal cancer, how long will she live? Who else is likely to die before the show ends?

And one other question -- is it possible that the writers might film an ending where the cylons actually win? Doubtful. But will they leave the story still somewhat open for future BSG movies? Sci Fi likes to do that with their properties, but we better at least get some closure to the major stories.

JerusalemJones said:

My wife is convinced at this point that the show will end with the fleet floating off into space, and a character narrating these words: "This has all happened before, and it will all happen again."

jmccarthy said:

I could see that happening, but it would totally blow (pardon the French).

I forgot to mention another mystery I'd like disclosed: Why Baltar and Caprica Six had (schizophrenic?) versions of each other that give them guidance...

My best guess on Baltar and Caprica's visions is that they really are "god" or "gods." I'm thinking that aside from that, everyone we've seen on the show so far is a Cylon in one form or another and that the possibly divine being(s) are the only "humans" that are actually left at this point.

So, thought's on last night's episode? Was I the only one that thought Hera's drawing being music was a bit telegraphed? As soon as she handed it to Kara at the beginning of the episode, I knew what it was. And I was pretty certain of what the song was as well. Granted, with Kara's playing it to me a little bit to recognize it for sure.... Still, it seemed telegraphed pretty hard that she was just imagining the other piano player and that it was her father. It all seemed very predictable, but I very much liked it. So, what does her knowledge of the song bode for everything else?

In other news, Boomer is a dirty *****.

But at least this gives us a reason to have the other Cyclons enter the main story again.

Kennon said:

I had some crazy idea that her mother was actually an older version of her. Not too sure if that theory has any weight to it, but I thought it interesting to think about.

(and yes the piano and the song did seem forced... still didn't ruin the episode though)

Kennon said:

I can honestly say I did not see Boomer going all double agent, though in watching the show to this point I am dissapointed I didn't.

Overall good episode, can't wait to see Adama freaking over Rosyln

All I can say - is that I was screaming four years ago that Chief shodl have been airlocked - after he killed the Cylons they were going to use the doomsday virus on. Now Galataica is fatally daamged becuase this guy cannot, for one frakking second, put his duty and his reponsibility to teh fleet ahead of his personal feelings.

Gee - he sure jumped at the chance to pump Cylon goo itno Galataica though didn't he? I'm so done with him.

Was I supposed to feel sorry for him running through his empty house there at the end? was i supposed to be rooting for Roslin and Adama to go all wishy washy and commutes Boomer's sentence (tjough wiht teh way these wrtiers are going - i am surprised tehy didn't).

Good riddance and I hope they find out that he let her out and they finally shoot this guy into space - Final Five or no. They can just reaplce him in their littel clique with Starbuck.

And yes - i kidna figured the drawing was notes, but I idn't pick up that she was imagining her father. guess this settles the mystery of the missing seventh model. I wonder what that makes Thrace exactly - I guess she's some sort of hybrid. I guess she will be the hope of reconciliation between the races, who once was such an ardent foe of the enemy. kidna cool.

i do like the way they are wrapping this stuff all up.

Ah, but if Kara's Dad played "All Along the Watchtower" for her, wouldn't that make her dad the Daniel model? That would make Starbuck half human/half-cylon, right? And, it still does not explain her resurrection on Earth.

And, really, what does a Bob Dylan song have to do with the cylons and all this stuff?

Chief really screwed the pooch here, and I'm pretty sure that the fact Boomer took Hera will cause him to admit his part in freeing her. Whether he'll get airlocked, or end up dying somehow in the upcoming showdown with the rest of the cylons remains to be seen. Personally, if I were Helo I'd beat him to death for what he did, so I think that's the line I hope the writers take. It would also be poetic justice for Chief, given his history.

Gods, Helo. Imagine the guilt he's got to be going through now, knowing he frakked Boomer instead of Athena, then afterwards she steals his daughter. Holy frak, that guy is going to have some serious issues. Makes me wish there was more than 3 episodes. I don't want this show to end.

I agree JJ - and good analysis on helo. I do feel bad for that guy, even if I don't fully agree with soem of his decisions.

And yes - I was probably unclear above, but I think kara is a hybrid and her father was the 7 model. Kara and tigh - two of the most violently anti Cylon characters will bridge the gap between humans and the murderous robots in a paean to tolerance and acceptance, when this wraps up.

What i like most about the Kara as hybrid theory is that it makes the abduction of Hera...pointless. You look at everything that Cavil and Boomer organized to steal that child, and there is already living proof that cylons and humans can reproduce, and it has been around for decades. Totally priceless. Completely fraks with the cylon plan -- whatever it may be.

I love that Tigh is still totally committed to the humans, and the old man. He's not letting his cylon-ness affect that. Whether his is a bridge character remains to be seen -- I'm not convinced his relationship with 6 was about bridging the cylon gap, but more about his inner demons about killing his wife, and whatever subconscious memories he has about the final five and his wife. Sure, the fact she got pregnant with his child means something. But if the Final Five and the cylons can reproduce, what does that have to do with the abduction of Hera? Is it possible that the so-called "cylon" baby wasn't?