I soloed this scenario over the Pentecost weekend and since I haven't come across any other AARs or any comments whatsoever for that matter, I thought I might write down some comments here.

Pros:

* It's an interesting map lay-out and unit set-upwith the Russians closing in on the German positions from two directions.

* It's relatively quick to set up. No terrain overlays nor entrenchments, barbed wire etc. are required. Further there are no reinforcements of any kind meaning that as the game progresses turns will tend to end ever more quickly, so all in all it's a fast paced scenario.

Cons:

* Again, I'm not sure about the balance. It seems to strongly favor the Russians. I'll have to replay it, but the Russians had twelve (mostly intact) units left by the middle of the sixth action phase. At that point there wasn't a single German unit left on the board. So Two and a half turns left to occupy (or is moving through actually enough?!) the remaining two building hexes not yet under Russian control. As I said, I'll need to try another strategy for the Germans, but to have THIS many Russians left and not a single German and then still have time to spare...Things will have to go REALLY differently to achieve a German win...

I feel the actual or perceived imbalance is mostly created by two things:

* The immense power of the SU 122. Once it's in postion (or even with a fire and move which is officially not disallowed, though we often houserule non-turreted vehicles so that they're not allowed to make any such attacks) any German (MG) squad woudl be foolish to stay on Op-fire in a building hex (13 dice, 7 with a fire and-move. And then its range: 10...Point made, I suppose).

* I simply left my Russian squads advancing from the South in place thereby being immune to any German MGs in op-fire until the SU 122 had either eliminated them or scared them away. Also, one of the T34s advancing from the North had occupied a hill hex thereby also procuring LOS and a 9 die attack against the German MG originally in that position. The Russian infantry simply waited two turns. Normally, if they'd started moving on turn 1, the MGs would have caused 1 casualty per two moving squads on average.

What I might try next time is to replace the SU 122 with a T34. Since I have the feeling rather sizeable forces are being represented in the scenario, this would probably be more fitting as well. Another option might be to add a PAK 40 to the German forces that could help keep the SU 122 at bay somewhat longer. The simplest solution might be to have the scenario last 6 turns, perhaps seven rather than eight. It would force the Russians to play really aggressively, which might give the Germans a better chance to win.

Any other experiences with this scenario?

BTW, I think I followed the hint provided by the designer. I set up the hidden squads (AT) in blind spots so they couldn't be seen. One managed to lightly damage a T34. That was only because I wanted it to fire a shot (only one figure left, it was in the open. Infantry had mostly dealt with it already). Four dice, three hits, but two saves as well (armor 5 + two cover from woods).

I soloed this one, and got excactly the same game as you are describing. But I figured, this one is a puzzle. How can one win as the germans?

1) The germans cannot setup ANY infanteri in line of sight of the SU-122. If they do they are dead.

2) If the SU-122 gets line of sight blind hexes behind the closest building, its game set match. The only way to stop it is to heavily damge the SU-122 before it gets into position. Thus, you have to set up a hiden bazooka squad in that building, and hope he is capable of heavily damaging the SU-122 in time. Even a heavily damage SU-122 can roll 7dices versus the infanteri in the buildings. Thus, you cannot allow the SU-122 to get in line of sight to any other german infanteri.

Ofcourse, the bazooka will be a suicidal thing. It will be killed momentarily. But it is the only solution. Ofcourse for this to work, the russians must be rushing towards your ambush.

3) For the southeast side it is slightly easier as you have woods which gives you some protections. I guess that seting up a marchine gun behind line of sight is the thing to do. The bazooka I'm more uncertain about. Should it be concealed infront and wait for the russian tanks to move forwards, or should it be put behind and wait for the russians to move forwards. You could also ofcourse set-up the bazookas behind and set another dummy infanteri concealed infornt.

Regardless, if you keep your MG intact AND have taken care of the TWO T34, the german can win.

Well the scenario is working right then the Russians should win most often.I actually had it end at 6 Rounds the First few playings and moved it to 8 for the last tests. the scenario is based on an encounter i read in The Korsun Pocket by Zetterling and the German defenders had no at-guns available.

BJaffe01

Grand Stone said:

Grand Stone said:

Grand Stone said:

No matter where you set up your Germans, the Russians can always soften them up from say 5 hexes away and only then move in with their infantry. Not that it appears to be really necessary to be overly careful, because the Russians simply have time to spare to achieve their objectives. Also, there's no way you'll keep your MGs alive longer than say three turns, unless you do place them out of LOS but then they won't be doing any shooting either, i.e. they'll be facing all the Russian infantry and though they might then eliminate a few figurines, it'll then be game over.

Bill, do the Russians need to physically occupy all buildings to win or is moving through also sufficient?

Secondly, why did you change the number of turns from 6 to 8? 6 seems to make for a much more closely balanced scenario.

OK, if the Germans didn't have any AT capability, the PAK 40 solution is defenitely out. Guess I'll try 6 turns rather than 8 next time.

Bjaffe, I strongly disagree with that design philosophy. If one side is doomed to fail, and the other is doomed to win, then its no fun for either side, and perferably the odds of winning should not deviate far from 50/50. If you want to describe a stronger force versus a smaller force, please atleast make the victory condition harsh and give them short time.

I'm okay with introducing puzzle scenarios where the chalenge is 'to win as the germans'. However then it should be a clear warning stating that its not balanced, and that its intended as a puzzle. This should be stated clear and obvius in the scenario, and not a side note which is easy to skip. Cuz if your not prepered, its not even remotly fun.

For the germans to win this one, they have to destroy or heavily damage the SU-122 with a single concealed unit before it can fire a single shot at the german infanteri which should be hiding behind the houses. If the SU-122 gets of as little as two shots, it has allready killed half of the forces in that division. However, if the germans can stop the SU-122 before it does any harm, then atleast, the MG has a preaty ok probability of killing quit a few russians. Then its 3 germans versus 4 russians, and the german has cover + an MG. Preaty decent odds. This is ofcourse assuming that the defence of the other side also holds.

There is one thing about this scenario. It might be a nice introduction scenario, where the inexperienced player plays the russian and the experienced player plays the germans.

Try giving the Soviets the "Lack of Tank Radios" operation card instead of "Soviet Command Constraints" ... that should make quite a difference.

it's not so much that the Germans are doomed to fail it's just very unlikely the will win. moving it back to 6 rounds is fine. the Russians have to occupy the buildings. yeah Latro no Tank radios would certainly change things.

And the diffrence between "doomed to fail" and "unlikely to succede" is defined as? Seen from the player that never wins the scenario of course.

Latro said:

That should indeed work. the other card never came into play. Why not? Because one side has ample eiltes as well as one or two officers and on the other side of the board, they have the SU122, so no German will expose himself to it. If they should and if they should be succesful in actually pinning a squad, then there are still two officers available on that side of the board to negate the effect of "Russian command restraints".

I'll try the scenario again (one day) limiting play to six rounds AND using the "lack of tank radios op card". Hopefully that'll make for a more balanced scenario. Even though the Germans will lose the battle eventually, limitations such as a turn limt, a restriction on the number of casualties the side is allowed to suffer (not suitable/historically accurate in case of the Russians...) or exiting X units off the map etc. should make such a scenario balanced even though the sides may not be.

A final option to balance a scenario might be to let players bid. How many turns will it take you to take the village? 8,7,6,5? The one who offers the lowest bid, gets to play the russians.

If you assasinate the offisers with a sniper card, and use that concealed squad and combine it with a mortar, that might help... But yes, it requiers some setup time yes.