Cant really comment on the Seneschal (the Vm in my group rolls every knowledge roll, but cant really do his VM stuff), but the lacking Explorator simply means, that youll have to roll for Tech-Use instead of handwaving it and only counting DoS (100+ is normal here) AKA Tech-use will work as a normal skill.

Ragarding the Seneschal, i suggest doing an aquisition roll for the guy. Build a base at/near/close to Footfall and install a Seneschal there. basically a guy who deals in information and keeps tab on trade opportunities.

The group i'm GM'ing has developed a system where they regularly hire on specialists, warriors and others with skills they want to have 'around' (either as individual or group acquisitions). The best of these are inducted into a special group of bodyguards. When they go on 'away missions' squads of these bodyguards go with them. Many of the bodyguards have proven invaluable.

I allow this because it makes sense. You are supposed to be a Rogue Trader and Retinue in control of a voiship. If they were gas station attendants having minions would make little sense.

Of course if you don't go around with these fellows on your six they can hardly help. And it pays to keep them alive. So far the bodyguards have been treated to some very nice protective armour and other weapons acquired over several months.

Its worked out.

Speaking of, where in the core book do they talk about the RT and the other PCs having a number of troops following them? Because my GM tells me he saw nothing on that in the core, therefore, every time we'll go on an 'away mission' it'll only be the PCs with no guards or back-up.

We only use gurads and troops during hit &run and Boarding action he says, going on a planet, there's no rule or lines concerning going down with a platoon of armsmen.

Anyone can hlep?

Arms men are to an extent are your personal troops, you can later either hire and train a unique cadre of house troops or pick the elite from your current arms men. If you want troops that excel in boarding actions maybe look into purchasing upgrade packages for zero-G training or cross train them for fire containment.

Even if you GM rules, if you don't have it. You are the Rogue trader, Make it. If you don't have an explorator, hire one or write a letter of recommendation for one of your higher quality Engineseers. It is not the Job of the Gm to say no, as long as you can support your claim.

Braddoc said:

Common sense dictates that if you and your retinue number four people and there is a planet to be conquered you don't go down there without an army.

Your GM is being stubborn and, i'm afraid, there is no cure for that other than trying to open his eyes.

A Rogue Trader can acquire troops by the tens of thousands. Are they all to remain on the ship?

Rogue Traders do boarding actions against planets, its called a War. You send troops down and conquer. Even if you blasted their defenses apart from orbit you will need troops to mop up and occupy.

When a single Rank 5 DH Assassin can GANK a Rank 1 RT character (any of them) in one round of combat bodyguards are a absolute must.

The only problem I see is when a RT wants to take his troops everywhere. The GM needs to be practical, as does the RT. Taking troops into the wrong place can lead to problems.

bobh said:

Yeah- but it does stretch combat when the RT got 5-10 troops to move about on the grid; I think that's what he trying to not happen; 2 players waiting while the RT moves his troops around for 5-10 minutes, rolls for them etc etc..I'll try to sway him my way; mostly going down planet with troops, but they are under GM control (fighting in the background, coming in to save us if we get beaten solidly) or for damatic (like seeing one of our guy getting killed in some grimdark way as a way to open combat. Yet again, we got a VoidMaster, Arch-Militant, which I suspect will surely be one-trick ponies (all in BS, none in Fel, WP, percep, Int etc etc) so combat should not be a problem, until the GM makes us do WP tests and then everyone goes crazy but me.

I've been doing it this way:

Treat the RT troop squads as twin-linked weapons (just the +20% bonus per squad up to +60, three squads firing together) laying down fire. Assuming they all have lasguns, for example, they do

• 1d10+E S/3/-
• Their BS is 30
• Semi-Auto Burst +10BS
• A squad of 7
• Init as Squad is 1d10+3 (AG Bonus)

So the squad acts/moves as a unit, rolls an init of 7 and gets to go first. They unload on anything remotely hostile nearest to them UNLESS the commander (a RT or Lieutenant or Commisar, if you use them) tells them otherwise (Command Test with a difficulty gagued by GM - as the guysa re far more likely to save their own skin from an obvious nearby danger than do pinpoint fire against another target if they are getting charged by an ork).

Their Test target for ranged combat is a 60 normally as they fire semi-auto at the same target (if there were three squads the target would be a 100). With a max of 1 hit plus one more per two successes.

If their commander ordered them to AIM and fire single shot at a ranged target, and passed his command test, they'd be at an 80 on the target with a max of 7 hits if they rolled a 1 collectively.

Example:

A squad (7) of your House Troops (BS30,AG30,T30, Lasgun 1d10+3E, Flak Armour Ap4, 10 wounds each) is with you in a building you and your Retinue are plundering.

Your RT, always wary of losing life and limb, makes them stick close so he has a meatshield. All of the sudden a 'guardian' (Claws 1d10+1 I, Bite 1d10+3I Poison, S40U, Ag40, T40U; 20 Wounds) beast erupts from a crate and attacks the Rt and his squad - no surprise as th ebeast made plenty of noise getting out of the crate.

Your RT has a 8 init and the squad rolls a 5+3 = 8. The beast has a 1+4= 5 init. The RT orders them to fire at the beast before it can close the distance and enter melee and he unloads on it with his archeotech laspistol (or whatever). As there are no other hostile things nearby the command to fire on the beast is automatically obeyed.

The squad makes one Challenging +0 BS Test, target: 60. Roll to hit once. The RT rolls a 20 for his laspistol (hitting) and a 9 for the squad (1 hit plus another per two successes). If the lasguns fail to do more than 8 damage on each hit they will be ineffective.

Whether or not you want NPC's to do RF (Righteous Fury) is up to the Gm, I generally don't allow it unless the NPC is special (Astartes or the like).

First of all, if the RT is sensible (well we all are, arent we ), you take a small bodyguard everywhere. And when you go to a bad place, you simply take more and more troops.

Personally i handwave combat with dierolls. (bodyguards roll high, they kill stuff, if they roll low, they dont), modified for their quality (stormtroopers kill stuff on average rolls; undead monsters need to roll high).

Its not a perfect system, but as long as nobody wants a battlemap it works. When playing with a battlemap id use 40k tabletop for the mass fights.

OTOH if your GM says flat out no, you are playing Dark heresy with spaceships and not Rogue Trader.

Voronesh said:

I met my GM yesterday, and we talked about that; we concluded that the armsmen NPC are used:

1-boaridng actions

2-Hit&run

3-Bodyguards when landing on-planet; but they are under GM control, used only as a dramatic element (he read the DW Horde rules and really liked it) as background massive battles, or as helpers when we're down for the count; they'll drag us back to the ship.

As for a vessel, I think I'll go with the Frigate; I'll simply have to make a few acquisition rolls, get better quality components, and then I,ll have more space to cram additionnal component

You know.

Why do you want troops again? if they are only for the background? Although if he uses DW horde rules, they seem to be more than background.

Beyond that. Point number 3 is pretty much every time when you leave the ship.

Voronesh said:

Well, when I ran RT, 2 of the 3 plaeyrs were bored outta their asses because the RT spend 5-10 minutes moving 3-10 troops on the grid map, they have them all attack,, dodge, or fire, then roll damage etc etc......frankly, I could care less for troops; sure it 'fits' with the setting, but it simply stretch combat and makes it boring for everyone, except the RT, who gets 10 times more crap to do on his turn.

Both my GM and I are quite satisfied using troops as a backgorund item or a 'get outta trouble free' card than having each and every NPC armsmen and crew memeber having a personality, sheet, name etc etc....plus, only naturla than why your troops are shooting everywhere, you're swinging on a rope going to duel that pirate Captain

It seems to me the truly epic scale of RT encounters still has to sink in. In my view (which obviously you should not care much about, your game is your game, and it seems some of your fellow players prefer the hair raising thrill of dice rolls and fights over intrigue and empire building) Rogue Traders and their companions are far more then mere swashbucklers. They are WH40k's Cortez and Raleigh, Vasco da Gama and Houtman, carving out Empires of trade and war, intrigue and faith. Treating the staff and aides of these individuals (the other characters are no unseen nobodies either) as mere background seems such a waste to me. There is such an incredible amount of RP potential in this game, of which the PC/NPC interaction is but one element.

Furthermore, there is the logic. You can of course as Rogue Trader advance to the front in every fight. You will be heroic, an example to your men and probably die a nasty death that you thoroughly deserve for being up front all the time. If you can have hundreds and thousands at your call, getting stuck in every time seems to me....well, let me say that if I were teaching a course of Tactica Imperialis for promising officers a perfect example of how not to do things. A Rogue Trader not using all the resources he has makes my suspension of disbelief shake, and troops and NPC's are some of the prime resources a RT has. If that does not bother your group it is no problem. To me, it is vital.

If I digress a bit here, my apologies. And do not worry, there are those moments where you will have to get stuck in. They will be all the more memorable and epic then. "The Trader is at the breach! Hold the line men, we cannot falter now. For the God-Emperor, Terra and Profit!"

FvR

yet, in another way, if a Rt stays on his bridge all the time and sends the mooks down planet or into that dark Space Hulk, word of this will go out; and your RT will be branded a cowardly fool. There will be empire-building parts, but since the Arch-Militant and Void-Master Ship pilot are not social classes (played by less-than-social enclined players) I'll have my fun while they sit and watch; If they do combat-monster who can't say 'hello' without starting a fight or having people attack them, well, they should have made balanced characters rather than a one trick pony.

And we can argue that an Officer's duties (W40k-wise) is to lead by example and from the front; No admiral won a sea battle by standing at the end of the pier.

Braddoc said:

Ah theres the problem. You let the RT do everything. Thats not really how it (should personal opinion) work. The RT can use his command skill to order a few guys around specifically. Beyond that everybody else acts as the GM sees fit. If you gave the company officer an order, the company will act more or less as ordered (unless you blundered badly).

Beyond that, have your other guys use their command skill as well. Give them some guys too.

I just like it, if a battle is just that: A battle. Currently i havent had any actual ones played out yet (troops were the guys keeping the mooks off the RT and his crew), but once the RT aquires a regiment or a division, ill use mass combat rules (of some type). At that point, i dont care how well the RT does, if his troops screw up badly, hes going down. OTOH his troops are going to save his ass, if his command crew fumbles around like halfwits and the troops score really well.

In 40k true leaders, lead. Well from the front obviously. Space marines and certain IG officers do that. So i try to push the RT to do just that as well. But still, i like the troops to be a separate entitiy (which they are) instead of mere storytelling rules. (Because then it would be Ascension with mooks "kinda").

If you do want big battles without the detail of RT(a RPG), you can create a quickplay ruleset, by rolling the tens of BS/WS with a siongle D10 for every ten/hundred troops taking part in the action. If you are battlemap minded. And give every player his own command. At the same time, as the battle rages around them, the RT and his crew fight their way atop the hill protected by the elite bodyguards.

But in the end its your game. I just see so much potential in the combat scenes, that goes beyond mere personal combat, and goes right into the world war scale.

Aah, the eternal leading from the front versus leading from the rear question. It is always relative, of course, with admirals (and Rogue Traders) being in the special position that there is no rear on a battleship, everyone is in it together, at least on the ship.

Boarding and landing parties are different of course, and I did definitely not plead for staying behind on the bridge and drinking your **** Chateau Lafite. It is just picking the moment. One of my most admired examples of a leader is Jean Parisot de la Valette, Grand Master of the Order of St.John. His leadership during the siege of 1565 is a perfect illustration. On the whole, he provided the moral backbone and firm leadership. But on the vital moment, when a breach was stormed and Ottoman banners were on the walls, he led the counterattack in person, knowing that was a make or break moment.

But, it is your game. If you have two fighting only characters along...well, they will miss out on a lot, but if they have fun, that is the whole matter of RP. So do enjoy!

FvR

The group I GM runs the NPC troopies according to who is nearest to them. Along with the squad rules, no tabletop at all (we do it as a play by post on a forum) some large battle handwaiving and simplified statlines (see HERE ) for mercs and troops it works out well enough.

bobh said:

Though i would agree, at this point itd be more of a hassle than its worth.....

Ouch Braddoc, I'm so sorry you have to put up with such a GM. From what you're saying they appear to be imposing a rule, that you only have access to the abilities of your PC on a mission, with a group far too small to include all the required capabilities to be successful while also choosing to play what they want to play. As has been alluded to by previous posters some of the modules offer a number of cases where it's suggested or even expected that the PC's will be bringing armsmen with them. Including the book intro adventure.

While you can handwave their participation to some extent, if you have access to the Deathwatch horde rules that is the best way to include them without being tedious. They’re a horde centered on their leader. (And you’ve mentioned that you do have access to that.) Also, if you weren’t expected to be ordering around groups of NPCs in some tasks, WTH do you have the Command skill? You’re allowed to use any equipment you have right? Well, as a Rogue Trader your ship, its crew, and the entire dynasty are resources that belong to you; “equipment” as it were. Heck, you make acquisition rolls to get new and better crews! The necessity of this option depends on how much your GM tweaks the encounter to fit your party’s capabilities, if they tone down some of the encounters realizing there’s only 3 of you then it is less of an issue. But from what you’ve said already your GM isn’t likely to do that. If nothing else if a mission requires having some particular skill to complete, then you should have access to an NPC specialist who can do that. As has already been said any of your NPC crew is going to be much less efficient at it than a PC would have been anyway.

As for ship, whatever you do don’t take the Firestorm. Having only a single lance for your weapon means it’ll get beat by the target’s void shields every time until you do something to take those out directly. Usually a Hit and Run maneuver or a lucky crit. A torpedo launcher instead could avoid that problem because of the possibility of more than one hit in a salvo, but then you run the risk of running out of ammo. A Sword class or one of the Raider Hulls if you’re set on having a lance are a much better option for your first ship.