What are the smallest ships equipped with warp drives in the 40K universe?

What types of warp ships have the smallest crews?

Cobra-class Destroyer is the smallest ship in the Imperial Navy that's warp-capable. Has a crew of about 15,000.

Imperial, there is the Viper class scout sloop (BFK p. 28), a mere 4.9 megatonnes and 7,500 crew. In that ship, there is just about space for the plasma drive, the warp drive and essential components and then you have a bit left for weapons or extra's....but, boy, you will be fast. Much smaller then this will be very hard, as a warp drive seems to need at least a minimal amount of space, and the rest of the ship needs to be able to support it.

Friedrich van Riebeeck, Navigator Primus, Heart of the Void

One thing you really have to remember about 40k, it is not Star Wars - or its imitators - where you can simply hop in a cargo shuttle and burst across the galaxy at a moment's notice. In the Grimdark Future warp travel is serious business and the ships capable of it are massive constructs meant to transport troops, goods, military landcraft, pilgrims, etc. (or combinations of the above). Your average Star Destroyer in SW is nothing special when you compare it to the average Rogue Trader ship or Imperial Navy vessal, and as such you need to "think big". Now, if you want the PCs to be popping about in the Serenity, you could have a smaller, personal, ship being carried in the hold of the massive RT carriers and let the PCs fly off on it to explore whatever solar system the fleet has most recently sailed into. In this way you can let the RT carivan tend to itself - assuming you can trust the first officer - while the players are off visiting planets and causing mischief ... then, when they are done and the adventure over, you can have them take back to space and meet up with the carnival on its way to another remote and terrifying destination.

You CAN have the best of both worlds, you just can't really have the best of one without the other.

Jack of Tears said:

Or have that capital ship not belong to the players at all. Perhaps they will have to book passage for themselves and their intra-system vessel on Chartist freighters, Pilgrim ships, Bulk Traders, RT convoys, ...

Works much better within Imperial space than beyond, of course. Few Rogue Traders will appreciate such "parasites" accompanying their ships to make their own deals and profits, even if they pay for it and even if they're just a dozen people. Also, people will be severely limited on where they can go at what time, and what to do when they arrive. All that comes to mind would be courier or smuggling jobs, though they would have an area of business they can profit from, as the big ships that carry their short range vessel simply won't fly to every planet in the systems they travel through, yet people on some small colony will want and pay for things, too.

You could even do blockade runs to ferry illicit goods by leaving the carrier ship shortly after it has re-entered normal space but before it gets checked by Imperial authorities, then allowing the players to try and circumvent customs procedures by attempting to land not in the spaceport but somewhere else on the planet.

There's potential, if for a different kind of campaign.

Really old 40k novels also featured much smaller warp-capable ships, by the way. Inquisitor Jaq Draco had one such vessel, only manned by a crew of four (himself, his Navigator, his Squat engineer and a Callidus assassin). This was, in essence, 40k's Millennium Falcon. However, it should be noted that BL novels are not considered binding canon by GW, or that this one ship might have been just a really, really, really ancient and semi-unique relic of the Lost Age of Technology Draco was lucky to get his inquisitorial hands on. I wouldn't exactly recommend such an approach.

from france

in grey knights one of the best novel there is a even smaller ship. it s a one woman crew. a trained psycker who travel the warp to deliver a message too dangerous to be send by a astropathic methode. it s the smallest but also the fastest ship that existe. it must travel the warp quickly, so piloted by one of the best psycker available but also travel in system quickly.

it is used only in case of emerency on a entire secto fate is a stake. so maybe it is not canon but being regarded as one of the best novel it can be considered as such. after all the confirmation that the blood ravens are lost children of the original thousand sons came from a novel and is considered canon.

What kind of ships do the Space Marines use? I was under the impression they had "fast response" ships. It's strange to me that they're sending a ship with a crew of 15K to transport 30 or so marines.

jbuck said:

Thats general 40k.

If it has a warp drive, it has to be huge. So once you add all the armour, the fast plasma drive and some guns, one simply ends up with such a large vessel.

Or rather a ship wont be much smaller than a destroyer or a frigate, since thats the smallest you can get with a warp engine. Unless you have fabled archeotech available.

So even if you want to transport one guy, and dont want to pull out a "deus ex machina" device, its gonna have 15k crew in this gaming universe.

jbuck said:

Space Marines use the same types of ships as the rest of the Imperium, as far as I know. Painted in the chapter's colours and left to the chapter's sole discretion for use, of course. But the same ships. Given the nature of Warp travel I have trouble believing anyone can really claim to have a "fast response" at interstellar distances. Heck, people responding to distress calls are known to arrive centuries too late (or too early) sometimes, through no fault of their engines or navigators. That goes for everybody, including space marines. These things happen.

SMs do have Thunderbirds, which are big and impressive and speedy on the battlefield scale, but those things are no where near big enough to be Warp capable. They transport marines from the fleet to the battlefield and sometimes are used for air support. That's the closest thing to "fast response" ships I can think of, and that doesn't really apply to this conversation.

I often hear SM Strike Cruisers referenced in Novels and other such non-canon. It's safe to say that they have among the best Navigators and highest quality Warp Drives and Gellar fields to ensure as little interference as possible, as well as all the tech remaining from the founding of the Chapter. So while, as said, the Warp makes truely fast response an unreliable moniker, agents of authority like Inquisitors and Space Marines would be dramatically faster then your average craft.

You can take the system ship from the GM screen (space 25), strip it (toss the Class D Plasma Drive and put one in that we actually have stats for) and add components to make it warp capable... its small at .65 km long, 2-5 thousand crew and 4.5mt. Fun ship, tight squeeze unless you have BEST craftsmanship components though.

Found an answer I gave with a build on the system ship from a while back:

The System Ship from the GM screen adventure is 0.65 km long (650 meters) has 25 space. Feeling lucky? Find a way to shove a warp drive and geller field into it and have fun.

• Jovian Class 1 Drive (Modified), Strelov 1 Warp Engine, Geller Field, Commerce Bridge, M-1.r LS, Pressed Quarters, M-100 Auger, Single Void Shield, Main Cargo Hold (its a transport so this space is 'traditionally' already removed from the build and only power need be payed).

With a modified Drive you can fit in all of it and have a small warp ship but it is not fit for getting hit by spitballs and can't shoot back. This build leaves you 6 space and some extra power (9'ish). If you don't have the Mod drive you can't mount weapons, your choice, it has a Prow and Dorsal slot. Hmmm. unless you mount a pair of jovian missile batteries and the modified drive then itll all fit with 0 space leftover. With the above build you can add some 'STUFF' for the crew.

• Jovian Class 1 Drive, Strelov 1 Warp Engine, Geller Field, Commerce Bridge, M-1.r LS, Pressed Quarters, M-100 Auger, Single Void Shield, Main Cargo Hold (its a transport so this space is 'traditionally' already removed from the build and only power need be payed), Jovian Miss Batt Dorsal, Jovian Miss Batt Prow. 0 space leftover.

The fluff on the COBRA is 1.5km (FFG fluff from ItS) so its twice as long and has only 10 more space but at least it is fast and has guns.

Steve-O said:

A few of the escort craft (Frigates and Destroyers) used by the Astartes are the same classes as those the Imperial Navy uses (Swords, Firestorms and Cobras, typically), but they also employ equivalent craft of their own which are typically faster and better-armoured (the Hunter-class Destroyer, and the Gladius- and Nova-class Frigates). The Astartes don't (and aren't permitted to) use the capital ships of the Imperial Navy (the Space Marines aren't allowed anything that lets them directly compete with the Imperial Navy, so their fleet is primarily for transportation and support of ground forces, and thus excels at planetary assaults and blockade runs but is less useful in a straight up fight, though the presence of Space Marines makes them terrifying in boarding actions), but instead employ Strike Cruisers (heavily-armoured, heavily-armed light cruisers carrying a full Company of Space Marines) and Battle Barges (heavily armoured, heavily armed battleship equivalents carrying three companies of Space Marines).

What about the Adeptus Mechanicus probe from Lure of Expanse(100 m).It has even weapons. Double the size for life support,crew quarters and crew provisions and you get a really small ship.

Deathwatch also reveals that the chapter of the same name also use "Killships," (I think this is what they're called, I'm writing from memory) small, heavily automated craft which contain exterminatus weapons used for cleansing entire worlds. There are very few details of these craft in Deathwatch, but there is a very cool little Jes Goodwin sketch of what one looks like. I have no idea how big these are, but the suggestion is that they're very small.

bobh said:

You are applying gaming rules to universe fluff logic here.

Be careful, you might end up strange results.

Voronesh said:

I actually rather like Bobh's thinking here. But I have always wondered if a warp capable ship is a slightly different beastie to a system ship, gellar fields and warp engines aside.

In my own head (this is a canon-unsupported interpretation, though) I've always seen warp capable ships as being incredibly over-engineered, and far far more massive and heavy than they need to be. I always pictured warp travel (even under Gellar fields) as putting immense physical stress on the hull of a ship, causing it to creak and groan like a wooden ship at sea. A pure system ship isn't designed to cope with that kind of pressure. Hard vacuum is a hostile environment, certainly, but nowhere near as weirdly hostile as the warp.

It would be a bit like taking a cheap rubber dinghy onto the open ocean: it could cope (for a while) but it would always risk being swamped or overwhelmed by the environment.

So I'd certainly allow Bobh's upgraded system ship to enter the warp, but I might be tempted to add modifiers to navigation difficulties.

Again, this is a purely personal interpretation, based on an extension of the "(warp)Space is an Ocean" trope.

I fear I have to correct myself here. I stated that the Viper is the smallest (quite a bit smaller then the oft mentioned Cobra) craft in RT, but it is only the smallest craft for which we have the stats and that can be constructed with regular components. BFK is quite explicit in the size of almost all Warp capable craft, but gives the following exception:'the smallest warp-capable ships tend to be at least the size of the largest interplanetary vessels, and usually much larger. As such, it's extremely rare to see a warp-capable ship smaller then a raider or a good-sized interplanetary hauler, though the Inquisition and Officio Assassinorum are whispered to have acces to smaller, specialised vessels more suited to their needs ( BFK p.45 ).'

So, there are some far, far smaller ships out there, but they are very rare exceptions used by two of the most secretive and powerful institutions in the Empire, who can call on archeotech beyond the reach of even the wealthiest of Rogue Traders. At least, that is my interpretation of the text. Furthermore, I see few reasons to entrust one of these ships to a RT. To start with, they seem to be exceedingly rare, each of them a treasured tool and not something to potentially loose in the expanse. Secondly, the highly specialised nature of the ships seems to exclude them from more then transporting persons fast. Trade, warfare and conquest, the reason of being of a RT are impossible with such a small craft. Hard to transport any cargo, weapons or troops with these ships. Finally, there is the supplies question. The crew will be far smaller, perhaps even almost absent, but the space to take food and other supplies along for the often long and arduous trips a RT is forced to make might be minimal.

So, even if there seem to be a few rare, small ships around, I would strongly advise against giving them to player characters. Within the internal logic of the Empire, it would be highly illogical. It also goes against the spirit of the game, where vast, cathedral like, ships ply the Void, their enormous hulls filled with thousands upon thousands of men and women, all of this under the command of a Rogue Trader under the God-Emperor. Obviously, this is my interpretation and everyone makes his own game. If you wish to give your party acces to such a rare and unique craft, it might be done. If it is Imperial, a very good background reason would be needed, with some very probable attention of the Inquisition or the Officio Assasinorum. If it is found outside the Empire, it will be the envy and interest of many and attract attention wherever it is seen. Its worth would be immense, rivalling with cruisers and possibly even larger ships. Handing an example of such a ship from the Halo stars over to the Adeptus Mechanicus might get you a very well equipped Grand Cruiser in trade.

FvR

Applause. There have been several good points raised already. The Viper and Cobra are likely the smallest ships that a Rogue Trader actually has a reasonable chance to acquire.

The upper echelons of the Adepta tend to keep all the really good stuff for themselves. Inquisition and Assassinorium "couriers" have already been mentioned, as have Deathwatch kill ships. Those have to be archaeotech hulls, though you might be able to approximate one. Take a Cobra with Reaver of the Unbeholden Reaches, Cypra pattern drive, Eymperian Mantle, and all good quality components (go for reduced size/mass) and you'd have a rather sneaky little ship.

Regarding the probe in Lure of the Expanse, I assumed the size was a typo and upgraded it to a more reasonable half-klick diameter when my PC's found it. That probe is more than a match for most frigates! It has three dorsal mounts. Three. It's speed 13, space 35, and 30 Hull Integrity, which is solidly in line with most raiders. It's definitely bigger than a Viper, given the space and Hull Integrity numbers.

Cheers,

- V.

Whether or not it is a typo, and we should ask before we assume (i've been burned before just assuming) it is a very good reason for the Navis and Mechanicus to go to war with one another. I intend to use it as such a plot device in my campaign.

bobh said:

Why go to war with each other?

The Navis have a monopoly on providing long distance warp travel by means of their mutation, this is their role in the Imperium If the Mechanicus were to supplant that in ANY way the Navis would cause serious problems for the Mechanicus, least of which being none of the mechanicus ships that use Navis would get to go anywhere until the tech was erased from existence. It would be the opening play in a very nasty conflict. Navis have always sought to suppress or destroy tech that would supplant their dominance in this arena.

bobh said:

Actualy there always were ships that could move through the warp without the assistance of a navigator in the IOM. There were ships that used calculated warp jump done by cognitars. During some of the previous codexes the ships that used calculated warp jumps and not navigators were a majority. Even today ships that do not use navigators to travel through the warp is common in the IOM. The fact that most Rogue Trader ships,and navy ships have navigators because there are powerful organizations and are mostly an exception than the rule.

IIRC, you can make up to 3 day jumps in the Warp without a Navigator or anything, simply by being able to see that far into the chaos to judge the tides and shifts. The Navigator is only special because he can see the Astronomicon, which acts as a lighthouse of sorts and so they can extend that by a great deal. There is, in Into The Storm, the Void Abacus, which allows non-Navigator travel.

VOID ABACUS
While the search for priceless archeotech is one of the most
profitable endeavours a Rogue Trader can undertake, there
are those who dedicate their lives to the suppression and
elimination of many wondrous items from the Dark Age of
Technology. One such item sought after by both camps is
the Void Abacus, most famously unearthed on the cursed
Munitorum planet of Soloman in the Markayn Marches but
also recovered in the bowels of many an ancient hive spire
or nameless space hulk. For these can do something very
valuable indeed—when integrated into a ship’s auspex and
propulsion systems they can allow a ship to make accurate
void jumps four or five times longer than normal without
a Navigator’s aid. This allows many more types of ships to
travel safely, something the Navigator’s Guild cannot allow.
While the Guild cannot directly outlaw their use, they can
act to buy, destroy, or sabotage any and all they can find.
That they will arrange for the same fate to befall to any vessel
found using one is an open secret as well.

As you can see, this also illustrates the views of the Navigator Houses on such things.

bobh said:

But remember, the chartist ships get by without Navigators by short hops. Which this prober could have done for centuries to arrive where it is right now.

It is also mentioned as bordering tech-heresy. Maybe because it HAS these cogitators installed, but then the Mechanicus would openly destroy such a piece of tech. Or if a shady group gets ahold of it (of which are dozens everywhere, even on forge worlds), the Navis will simply never know about it. Because the AdMech wont tell.

The RT shouldnt tell, or he might just end up as dead meat (The "I" doesnt like people deailing in straight tech-heresy, depending on the Inquisitor in question).

Yes war could happen, but i dont think anything major would happen, unless the RT really tries to screw up. Eg Run to the Navis, or tell everyone and his uncle he sold it to the AdMech.

Gents the short jumps don't concern the Navis. Period. That is a non-issue. Find a way to nudge into the Navis' long jump monopoly and your a dead man, or woman, or mutant. Unless you keep it a secret.