I tried to be patient but i just want to address some things.

1. contradictions from what we are told and get.

We were told that there would be an increase in super rares with these last releases and yet it has not happened. I understand this may be due to the new designer (james) starting to design and the delay of the products and over all it is a not really a big deal. I just dont like expecting to be able to pull cool cards like galactica phantom and spinning beat easier and finding out that it wasnt true.

2. super rares are supposed to be linear - aka the reasoning for addes syndicate being super rare.

If the above statement is true, which was said by dave not anyone current, why is spinning beat super rare. Its not linear since most people use the death seal and can use the enhance. Now i know you might say well its an awesome can and deserves to be a super rare! While I agree with you that was true of many uncommons and they didnt make the cut. You and say in one breath that good cards need to be availible to all players hence rares or uncommons and then next print good cards that arent linear as super rares. I agree that good cards should be super rare more often than not the cards that are super rare suck like top turnbuckle or are character only and usually under powered.

My suggestion to fix most of these concerns would be to increase the number of super rares per box and make all characters super rares. As it is now you get a super rare every 4 packs aproximately when the up them to about every 3 packs I imagine.

3. cards should not punish people to block - the reasoning for banning Penetrating lunge

MInd Over Matter

E Commit: Your attack gets +2 speed. If it is blocked, the next attack you play this turn gets +4 speed.

How does this not punish people for blocking? Make my throw faster and if you block it my next attack will be at least 8 speed? This just doesnt seem right.

4. Symbol balance and equality.

I know all tweleve symbols will never be equal. I am not asking for that. It seems to me that what evil does good should do the opposite to an extent. same for life and death, fire and water, chaos and order, and air and earth. I didnt mention all and void because they do represent opposites. all draws and void discards. So why do the other symbols not do this as clearly as all and void?

I would like to see void bleed people the way some of the basara cards do and life gain life the way it does but void falls short. I dont want to waste time proposing examples because i dont make the game. I just want to add input.

Why does order reccur, commit, draw cards, have stasis effects, and control check hack better than anyother symbol? In my opinion Order is completely over powered right now and the only ways i can see to beating it are chaos or an extreme aggro deck and neither one is consistant enough because of two main problems.

Juni's Spiral Arrow - Once this locks i cant get out due to contol check hacking and olcadan's mentoring prevent me from getting out and tenacious will reccur the spiral arrow in block three. I really think this needs to go, yes i am asking for it to be banned for the overall enjoyment of the game. This is just miserable to play against becuase it is sooo hard to pass cards.

Chinese Boxing - I know most people do know that this card locks a foundation for 5 turns if you opponent attacks. I will give everyone who didnt know a minute to let it sink in and think about it...

Okay, why does one foundation my opponent controls commit a foundation of mine on my turn, then it stays on their turn, doesnt ready on my turn, stay commited on thier turn and readies on the fifth turn. This is way too good of an effect. To boot it readies twice before the foundation they commited readies. I see this as a major problem, if i am alone so be it.

I am not complaining. I am merely expressing concern with what I was told through annoucements on the boards and problems i see in the game. concider it food for thought, I would gladly like other peoples opinons.

The increase in the number of super rares isn't until set 12, as we've known for some time.

Not to outright put down your opinion, you're entitled to it as much as I am, but I think they relaly got the Super Rares right in this set. Powerful with some characters, but not with others. This means that they're worth having even if you don't play them because the chances are that someone else will. Look at Galactica Phantom for example. You wouldn't run that in every deck you could run it in, would you? You'd need a character lke Raphael to cater to it's need for speed. (No pun intended) Even the example you used; Spinning Beat, is a great example, in my opinion, of how a Super Rare should be. You can't really run 4 copies of it effectively (I could be wrong on this), so you don't have to spend an age searching for them, only certain characters can use it unless you keep a Seal Of Cessation down WITHOUT using it so if it's not your style of play, you'd trade it.

Also, put Once A Student, Now A Soldier in a deck and then tell me Top Turnbuckle sucks.

Being honest, I think that you're in the minority with the opinion that Set 11's distribution is less than good. It's almost been a universal opinion that Set 11 is excellently exectuted. So I wouldn't worry too much about how the games going. Lots of people seem to be happy about it, myself included

MegaGeese said:

No you would be wrong! We were told increase in super rares withthis set and decrease of characters in release 12. That was what we were told around worlds last year. The super rare increase because of the addes syndicate complaints of how hard it is to pull one. The decrease of characters due to them not trying to keep all characters in rotation.

Viewtiful_Joe said:

I agree to an extent but not that super rares are supposed to be narrow. Which was my issue with the the reasoning for certain actions in the past and they dont seem to follow it now. I thought the super rares were decent from this set as well, it doesnt follow the example that was layed before us. Which was my problem. What happens when we get out next set with dissapointing super rares? Cutting edge make everyone happy when it came out and most people concidered it a good set untill the bannings. I would like to think the trend of super rares being overall good will last but untill they show us otherwise I can only wait and hope.

Oh by the way the Once a soldier combo mentioned still qualifies Top Turnbuckle to suck. There are way easier ways do damage bonuses especially in void and it is ammusing but really not worth what you have to do to do it.

rulemonkey said:

I thought that Cutting Edge was the set that nearly killed UFS because of how wildly unbalanced it was. And whats to say the SR's in the next set are going to be disappointing? We don't know until it's come out, we never have done. The bannings were really well revered when they happened by all those people that couldn't get hold of Addes Syndicate, and by a lot of people who did own them even. I'll join you in saying that I hope this trend of Supers will continue, but as you say, we can only wait and see. I think we'll agree to disagree on Top Turnbuckle, I quite like it I'm not saying I'd run it in every deck, or even that it deserves SR status, but I'd rather pull that than Ancestor Spirits

Viewtiful_Joe said:

You missed what i said about cutting edge. Most people loved the set and thought it was a good set. There wasnt uproar right off the bat when the set dropped. Also i never said that super rares would suck in the next set i mearly said that seems to be the trend. Counting on the new company and james to help in that area.

P.S. i dont think anyone wants ancestor spirits!!!

rulemonkey said:

You mean "You don't want Ancestor Spirits"

With the amount of people wanting to build T.Hawk here, I'm pretty sure I could fetch something useful for my decks were I to have some more.

A lot of this stuff will be answered n Steve's interviews and the first will air tomarrow or today .

yeah sure. official announcements would be good as well. you know for people that won't listen the said podcast.

rulemonkey said:

Admiral Ren said:

They don't read official announcements either, or remember them more then a week after they're made.

[/thread derail]

[personal opinion]

Addes Syndicate should *not* have been superrare. If the card was common or uncommon, I don't see it being banned today.

Super rares should not be staple deck cards. They should be cards that *if* you can collect them they have a really neat power that will reward you, but not be unbalancing to the game as a whole.

[/personal opinion]

Re: Punishing Blocking:

With Penetrating lunge, if you blocked a pumped damage attack, it was then used to kill you. You took lethal damage, and at the time there was no way to stop it. Today there are a number of cards that reduce speed, or negate a speed boost all together (Strife's among others). So while in this instance you are "punished" for blocking, the attacking player is rewarded for playing multiple attacks. This is moving the meta, because recently we've seen a lot of kill via one epic attack. Again, there are also PLENTY of ways to negate this e, or nullify its effects. Many were printed in this set.

Penetrating Lunge - there was no way to stop it, unless you were Dhalsim <Granted, I just ignored it, by using Size Matters with Gaira, and then using mystic to bring it back every turn... but that was just me>

Actually, if Addes was a common and everyone had access to it, the meta would've been to bland too quick and they would've banned it much sooner.

The game would've devolved (much quicker) into "if you don't run a symbol Addes has, you're wasting your time".

"Super rares should not be staple deck cards. They should be cards that *if* you can collect them they have a really neat power that will reward you, but not be unbalancing to the game as a whole."

Like Feline Spike? If that was an uncommon, would it be OK?

GA -

Imagine this - everyone and their dog runs addes. If you're going into a tournament environment, do you either A) play less R's <Which during the Addes environment Andrew Olexa piloted a deck without R's to a second place finish at this last years Can Nats, loosing only to Ibuki who was subsequently banned>

B) run asset destruction. There is a bunch of Asset destruction, but players choose not to run it for whatever reason. If addes was in every deck, people would be forced to run wholesale asset destruction. It would shift the meta, as would people continue to run tonnes of addes if people are not playing R's and blowing up assets left right and center?

I think you would have genuinely seen a different meta if everyone had access to addes. How many players didn't even bother to try and get Addes because of how expensive it was? Because you didn't get to see the true meta, it never shifted the way it *could* have. Eventually the meta continues to shift as everyone plays the "I know that you know, that I know that you know, that you know that I know." to something that is more balanced then what it was.

Re: Kitty Spike - I think it *should* have been rare or uncommon.

That's my personal opinion, I'm sure folks will disagree with it, but *shrugs* that's what makes the world go around right?

Antigoth said:

See to the Addes thing back when addes was a problem there wasn't asset destruction. There just wasn't much in the way of it at all, there certainly is much more now but then? Not so much. And ontop of that they were probably running seals too so you weren't going to get it off anyways. And that would further force things into a 3 symbol meta anyways because you'd want to stop your opponents seal ect ect ect. Dropping the rarity does not solve issues with problem cards. If Higher Calibur was a common it would still be a problem card and need to be banned. If Addes was a common it would still be a problem card and need to be banned.

Which leads me into Feline Spike...Yeah dropping it to uncommon != good. Rare ok that would be better. But I don't think the environment really needs another card that is a 'uncommon' but really, as far as sorting goes, a 'super rare'. We absolutely do NOT need another Chain Throw (speaking entirely in the 'its a uncommon but good luck finding any' vein).

Feline Spike is not dumb mostly because it's an ultra-rare, it's because for 7 difficulty (1 control), you have a stun:2 reversal with two undiscardable multiples, all for 4H8. In a sense I'm only glad that the average vitality for a character went way up with Block 3's drop, because this ONE attack takes care of most of the characters in blocks 1 and 2.

About your Mind Over Matter remark...

Um, STG told us blocking shouldn't be punishable. After designing my own personal sets, and being aware of this game, I can easily ascribe to the fact that blocking OUGHT to be punishable by some certain degree by some card effects. MoM, IIRC, is a 3/4 no block, yes? 3/4 no block basically states the foundation can be broken as Hell. That's how stat-balancing works. Look at its diff vis-a-vis control, its block, symbols, and then determine its strength. Remember, if you eat their attack, the +4 speed doesn't occur. Besides, what if they have no 2nd attack? Mind games...

Blocking ought to be punishable by some degree, hence why new Balrog is going to be busting heads. New Balrog shares all 3 symbols with Visions of Destiny, and basically has a built-in Through the Defenses. He's great lol.

I agree, when it comes to punishing blocking, it needs to be balanced, because obviously, blocking is used for protection, so you shouldn't be hurt more from blocking than you would from taking. But, punishing blocking needs to exist, ESPECIALLY since there's simply too much block support. Every Guile released supports blocking. Lizardman, tutoring cards, etc, blocking is too much a proponent, and let's face it, you only generally block 2-3 attacks per turn. Rejection is a great example of what this game doesn't need; biggest discouragement to blocking ever.

I think the big disconnect is at what people consider "punished for blocking".

With Penetrating lunge because you blocked, you could take more than the damage of the attack because you blocked and there was -nothing- that could be done with that or that could stop that.

Mind over Matter...if you block the attack the next attack they play gets +4 speed. You have a entire enhance phase to deal with that attack and its speed before you're even into the block step for that attack. Furthermore Mind over Matter is can be stoped by a myriad of things. The effect is not even remotely comparable to being actualy punished (possibly taking more damage than the damage of the attack) by Penetrating Lunge.

If Mind over Matter 'punishes' us for blocking, one can make the argument, and it would be as equally stupid, that blocking punishes us for blocking because it adds to the progressive difficulty of the next block you attempt to play.

You can block the sped up attack with Criminal Past, Baller or Tira's Contract. You can reduce the speed of the second attack with Terry stuff, Dhalsim stuff and Strife's Patronage, then block. Off of Air/Water, you can use Soul of Ling Sheng Su and Angel of Evening. As a very last resort, other symbols get access to damage reduction, such as Amy's Assistance, or you can discard the second attack with Make a Difference. Hack his check for the second attack. Siberian Training it. Kazuki's Pyrotechnics.

Stop panicking.

BlindProphet said:

I'd rather have a Chain Throw. Everybody was warranted around 2 for every box, and it was not hard to pull from random packs. And it could be bought in the secondary market most of the time, at a expensive but not utterly ridiculous price. We do need good, effective attacks that are common/uncommon with nice stats, but not with stupid abilities like Chain Throw. Speaking of which, I'd rather see strong, free E abilities in attacks that reward running and playing them, instead of being printed in foundations that can be used over and over.

However, now there are very few attacks worth running, and most of them are chase UR, very hard and expensive to get, like Tsurane Kiri, Feline Spike, Ira Spinta, Great Gerdenheim, Spinning Beat, etc. Notable exceptions include some "I'll kill you, but after many turns" attacks like High Plasma Beam and Tiger Fury (one of the Star starter deck rare); or Kuzuryu-Reppa (from the other recent starter deck worth buying). I might be missing other attacks, if somebody knows more please let me know (we still haven't got set 11 here).

And yes, Feline Spike is ridiculous, specially with hundreds of ways of generating 2 momentums even by not throwing a single attack before. I wish we had more better-than-average attacks and fewer one-shot-kill attacks.

Addes syndicate was a very badly designed (read: unbalanced) from its start to its banning, including its stats (1/4 with +2H block so military-rankable, and non-unique). Making it an UR set a very hard price to top-level playing. Making it an (un)common would have made even casual playing quite unpleasant, but maybe tolerable, just like Lost Memories (actually it was quite balanced, and now it wouldn't be that good) and Yoga Mastery (still broken beyond belief) were back in the day.

Asset destruction, which is still needed today due to Olcadan and other green stuff, hasn't been around since Steel's Bane due to that it can still be negated/controlled or is not available to most symbols. Family Heirloom is still the best asset-hate, but again UR (I swear absolutely nobody in the entire Spain has pulled one), Gaishiki Lunar Rebellion and Nature's Force could be good too.

Nicely said mano. It gets slightly anoying when building a deck that so few attacks worth running exist, and that the majority of them are URs that I cant buy or trade for anywhere. Magic, while having its expensive cards, are at least obtainable. I hate how the best answer to assets in the game is again a UR. In future sets, and I think this has been promised somewhere, I'd love to see URs be restricted to narrow and/or cool effects that arent required to play competive UFS.

Fire Kick is an excellent finishing attack that's uncommon. 6/2 4H6 with Powerful: 3. Lunar Slash is rare, and Sardine's Beach Special is also rare. The argument can be made that these are easier to play than Neo Raging Storm or Spinning Beat, in that you don't have the attack restriction on them. Heck, my kill card in my Chaos deck is Cutlass Europa, which is a rare. It's 5/2 5M4 with Powerful: 2, and there's no way I'd replace it for Neo Raging Storm.

But, there's plenty of quality regular attacks out there that aren't even Rare. How many of the new throws that came out are common and uncommon? Almost all of them. Omnidirectional Cluster Bomb is common, Hurricane Punishment is common, Melancholic Mercurius is common, Ichi no Tachi is common, Thunderbolt is common, Shadow Blade is common, etc.

Just because TwoHeadedDragon doesn't have the latest set up doesn't mean people shouldn't look at their latest set cards.

And hell, Alex4 turns every attack into a potential kill card.

Wingless Aeroplane is a perfect example of a balanced attack that's great to run (and as it happens, is also the poster child for MoM shenanigans). It rolls a 3 check, and for 6 difficulty, a 5 damage throw with a self damage boost with all of R. Mika's damage pump support? It has no block, but is a solid move all-around. Monster Lariet. 4M5 damage for 5/3 and a +2M block and an E that could scare your opponent into either forcing a block and pushing through a bigger move or letting it hit on the hopes that since you played the E you'll play more foundations, or maybe they don't want you drawing all those cards...

This game isn't about all the big flashy moves you can throw. Sure, a Feline Spike to the noggin hurts, but a little Fight or Flight or Healer are easy, common/uncommon answers to a very painful card, same with battle prowess. Some of the most powerful foundations in the game are promos sometimes (read: Chester's Backing, Amy's Assistance) or box toppers (read: BRT and Lord of the Makai) but those don't make a deck. Chinese Boxing, The Ways of Punishment, Shooting Capoiera? Anti-Social?

yes, you need to drop a bit of cash to play this game (unless you're me and you mooch/borrow cards for a new deck every week) but you can easily make a deck out of all uncommons and commons and drop $20 on a solid deck. Oh, and that Feline Spike your friend runs in his deck that checks a 1? Well, if you like the attack so much, drop the dollar and pick up a fun little Twelve foundation with lots of numbers on it, and you can run Feline Spike as a foundation and play on your turn for the cost of any card in your hand and commiting it .

quarzark said:

That attack is simply bait. Block it or don't, no matter, because whatever you did not eat on the attacking turn you will likely eat on the reversal. At least in Rainbow Mika decks.