Troopershark said:

The answer is in front of you.Just look your avatar.Aragorn with Celebrian's stone and steward of Gondor and nothing is expensive.Fortune or fate is a great card and the only card which can bring back a dead hero in the core set.

Healing cards can only heal and can't bring your heroes back.If you lose a hero with any other sphere then your hero is dead and you can't do anythink about this.In my spirit decks fortune or fate will allways have a place.

Servant:

One last time, a card that costs 5, has no proactive use and is only useful in a small percentage of games just isn't that great. We get there's no changing your mind. It's a free game. You can play whatever you want, but realize most people disagree with you.

To answer your question, I play Eowyn, Theodred & Dunhere. Aragorn is obviously a solid guy and has the extra Spirit synergy, but his threat is just too high. Theodred is extremely good in the deck with the extra resource generation and low threat.

Everyone Else:

Pretty clear there's no changing this guys mind, so lets keep the thread moving in a positive direction. I'm done talking about Fortune & Fate lol

Kzer-za said:

Kzer-za said:

Also, in the third scenario I usually _do_ plan to sacrifice a hero:

After picking up all three objective cards to advance to the third stage I always try to kill off the Hero I attached them to before the turn ends. Since you don't need them to win the scenario, it's best to get rid of them as fast as you can, and this is a perfect method. Only the Lore sphere offers a better method with the miner ally.

CAlexander said:

LOL.Most people you mean you and an other one ?

Anyway i just wanted to say that this card is not as bad as you think and i don't want to change anyone's opinion.If you feel so bad cause someone else has a different opinion than yours i will not reply again at your posts.I don't write in those forums to play the smart guy or say to everyone else that i am right and you are wrong.I just chat with people and write my opinion and my point of view for this game.

jhaelen said:

That is smart thinking and a great, easy way to get rid of those cards. Maybe not super easy, but still great thinking. Ive been trying to take advantage of the "Restricted" condition on the cards by attaching more restricted cards to Heroes and discarding the objectives.It's a pretty hit or miss prospect. But I haveyet to win Scenario 3 anyway.

no card is a total waste , they all have a use .

servant of the secret fire said:

In every ccg / lcg, one of the pitfalls players fall into when building decks and optimizing them is called BCSM (Best case scenario mentality), which is very well illustrated in your post. It assumes Aragorn is one of your starting heroes, that you drew Celebrian's stone and Steward of Gondor, paid the resources to play them, had a hero die and had F o F in your hand at that opportune time. That is just not going to happen reliably. It will be awsome when it happens, but the likely hood of the card being dead in your hands for 10-11 turns is higher then the likely hood of this happening, by a wide margin.

I said in my post that of the cards I don't use at all, F o F is one that I am going to keep looking at as expensions come, because recursion synergies in LCG and CCG's are always there, and usually potent. If you have a strategy where you expect a hero to die, where it is actually part of the plan to winning the quest, then this card becomes potentially useful (still dead in your hand until the hero actually dies).

Troopershark said:

I can understand what you say but remeber that i use 3 core sets and i have all cards x3 so i have those 2 cards in my hand almost in every game in the first 5-6 turns.Ofcourse i may play 6 games and never need to use FOF but its not a dead card.If all things goes in the right way i can discard it and use Eowyn's abilitie and if all things goes wrong i can use dwarven tomb bring FOF back and use it on a dead hero.

Anyway as i said in my previous post i don't say that you are an idiot because you don't use a FOF or that i am smarter than you and you must use this card cause i say so.I am just saying that this card is not bad and even if you will use this card 1 per 10 games this one time FOF can give you the win wen no other card can do this.

ps:maybe my bad English make me sound like an as*** and sorry if i sound like this but believe me everything i say i say it with the friendly way.

servant of the secret fire said:

I use 3 core sets as well, so having 3 FOF actually increases the chance that it is a dead card in my hand, like you said, if you draw 2 of those in the first 5-6 turns in most games, you drew 2 cards out of a potential 12 that are of no use to you now... (the fact that I can use Eowyn to discard it does not make it a better card, I would prefer having something that I can actually use for it's value vs discarding it for Eowyn purposes). The point I am trying to make is vs difficult scenario's, the once per 10 games where you use it and it helps, does not offset the times where drawing something else would help forward your cause more. That is what is so great about card evaluation, it's subjective. I actually think if that card would win me 1 out of 10 games, I would play it, I just think the probabilities of having that card in my hand at a time where I can actually play it and have it actually swing a game in my favor (vs winning more or loosing less) will be much rarer then that. It could very well be that our playstyles or decks are different enough that you end up in those situations more often then I do or envision doing.

A card like this does a unique thing, so it can have a very powerful effect on the game state, I just do not see the synergies at this point to either make this occurence probable, or make it swigny enough for the risk / trade off. Has the card pool expands, I can certainly envision a deck where this card is so critical you would play Dwarven Toombs just to fetch it back, I just don't see it now.

I really am not taking offence in anything you say, and hope no one takes offence in what I say, everyone is entitled to there opinions on these things of course. For me, these types of debates are what I go throuh internally when building a deck, and why I check these boards.

Troopershark said:

The chance that Aragorn is one of your starting heroes is 100% if you intend to use the card as described above.

The chance to have Steward of Gondor in your starting is likewise very high, because it's simply one of the best cards you can have on your starting hand. If you have three copies that chance is 57.45%. If you don't have it right away and then do a mulligan, the total chance increases to 84.31%!

The chance to also have Celebrian's Stone right away is lower, of course, but also not strictly necessary. You could just as well attach the Steward of Gondor to a Spirit Hero to have sufficient resources to play FoF (should you happen to draw it before drawing CS).

I have already pointed out a scenario where it might be part of your strategy to sacrifice a hero at some point. If it isn't and you included FoF in your deck, anyway, it can become part of your strategy as soon as you draw it. It is only a bad card to include in your deck, if you already included 50 cards that are all strictly better. At the moment, given the number of available cards, I don't see that being the case.

Having said all that, the cost 5 event cards are among the cards I rarely use. Imho, the best of the bunch isn't even FoF, it's the Leadeship one that allows you to ready all characters. The Lore one is probably the worst of them.

Troopershark said:

Sorry again my bad English.What i wanted to say is that i have steward of Gondor and Celebrian's stone in my hand in the first 5-6 turns not FOF.I like FOF a lot but i don't have 3x FOF in my deck.

jhaelen said:

Yea grim resolve is a great card too.You can also use grim resolve after stand together as a combo .First you can use stand together for defence and then grim resolve to ready all your characters and attack .

servant of the secret fire said:

Yea grim resolve is a great card too.You can also use grim resolve after stand together as a combo .First you can use stand together for defence and then grim resolve to ready all your characters and attack .

I've only used that card once, but it was commit everyone to questing, ready everyone, use Faramir to increase WP for all.

jhaelen said:

If you are playing with a fifty card deck, those numbers seem to be quite a bit off. Unless I am doing something wildly incorrect, you have about 33% chance of pulling the card in your first six cards. If you assume a mulligan if you don't draw the card, your odds increase to almost 58%. Decent odds, but not a sure thing, and not 84%.

Dam said:

servant of the secret fire said:

Yea grim resolve is a great card too.You can also use grim resolve after stand together as a combo .First you can use stand together for defence and then grim resolve to ready all your characters and attack .

I've only used that card once, but it was commit everyone to questing, ready everyone, use Faramir to increase WP for all.

Yeap and this is the best way to use it.I use grim resolve wen i need to commit all my characters to quest and then i use grim resolve to ready all my characters for attack or defence.I use this combo wen i play the second scenario and i want to to have as high wp as i can with Aragorn,Eowyn and Faramir to pass quikly the 2b phase of that scenario and then ready my heroes to fight at the last part.

GrandInquisitorKris said:

I agree that all cards have a use. But some cost too much. And for some cards, they are useful in too rare a circumstance. Having to concern myself with a limited resource pool every turn makes me look hard at just how much use I will ger out of a given card, compared to the cost.

That's true, that some cost too much or are too situational. But with the limited card pool we have you don't have much choice. My friend and I have decided upon mono-sphere decks for cooperative play after having tried dual-sphere. With 3 of each card, Tactics and Lore only have 48 card decks. Leadership can use some leftover Spirit cards, and Spirit can use leftover allies with Stand and Fight. As such, I can't wait for HFG to finish T/L and prune some less than useful cards from the others.

Bohemond said:

That's what you get for not adding comments to your Excel sheets

Still, it's pretty good odds.