Hello everyone, im new to this site however, not new to warhammer. I have alot of experience with that and Gming other games. However, DW is a bit diffrent and after my first game im noticing a slight problem. I have several players who know the lore of warhammer as much or more then myself. A black sheild tactical, an assault marine (space wolf), (dark angel) apothecary. and a (Imperial fist) devestator. However i have another space wolf tactical marine who doesnt know what hes doing. He has ( i wish i was kidding) threatened to shoot several kill team members (worse captains) and has actually took his helmet off and started to spin it around on his head while trying to get the imperial fist to puke in it. Whenver i try to make him see reason he just claims the wolves are crazy. Nothing i do works. Any gm advice of how to punish him in game to make him see reason?

Ask to him to behave, the consequences being that you will eject him from your game. Period.

Sounds like he doesnt really know much of the 40k loreanything about space marines. Either way, the part about threatening to shoot other memberseven superiors tells me he is either 1) really youngimmature2) just a problem gamer. If #1, just have a sit down with himtry to advise him on proper space marine behavoir. If he rejects thathe is #2, I would suggest getting rid of him. He is likely to spoil the fun of the other playersI for one hate when one jerk off ruins the game.

Sounds like the player I had running the Navigator in my RT game. It took me four sessions and the help of the pother players (including her fiance) to work on her and get her into the same gaming vibe as the rest of the table. I'd suggest taking it slow and seeing if the player is receptive to modification of his/her playing style. If so, find the happy medium. If not, then probably best to part ways when it comes to the Deathwatch game.

It should be primarily taken care of outside the game by pulling him aside. Maybe suggest he goes read the Ragnar Blackmane novels, the guys in Wolfblade particularily sound "crazy" but not the kind of crazy he is talking about. If he isn't willing to admit that you might not have more sketchy knowledge than you see if some of the other players are having similar thoughts to you. He might laughdismiss it when you say it but before a game is he has the rest of the party telling him he's going too far he might listen.

Failing this working you have two choices in my mind:

1) Ask him to leave the gamestart roleplaying properly... proceeded by just kicking him out if this doesn't work.

2) Take off the kids gloves off and say you're going to roleplay it properly whether he is or not. Have his reknown start going down as he is shaming the Deathwatchhis Chapter. Have a Deathwatch Chaplainperhaps more favourably in my mind one from the Space Wolves comespeak to him, to account for his actions. If threatens to kill the other players it's their responsibility to roleplay their characters but with the NPCs... this ignorant worm threatening his brother astrates repeatedly? He's obviously gotten warnings before so why not have the Astrates attack himchallenge him to a duel. Imagine him in some gladitorial arena fighting against the Watch Captain he's just insultedthe Watch Captain just went off to get his wargear. It's sounds like he's getting to the stage that either he'll be sent back his chapter in disgracejustifiably killed, he sounds like he's a prime candidate to go renegade but the Red Corsairs wont want him!

Make him read a few decent Space Marine novels as homework,asking him to stop being a jerk, because it's spoiling everyone else's game.

Siranui said:

This might be a near-impossible task as the few I've read are pretty much trash.

It depends on which ones you read,why you read them. Some are awful. The newer onesthe Horas Heresy series are a lot better. And if you want to just learn about Astartes, how they act, who they are,what they do overabove the plot, then pretty much any of them (EXCEPT 'Space Marine') are 'good'.

Bear in mind also that many of them are bad because they are written for younger readers. That might be the ideal kind of reading level for someone who acts like a jerk at the gaming table...

He doesn't even need to read the novels. If any of your players have Codex: Space Wolves, have him read that. There's plently of background story about the Space Wolves in there. Talk to him about the behaviour of a Space Marine and/or Space Wolfif he continues to act like a ******...kick him from your session. If not, you may see the table disapearthe vaulued gamers will be lostperhaps they will tell other players not to play with you as GM because you can't "control" your players.

You're the GM. You tell the story. When I read what you had typed, I imagined what I would do. I GM my group's Deathwatch Game. One of my Watch Captains is an Imperial Fist. If a Space Wolfany other Space Marine had pulled of that crap in front of my "Watch Captain Geotz Pfieffer of the Imperial Fists," I would have had the Rank 8 Tactical Marine bludgeon the Space Wolf player to death.

The Space Wolf player probably would have reacted this way, "What the hell, why'd you do that."

My reply would've been, "Space Marines don't have time for bull."

Problem solved. At this point either he learns to play a proper Space Marine or he leaves the game because he can't ruin yours anymore.

Dwarfgod52 said:

Punishment alone is no good. If the player isn't really into it, the threat of expulsion won't do good anyway. Give the player something to lose first. Give him stuff to do, involve him in cool action (exciting action will probably keep him from pulling shenanigans too), let him be the hero. Two sessions after that, when he is enjoying himself, tell him openly your problems at the start of the sessionthat it's keeping you from enjoying the game to whatever degree. Resolve difference in a friendly manner, if possible.

Alex

I respectfully disagree, Alex. You cannot reward bad behavior in this manner. For players like this, it will only make their attitude/behavior worse.

This is a tough one,without knowing the player I can only give vague advice, but I'm gonna go out on a limbsay that this is just him having fun. Regardless of setting, game tonewhat have you, if hes having fun,everyone else in the game is having fun, then your doing it right. By the tone of your original post I'm led to believe your not having fun,at that point is serious discussion time, but it has to be done with tact.

When I was first introduced to Vampire: The Masquerade many moons ago, one thing that always stuck with me was how the Storytellers guide said to deal with problem players. Lines like "Change your game datetime""You dont want this player runing your finely crafted narritive,""This kind of player will ruin your game, so dont invite them back." struck me as childishinappropriateI somewhat see this spirit returning here in the replies. I game with my friendsI want them to still be my friends outside of gaming, so this colours how i deal with problem players, so if you evict them from your game it will colour your personal relationship with them. I believe group dialogue, one on one dialoguecompromise can lead to a much better result then banningtrying to forcebly change someone else playstyle. Ifonly if it is a unaimous descion to remove him, do it, otherwise, compromise is the way to go.

Cheers

You have to first find out if this is an in-game issuean out of game issue. If it's in-game, let him read the lexicanumthe likethe intro to the book to get a better feel for Marinesthe Chapters. Try to teach him,explain that what he's doing doesn't fit within the established fiction. Have your characters written up bios/personality descriptions? Consider having him write something up, then you can address the specific parts that don't seem to fit with your vision of 40k.

If it's out of game,he's trying to disrupt your group because he's a tool, talk with himtell him what the problem is. You don't have to be a jerk about it in any way (and shouldn't be),if he's actually a friend (s)he should understand that their disruptions are making things "un-fun" for the others. He can knock it off,he can top participatng in that particular activity.

Charmander said:

Or maybe the player may have ADHD and/or low-level high-functioning Autism and/or Aspergers and/or acquired brain injury of the frontal lobes (very common especially from playing sportsthis may impede impulse-control) and/or depressionany other issue that may impair concentration, effect social skills etc.

There are many common neurological variations, mental illnesses, medication side-effectsthe like which can effect a persons behaviourwhich to be a good friend we must work with/around rather than discriminate against.

Look for ways that swiftly-bored players can occupy themselves while at the table while other players are the centre of attention so that they don't get disruptive in order to alleviate brief bouts of boredom. Trykeep them involved in the main action of the game where possibleallow them to paint miniaturesdo something else minimally disruptive when this is not the case.

Another option for a disruptive player is to get an npc who has traits the player may admire/respect/aspire to etc to take the character under their wing, someone who can bail them out when they get into trouble, who can give them advice when they need it, who can calm down inter-playerplayer/npc conflicts a little. The npc would need to be simple in characterhave a very clear certain outlook less likely to any kind of moodinesswhimsy. This would serve to guide the player into better behaviour, to warn them in a friendly way by means of a caring characters advice of consequences of intended actions that the player may be failing to predict, to give them someone who's opinion of them matters to them without being connected to players, which can give them more predictable patterns that accrue graduallyproviding a benchmark with which they may ground themselvesemulate.

Few people respond to punishmentthreats of punishment. After all countries where they torturemutilateexecute criminals still have plenty of criminals.

So we need to better understand the problemfind a solution with a higher likelihood of success.

One of my players has decided to give him schooling on how space Marines are supposed to act. However im going to give him one warning after that if he screws up in front of a watch captainthe like he will be challenged to a duelif that doesnt work im going to kick him. Thanks everyone. And he may be having fun but it ruins the people who actually like warhammer. Also related to the Space marine novels most of them are bad. However other then the Horus Heresy which is good check out hellsreach (black templar stuff) ive heard good things.

If he is not willing to learn bring the entire team in an situation where all will suffer becasue of this wrong behavior. When all players are "punished" for his mistakes the rest of the group will find ways to make him learn. Players are so creative when it comes to hurt one of their own. And if that´s is still not working, kick him!

Thats a really good idea actually.

Battybattybats said:

Right, but I wouldn't classify those folks as tools , though I agree with you key point that is you have to understand the problem better to be able to make a proper solution.

Battybattybats said:

I'll respectfully disagree here, threat of punishment, peer pressure, and ostracism are generally effective tools to get people to do things that you want them to do- morality and individual cases aside. Torture and execution are extreme forms of punishment and have not been shown to be as effective as other forms.

I'll shut up at this point.

P.S. To everyone, is it just me or are the forums eating all of our spaces and punctuation recently?

not just you. I thaought there were just many eccentric members here, and then I saw my own posts.

i always use the "random bullet" threat.

You never know when its going to hit you right in the balls.

Phaedron2 said:

I game with friends, too. Someone who deliberately jerks around, disrespects the effort the GM has put into the game, and hampers the enjoyment of everyone around the table by acting like a jerk isn't really acting like a friend, though. And I'd tell them so.

If someone is mentally ill and a friend, I'd know about it and compensate. Nobody here is saying 'kick people who have Aspergers because they're jerks'. Although the people I know with that particular issue are fine gamers. People who are jerks seldom have any good reason for it.

I think people DO respond to punishment. That's kinda the point: It works. Negative reinforcement works pretty darned fine. And as far as execution goes: I think it works pretty well... you don't get re-offenders.

Charmander said:

I wasn't classing them as tools either, hence why i said 'or'

And we can leave off-topic chats about general use of punishment etc to PM or such to avoid it taking over the conversation but it should suffice for me to point out that with the vast majority of Australian prisoners having acquired brain injury and most having having mental illness (with plenty having both) that clearly threats of punishment don't work for those people so may not work with problem players who may have such an issue and with most who have acquired brain injury being undiagnosed and with most with mental illness undiagnosed and mental illness effecting 1 in 5 Australians at some point in their lives none of these possibilities can be ruled out as the cause of problem behaviour (odds may be better that either is the cause than them being a jerk).

I've noticed problems with the forum eating spaces and punctuation too (despite my long fingernails making my typing poor to begin with).

Battybattybats said:

Erm... I'm happy not to discuss it, but it's kinda bad form to say 'Here's my expanded and detailed point of view on the subject, but nobody should be airing their opinion (except me)'.

Anyway; I thought that all Australians were convicts...