The Ordo Malleus and the Ecclesiarchy

By Carnage1138, in Dark Heresy

My group and I are planning an Ascension game for the Ordo Malleus (although since the announcement of Daemon Hunter we decided to wait until we've got a copy to finish our plans) and we are going to be incorporating stuff from Blood of Martyrs into the campaign. I'm playing the Inquisitor and there a few things that my group and I aren't sure of lorewise that we'd like some feedback on. I'm a big buff on 40k lore myself but even I need help on the following fluff problems and since my group likes to stay consistent with the lore I'd really appreciate it if I could have these lore problems fixed before any new ones pop up from Daemon Hunter .

I took inspiration for my Ordo Malleus inquisitor straight from the cover art of the soon to be replaced Daemonhunters Codex with its picture of Inquisitor Lord Coteaz (in fact he's going to look almost exactly like him). He's very much like the Paladin from Dungeons & Dragons in that he's a holy warrior who uses his blessed powers to smite the Daemonic foes of the Beloved God-Emperor. The biggest difference is his blessed powers are psychic in nature (I am positively drooling over the Daemonsbane Ascended psychic powers). This is a problem because I also see him as having a very close relationship with the Ecclesiarchy. He regards his psychic powers as a blessing that the Emperor has bestowed on him to help him better fight the cursed demons of the Warp. I'm planning on him living a very Spartan lifestyle who likes to spend what rare spare time he has reading Ecclesiarchial scripture (the sermons of Sebastian Thor are his favorite) and if he can find the time for it debating theological doctrine with the leading clergymen of the nearest shrine world. Also he has a excellent relationship with the Order of our Martyred Lady and has fought beside them in battles where Grey Knights were either unavailable or unneeded (which is 99% of the time) seeing them as fellow holy warriors of the God-Emperor.

The biggest lore question I have is is it realistic for a powerful psychic Inquisitor of the Ordo Malleus to have such a close relationship with the Ecclesiarchy? Despite being touted as the comprehensive guide to everything Ecclesiarchy Blood of Martyrs has frustratingly little to say on its views of the Ordo Malleus. Concerning the psychic powers of my planned Inquisitor the most I could find about its views were on page 20 under The Sin of the Psyker and the three short paragraphs I found to be frustratingly vague and ambiguous. The lack of information concerning the views of the general Ecclesiarchy concerning my proposed Inquisitor also extends to the Sisters of Battle. Although notorious for intolerant views concerning psykers I don't know how they'd feel about the about the sanctioned powers of such a religiously zealous Ordo Malleus Inquisitor. Given that one of my group would like to play a Sister of Battle from the Order of our Martyred Lady I'd like to know how they'd probably feel about such an Inquisitor. Any ideas or personal opinions on the these lore questions would be of great help.

"You and I may detest these creatures, but in their wisdom, the servants of the Throne see fit to use these pitiful wretches in His name."
- Celestian Superior Miriya, 'Faith & Fire'

The Ecclesiarchy teaches of the dangers of the witch, and psykers are but tamed witches, escaping the cleansing flame solely by being regarded as a useful tool, and becoming a liability to be censured with the utmost force the moment they step out of line. This dogma is held, teached and lived by most clerics of the Imperial Cult, though there may be some who hold more lenient and/or "practical" views, similar in contrast to their monodominant colleagues as radical Inquisitors are to puritan ones. Here it depends entirely on what kind of contacts your Inquisitor would keep around, and how his views on the subject are perceived - should his witchery be known amongst the clergy, he will surely be subject to scrutiny, every single word and action carefully weighted and examined for signs of treachery. For it is written: "The witch opens the gates to the Ruinous Powers."

With the Adepta Sororitas, it will be even more extreme. The Orders Militant in particular are used to fighting and purging the witch, taking purity control sweeps amongst the Imperial populace, standing sentinel aboard the Black Ships and pursueing errant psykers to bring them the Emperor's judgement. Many may have lost a fellow Sister in battle against a particularly dangerous witch or have felt the creeping taint of their proximity first-hand, but all have been extensively indoctrinated and will thus react even more aggressive than most of the clergy they police. Apart from any personal experiences, their very raison d'être quite simply requires them to hold a rather narrow view about psykers. "They teach her and she believes."

If you are looking for the best-possible way to keep the relationships of this particular Inquisitor as unproblematic as possible, I would advise to simply keep his psychic power a secret known only to him, the Inquisition and perhaps a few confidants. Even if he regards his psychic gifts as a blessing - which is a dangerously heretical opinion - he might be "diplomatic" enough to conceal the truth behind his blessings and limit the use of his powers to a way that they may ideally not be noticed at all, or at least truly be perceived as the Emperor's touch and not for the witchery they actually are. Naturally, he would be playing with fire here (literally and figuratively), for depending on how the use of such powers looks to others, a veteran member of the Ecclesiarchy, and the Sisterhood in particular, may grow wary - and such suspicions would require remarkable displays of devotion to the Imperial Creed to negate.

That said, let me close with an excerpt of the Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, sanctioned by the Ecclesiarchy, and thus perhaps most suitable to explain the delicate situation at hand:

"Sanctioned psykers are in use in some regiments of the Imperial Guard. These individuals have been touched by the mutating powers, but have been brought under strict control. They can be a great aid on the battlefield, but as a trooper you should have nothing to do with them. They are tools of the commanders, to do with as they will.

Do not attempt communication with them if you see them. They will be under constant guard by at least three armed troopers., for your protection as well as the psyker's. You must overcome your natural disgust for such unnatural men and remember that the machinations of the enemy must be met with whatever weapons we can gather about ourselves.

However, it is in everyone's best interest to watch these men! If they begin to behave strangely (outside of their usual strange habits) or you see them without a full guard compliment, it is your duty to shoot them down, as it is likely they have succumbed to dark powers.

The use of sanctioned psykers within the Imperial Guard is a necessary evil, but one all can benefit from. Treat them with equal tolerance and suspicion. EIther way, your life could depend on it."

Exactly the kind of response I was looking for. Well thought out with tons of support from the lore.

In regards to contacts he has none of the ones I was planning on are at all shady. He's the type that doesn't believe in using questionable methods (though the Ecclesiarchy could certainly argue psychic powers are a questionable method) and in doing things in the open where the God-Emperor's gaze may judge his actions. This is why no one in the group is planning on being a desperado as such a character has broken the Imperium's laws. To hide his psychic powers would mean that there is something tainted about them and he would sooner tolerate the Xanthite creed (which is inconcievable to him) than to hide them from the sheperds of the God-Emperor's flock. Indeed, let them come and test and scrutinize his words as who better than a cleric to sense impure motives and keep the Inquisitor on the straight and narrow? I actually was planning on having the Inquisitor being very close to our Hierarch character in the group.

As for his own view on other psykers he is actually somewhat of a hypocrite. While he may be extremely confident in his own abilities (though not blindly so as hes seen how other Puritans have fallen into the heresy of Radicalism by believing they could do no wrong) he holds a dim view of the abilities of other psykers to control their abilities. Too many Sanctioned Psyker squads have had to be put down on the battlefield by Commissars or his own hand for him to trust other psykers and the only one he'd ever allow in his own retinue besides himself would be his own protege (as was the same with his master before him). In that regard he holds to the main Ecclesiarchial view on other psykers.

In terms of his devotion to the Imperial Creed.....many a Cleric has been surprised when their requests for help from the Inquisition are met by my Inquisitor who tends to drop everything and help out unless there is a daemonic incursion in progress rather than by an Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor (who is typically ticked off to have arrived only to be handed mop up duties by the departing Malleus Inquisitor).

I´m not really confident on the matter myself, but aren´t the Sisters of Battle more aligned with the Ordo Hereticus? Though the occassional joint operation with them doesn´t seem unreasonable, it seems a bit odd that an Ordo Malleus Inquisitor would fight along side them on a more regular basis.

That aside, if the ecclessiarchy requires inquistorial aid, I don´t think they send a request directed at the whole inquisition. Like "hey there, inquisition, we got a situation here, care to help us out?". They´d more likely address a known and trusted inquisitor (typically from the ordo hereticus) directly.

Dunno, but while your idea for a character doesn´t seem impossible, to me it definetly seems very unorthodox.

moepp said:

I´m not really confident on the matter myself, but aren´t the Sisters of Battle more aligned with the Ordo Hereticus? Though the occassional joint operation with them doesn´t seem unreasonable, it seems a bit odd that an Ordo Malleus Inquisitor would fight along side them on a more regular basis.

That aside, if the ecclessiarchy requires inquistorial aid, I don´t think they send a request directed at the whole inquisition. Like "hey there, inquisition, we got a situation here, care to help us out?". They´d more likely address a known and trusted inquisitor (typically from the ordo hereticus) directly.

Quite right - but in a way, those two things could actually cancel each other out. If said Inquisitor feels "aligned" to the Ecclesiarchy and keeps himself in good standing with several influential figures, he could very well become "known and trusted" by some key figures. And whilst the Sisterhood, by virtue of the Convocation of Nephilim, stands closer to the Ordo Hereticus (apparently they've got quite an interesting deal going on there), their tasks frequently bring them into contact with the Malleus as well - be it because the Orders Pronatus also investigate daemonic artifacts (or even captured demons) or because the Orders Militant may, at times, be tasked to fight a daemonic incursion where elements of the normal Imperial forces do not suffice but where the Grey Knights are unable to respond in time.

Let us also not forget that witchcraft, mutation and daemons are all aspects of Chaos and thus somehow related, and two of those three belong to the main concerns of the Sisters of Battle. Furthermore, the Inquisitor may "circumvent" the distrust of the Sororitas by simply having an influential Ecclesiarchy official (perhaps a Cardinal?) command their assistance.

The character remains quite "unorthodox", as you said, though I still see the psychic powers and his perception of them as a greater issue.

@Carnage: This sounds very much as if your Inquisitor would at least end up stirring a lot of unrest, essentially splitting his audience into three categories:

  • "practical" people who have grown to trust him (likely only after lots of demonstrations regarding his loyalty)
  • sceptics who still don't really believe in him but go along with it, simply because they stick to the Creed and prefer caution over trust
  • paranoids who will only see his accomplishments as a distraction to cover his treachery, and many will try to warn others of it

Depending on where you look, I could think the clergy would be split equally across all these groups, whereas the vast majority of the Sisters would likely be counted amongst the last two groups. However, some Canonesses may be notable exceptions to this general rule, as due to their posting they have often become wrapped up in Imperial politics and confronted with many dirty secrets which may have tempered their zeal and convictions. It is perhaps ironic that the more senior and experienced Sororitas are often not as fanatic as their subordinates, probably because real life is quite different from what they were taught in the Schola Progenium. Their monastic lifestyle preserves this kind of "innocence" for a long time, often until their death, but in some cases, all depending on individual experiences, a Sister's perception may change throughout her career in a weird attempt to balance her faith with what she sees with her own eyes.

You bring up several excellent points.

I am well aware of the fact that the Convocation of Nephilim made the Orders Militant of the Adepta Sororitas the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus but I didn't include that knowledge in the interest of keeping my already lengthy posts as short as possible. However, I think that a Sister of Battle who is already directly attached to an Ordo Malleus Inquisitor's retinue would be exempt from those duties while still part of the retinue. You mentioned that a high ranking Cardinal could simply order the Adepta Sororitas to assist the Inquisitor. While I was planning on my Inquisitor having close ties with several high ranking members of the general Ecclesiarchy, the close relationship I mentioned my Inquisitor having with the Order of Our Martyred Lady would be the result of vigorous effort on the part of the Inquisitor. The way I have his background setup right now his infrequent visits to Ophelia 7 (he's the type that roams throughout Segmentum Obscuras and has just found his way to the Calixis Sector) always include a visit to the Canoness of the Order of Our Martyred Lady for a nice relaxing afternoon of theological debate ending with a visit to the Order's Chapel where each asks the blessing of the God-Emperor on the other as they part company. For the line members of the Order of Our Martyred Lady to accept that the Inquisitor as being "as trustworthy and valuable an ally to the Ecclesiarchy as a psyker can be" would have to come from the many occasions that he has fought alongside them (even when unasked), personal observance of his own pious devotion to the Imperial Creed, and even for the most "accepting" member of the Order reassurances from the Canoness herself.

I like that you mentioned how the older a Sister gets the more pragmatic they tend to become. The Palantine Ascended career description mentions the same thing and my group member who (if everything works out lorewise) wants to be the Sister of Battle and I have decided that she would be a Sister who has worked extensively with the Inquisitor before and trusts him as much as any Sister of Battle can trust a psyker (even such a strong-willed one with Inquisitorial psychic training). Indeed when he can my Inquisitor prefers that those Sisters seconded to his command be ones familiar with him and have fought beside him in battle before as long experience on the field of battle has taught him that a squad that doesn't trust him is detrimental to the success of the mission. Of course thats not always possible (say for example when a Greater Daemon might manifest itself from its possessed vessel at any moment) and so will take any squad available whether he's worked with them or not.

Perhaps I should have used a different word than "blessing" to describe his view of his psychic powers. Such delusions almost always lead to an Inquisitor going "off the reservation" and ending up as a dangerous heretic in the mold of Quixos. He has had hammered into him as an Interrogator under his master and by the Scholastica Psykana over and over the dangers associated with psychic powers. He knows the difference between the powers manifested by the Pure Faith talent and those of psychic origin. It was his burning faith in the God-Emperor and devotion to the Imperial Creed though that led him to survive the horrors of the Black Ships and what came after. Due to his convictions it was quite natural for him to assume that he had been granted them by the God-Emperor for a reason and upon being returned to his Inquisitor (who was the one who detected his powers in the first place through the use of his own psychic powers) he was taught as an interrogator that the reason that he was given these psychic powers was to combat the denizens of the warp in the God-Emperor's name. I hope that has cleared up any confusion over his own perceptions of his psychic powers.

In regards to the three reactions you described the general Ecclesiarchy as having I can definitely see him as taking issue with those who react the third way. He has a record of leading purges against heretics and mutants (often after the Ecclesiarchy has pronounced the need for one and it is during those purges that he has often fought alongside the Order of Our Martyred Lady) and being declared a heretic himself is something he and his supporters would not tolerate.

To me, the important thing to remember is that all Imperial organizations are ultimately comprised of people: people spanning a wide bell-curve of inclinations, beliefs, and philosophies. Even amongst the incredibly rigorous indoctrination of the Sisters there will always be an array of personalities, and amongst different branches of the organization these distinctions will be even more pronounced.

Firstly, the Ecclesiarchy is a MASSIVE behemoth of a bureaucracy, and it is no stretch of the imagination to presume that some individuals within it would be extremely tolerant and even friendly to such a pious servant of the Emperor, regardless of his abilities. If these individuals are highly placed enough, they can begin to influence the organization as a whole, where people with more puritanical mindsets find themselves taking a second look at your Inquisitor simply because he is spoken so highly of by the movers and the shakers. Never underestimate what I believe to be the core truth of 40k: humans are fundamentally the same then as they are now, and psychology and insight into human nature should inform the setting as much as the setting informs them. That's generally the key to any good sci-fi.

In short, because of the mind-boggling diversity of the Ecclesiarchy, it doesn't stretch the imagination to presume that literally anyone could get in their good graces if he tried hard enough, especially such an influential personage as an Inquisitor.

Sisters of Battle are, in this regard, much removed from the Church. Their smaller size, more rigorous training and upbringing, and wide-spread indoctrination means that their range of beliefs will be much smaller. Some of the blatantly supernatural Faith Powers they get, however, in addition to a well-thought out backstory of previous interractions, would probably mean that a certain contingent could be swayed to accept the Inquisitor as simply another tool in the Emperor's infinite plan. Detailing past experiences where the Sisters and the Inquisitor fought side by side out of necessity or command might eventually bring a certain grudging acceptance of his powers in the greater scheme of things, if they truly believe him to be a devout servant of the Throne. Perhaps go into depth with a particular Canoness whose life or convent was saved by the Inquisitor's psychic powers, or a similar circumstance. Then the majority of their interractions can take place within this shared history and specific relationship. It has the bonus of creating a dynamic and integral NPC with whom the player group is already intimately tied, which lays some good groundwork for later developments.

In short, listen to everything Lynata says about the Sisters because them's some serious fluff knowledges. Take what I say with a bit of salt.

In either case, I think your character is a good one, and the friction that will likely rub up between him and many powerful figures will most likely present an interesting influence balance in your game.

My question is what psychic powers does your Inquisitor possess? If he is primarily divination and telepathy based the subtle nature of those powers lend themselves to a less fractious relationship with the Ecclesiarchy than an Inquisitor flinging bolts of fire and crushing people with his mind. I would also suggest looking at the expanded Faith powers in Blood of Martyrs and see what cognates they might have among psychic powers (sorry, I'm at work or I'd do it myself). If you can find psychic powers that function similarly to one or more Faith abilities (which can be argued are simply expressions of mankind's innate psychic nature untainted by Chaos) its a simple matter to pass them off as "Blessings of the God-Emperor" from an in-game standpoint even if the mechanics themselves are different.

You asked this:

The biggest lore question I have is is it realistic for a powerful psychic Inquisitor of the Ordo Malleus to have such a close relationship with the Ecclesiarchy?

I think a better question would be:

Is it realistic for a powerful psychic Inquisitor of the Ordo Malleus to have such a close relationship with members of the Ecclesiarchy?

The reason why is simply the scale of the Ecclesiarchy itself. As others have said here, there would be an entire gamut of opinions regarding him. Some witch hunters in the Ordo Hereticus might come after him just for being an Inquisitor, roping elements of the EcclesiarchySoB into coming along. In the meantime, others in the EcclesiarchySoB itself would stand by his side based upon past deeds.

The bottom line is that he could be both lovedhated depending upon exactly who he was dealing with. In the meantime, until he's sure of the opinions of those with whom he's working, meeting, crusading, etc. it would probably be best for him to not blatantly show his "blessing."

For my Two Cents, as people has posted above, but thst will make little difference if your GM disagrees. If this Inquisitor is going to be a GM tool for a group of Thrne Agents then it's less necessary to flesh him out so.

A thing to remember is the Absolute power doesn't necassily corrupt absolutely but it certainly does hunger for more power. At Ascensioneven before then you have people in powerful places in every organsation within the 40K universe via'ing for power, the Inquistion member fight amongst themselves as do member of the Minstorum, Adminstratum,planetry governours even try to out do one another. So just becuase some members like you, other members are going to despise you, that's the nature of the beast.

Actually, the only powers I was planning on him to have are exclusively the ones from the Daemonsbane section of the Ascended Psychic Powers. He isn't the type to throw his psychic weight around every chance he gets. In fact, due to his militant mindset and the way his mentor trained him he doesn't use his psychic powers outside of combating Daemons and others the Daemonsbane psychic powers affect (I can't remember if they affect regular psykers and I can't seem to find my copy of Ascension ). Like many psychic Daemon Hunters he's also no slouch in regular combat and undergoes rigorous physical training and weapon exercises as part of his daily routine (it takes more than fancy psychic powers to take down a Greater Daemon and earn that Daemon Hammer). The Ignatus power armor helps too.

In regards to your suggestion that I rephrase how a psychic Ordo Malleus inquisitor would get along with the Ecclesiarchy I completely agree. I actually did mean certain members of the Ecclesiarchy (as there is no way the entire organization would get along with him its simple human nature) I just forgot to make the question more specific and less general. In fact that's why I specifically singled out the Order of Our Martyred Lady as due to the general intolerance of psykers among the Adepta Sororitas and his prior experiences fighting side by side with the Order of Our Martyred Lady it is far more likely that only that single Order would have a special relationship with him than all the Orders.

Also as I said in my last post "blessed" was probably a poor choice of wording. He doesn't go around like a crazed maniac who says he's blessed with psychic powers, in fact while he doesn't hide his psychic powers (although only using them when necessary) he doesn't discuss them unless he feels it relevant to do so. As I said in my previous post a more appropriate way to describe his view of them is as another tool given to him by the God-Emperor with which to better combat daemons. I did go over the Faith Powers in Blood of Martyrs however what I found did not do what I wanted to my satisfaction (which was to deal more damage to daemons or give me more protection from them or at least allow me to banish them back to the warp). The few that did interest me had prerequisite powers that I would probably never use for my character (although the Heirarch and proposed Palantine Battle Sister were going to invest in them). Besides background lore paints a strong picture of many Ordo Malleus inquisitors being very powerful psykers and that weapons such as Daemon Hammers and Psycannons have some psychic connection. Also while he nowhere nears their level of power or self-control, I noted the Grey Knights are all psykers and were specifically chosen for that reason as it let them better combat the daemonic threat (please note that I am not saying my proposed inquisitor is similar to a Grey Knight so please no comments explaining the differences between Grey Knights and Inquisitors). I concluded after reading the background lore that a psychic Daemon Hunter would be more appropriate in keeping with the background than a Pure Faith one. And besides, I'd rather save those Fate Points for the battlefield where I will need them in case I get in trouble with daemons than spending them to activate Pure Faith powers.

To address a misconception that another person had, the Inquisitor is my character and not the GM's. The GM for our group is the referee and the storyteller, he does not control my Inquisitor. As to the detailed background, that's something I do with all my characters and enjoy doing and many of the other members of my group enjoy doing also.

Hi Carnage. I like the character and think you have some good role playing opportunities on your hands, rather than having to worry about whether or not your character is consistent with fluff.

At Last Forgot hit the target pointing out that all those organisations are made up of people, and ultimately they will judge you on your actions most of the time.

Black Kestral had a good point asking what powers you had in mind. I've just had a good look at Ascension at the Demonsbane powers and the first sentence in the description of the second and third level powers is "The glory of the God Emporer...." and "The Psyker's belief in the power of the Emporer is so strong...". Heck, the NAME of the third level power is 'Word of the Emporer'.

With all that in mind i think your concept works very well and you will have no problem role playing that they are effectively faith powers.

As a last thought though, having the beliefs that your character does about other psykers may lead him to feelings of self loating, doing what has to be done. That will only work though if his faith in the Emporer is shaken because he belives they are His gifts.

Enjoy.

I think OP's Psyker is the type who should have actual Faith talents which he can purchase by the Firebrand Cell Directives in the Blood of Martyrs book.

If your Psyker can perform genuine miracles of Faith, I think some special consideration might be granted.

guest469 said:

If your Psyker can perform genuine miracles of Faith, I think some special consideration might be granted.

Don't you think this is a bit too far removed from the setting? I'm not aware of any psyker in the fluff performing miracles, and in fact I would believe that the combination of "witch + miracles" would break the Imperial Creed and thus push a lot of people in the Ecclesiarchy into a crisis of faith. After all, how can you justify witch hunts when the Emperor himself doesn't care? As per what the Ecclesiarchy teaches, the Psyker Gene is a curse .

Also it should be pointed out that part of the Faith powers in the Tabletop (which remains the basis for everything and thus likely shouldn't be discounted entirely) is an anti-psychic shield which negates psyker powers - even benign ones - when used on the Sisters. In essence, it appears as if witchery and faith are supposed to cancel each other out in terms of background.

Not to mention that psyker powers and Faith Talents might also be somewhat OP strictly from a mechanical point of view.

PS: The Firebrand Directive "only" allows you to purchase Pure Faith, not Faith Talents.

Not that I think anyone other than a Sororitas character should have Faith Talents by default (BoM made it way too easy, almost looks like an inflation there) anyways, but that's just my opinion. ;)

Lynata said:

Not that I think anyone other than a Sororitas character should have Faith Talents by default (BoM made it way too easy, almost looks like an inflation there) anyways, but that's just my opinion. ;)

Well, given that Preachers and Missionaries (and the Cardinal special character in Codex: Sisters of Battle) could lead a squad in Sacred Rites back in 2nd edition (as you probably know, the precursor to the Acts of Faith that turned up in 3rd edition and onwards), I don't think it's without precedent to give faith-related abilities to non-Sororitas characters now. If memory serves, in the old Chapter Approved Sisters of Battle list (the one before Codex: Witch Hunters), Priests counted as Faithful as well, providing more backing to the precedent.

N0-1_H3r3 said:

Well, given that Preachers and Missionaries (and the Cardinal special character in Codex: Sisters of Battle) could lead a squad in Sacred Rites back in 2nd edition (as you probably know, the precursor to the Acts of Faith that turned up in 3rd edition and onwards), I don't think it's without precedent to give faith-related abilities to non-Sororitas characters now. If memory serves, in the old Chapter Approved Sisters of Battle list (the one before Codex: Witch Hunters), Priests counted as Faithful as well, providing more backing to the precedent.

Yeah, but the same Preachers and Missionaries attached to a unit of Imperial Guard do not have this effect - so it does seem to be more about "stirring the Sisters' collective faith" rather than the characters pulling it off on their own. Acts of Faith in general were pretty much squad-based, which is why I've been comparing these miracles to the Orks' waaagh-field in the past, and explaining why only SoB armies had these special rules.

Last but not least, of course I also think that Acts of Faith should remain a trademark aspect of Sisters instead of being "whored out" that easily - I don't mind exceptions (read: Elite Advances sanctioned by the GM based on how a character is played and what happened in a game), but every Confessor or Redemptionist being able to pull this off by default just doesn't seem right to me. Not everyone is a Sebastian Thor, especially not in the Ecclesiarchy as it exists right now.

Then again, that's just my opinion, and we already know that it differs from the RPG on other occasions. ;)

Lynata said:

Yeah, but the same Preachers and Missionaries attached to a unit of Imperial Guard do not have this effect - so it does seem to be more about "stirring the Sisters' collective faith" rather than the characters pulling it off on their own.

- I don't mind exceptions (read: Elite Advances sanctioned by the GM based on how a character is played and what happened in a game), but every Confessor or Redemptionist being able to pull this off by default just doesn't seem right to me. Not everyone is a Sebastian Thor, especially not in the Ecclesiarchy as it exists right now.

I agree that Pure Faith should be somewhat "restricted". I am going to be starting a Dark Heresy game & plan to include an NPC cleric in the party. I was surprised to find that Pure Faith was not an option for him along the basic career path... at first. Then I started thinking about how corrupt the Ecclesiarchy can be & how thematically similar it is to the medieval church. I feel that if there is an especially pious cleric character, then the GM should definately offer Faith as an elite advance. That is quite adequate for the EXCEPTIONS to the rule.

Back on topic - While it may be a bit... off... for a Malleus Inquisitor to regularly work with the Sisters, each Inquisitor is highly (and willfully) individual. If he is able to secure such an alliance, great. Even if he was not able to gain their trust & cooporation, he can always fall back on the power of the rosette. Which brings me to my next point...

The Inquisition is hardly a well-oiled machine & varying levels of conflict often occur between the Inquisitors & their followers. I would imagine that at LEAST one or two Hereticus Inquisitors would have an issue with your "misuse" of THEIR chamber militant. If I were your GM, you can bet that you would earn at least one powerful rival/enemy as a result.

Just as an addendum:

Alpha Chaos 13 said:

I agree that Pure Faith should be somewhat "restricted". I am going to be starting a Dark Heresy game & plan to include an NPC cleric in the party. I was surprised to find that Pure Faith was not an option for him along the basic career path... at first. Then I started thinking about how corrupt the Ecclesiarchy can be & how thematically similar it is to the medieval church. I feel that if there is an especially pious cleric character, then the GM should definately offer Faith as an elite advance. That is quite adequate for the EXCEPTIONS to the rule.

Alpha Chaos 13 said:

The Inquisition is hardly a well-oiled machine & varying levels of conflict often occur between the Inquisitors & their followers. I would imagine that at LEAST one or two Hereticus Inquisitors would have an issue with your "misuse" of THEIR chamber militant. If I were your GM, you can bet that you would earn at least one powerful rival/enemy as a result.
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