A question came up about the timing on Shadow Politics during a game this week:
when can I use the effect of SP to initiate an Intrigue challenge?

What happened was that a player (who was not the first player) played SP. He then proceeded to immediately attempt the challenge, which I said he could not, but had to wait until it was his turn to initiate challenges. My rationale was that, at any point during the Challenges phase, only the active player may initiate challenges, and that the text on SP does not contradict this ("as a standard action" merely provides for challenges outside of the Challenges phase).

What should be the way to resolve this?

What about during the Marshaling phase? Can a non-active player initiate the challenge provided by SP?

the1andonlime said:

A player who has brought Shadow Politics out of shadows at the beginning of a phase is allowed to initiate the challenge at any time that he can legally take an action during that phase. Which phase it is has absolutely no bearing on that. That means you can initiate the challenge even if you are not the active player during the Challenge phase. The only limitation (specified in the FAQ) is that you cannot initiate your challenge from Shadow Politics during another challenge.

the1andonlime said:

Active Player status means nothing to Shadow Politics.

Hey, thanks for the quick reply.

So would I be right to say that the first opportunity to initiate the challenge provided by the effects of Shadow Politics would be during the first player action window of the phase that it was played from Shadows?

I.E.
Before choosing plots during the Plot phase,
Before drawing cards during the Draw phase,
After the first player counts gold during the Marshaling Phase,
Before the first player declares the first challenge during the Challenges phase,
After Dominance is rewarded during the Dominance phase,
After all cards stand during the Standing phase, and
After all unspent gold is returned to the treasury during the Taxation phase

Shadow Politics is boss.

Correct. Just remember player order in those windows. If someone other than the First Player reveals Shadow Politics, the First Player will have the chance to use a standard action before the Shadow Politics player does.

My apologies for the thread resurrection, but I needed to clarify something.

Do all players have to pass on a standard action before the First Player can initiate a Framework Action?

i.e. Can a player other than the First Player declare a challenge using Shadow Politics before the First Player gets to marshal a card or declare his/her first challenge?

the1andonlime said:

Yes. Otherwise the game would be unplayable. Players must be able to use cards like Orphan of the Greenblood etc.

the1andonlime said:

Yes, you can declare challenge from Shadow politics before normal challenges begin. Note that during marshalling phase the first player always has first action, so he will be able to marshall 1 card (or do anything), before you can declare challenge from Shadow politics.