Hell, if the British government can have caches of weapons (ranging from sidearms to anti-tank weapons) in all of their embassies across the world for the SAS to use should they be needed, I have no doubt that the Inquisition/Deathwatch can make sure to have a hidden weapon stockpile for when they need to in.

It would be a lot less complicated if the Marines would simply use the same kind of ammunition as everyone else - like they do in GW's fluff. Hence my suggestion of simply houseruling Guard rounds to fit and do the same damage. Furthermore, I'm sure the Inquisition does actually keep secret hideouts with reserve gear, but given how fractured this organization works I would not be surprised if most of them were created by and known only to individual Inquisitors and their closest allies (some trusted Acolytes and maaaybe one or two other Inquisitors). Facilities for an entire Ordo would be known amongst people with the appropriate clearance, but whilst being larger they would also few and far between. That said, there's nothing saying Deathwatch cannot happen to know one such Inquisitor who just happens to be able to give the players the coordinates to one of his stashes that just happens to be nearby.

Didn't know that about the SAS, by the way. Cool stuff.

Siranui said:

Hell, by the logic of WH40K, those should be better than fresh ammo!

MILLANDSON said:

The point is, by comparison, a real world country with an embassy is equivalent to a sector of the Imperium. Just as every small village in the real world lacks an arms locker for the SAS, so too would each planet of the Imperium be unlikely to have stores of arms and ammo for the Astartes.

MILLANDSON said:

Erm... citation? Smallarms are kept in embassies for the use of the military detatchment and close protection personnel there, rather than for if a Special Forces team turn up and forgot to bring any ammunition with them. Special Forces are kinda expected to bring their own kit... and of course the ammunition problem isn't worsened by the fact that Special Forces don't use obscure, rare, and horribly expensive ammunition that's not the same as pretty much everyone else's.

And as already said: There's a couple of hundred embassies and over a million planets in the Imperium. Bit of a difference in scale.

HappyDaze said:

How true, and how depressing

Lynata said:

This thread and discussion is based around the RAW interpretation of bolters and ammo, not around the house rules though, so that's not particularly helpful.

Lynata said:

Please stop (or start a new thread titled 'why is the deathwatch more powerful in the RPG' or some such so we can debate it to death ), the core book esentially states that the DW is as you imagine it sans the marines being at the beck and call of the Inquisitors, and the Reach is a very special circumstance and shouldn't be compared to the DW at large.

Lynata said:

It's a good point about the Inquisition being fractured- I like that aspect of it; puts more control in the GMs hands and more ambiguity in the plates of the players, they can't just assume they'll find everything they need, they have to think and ask and plan (and planning is half the fun)

I actually find the idea of an IG unit stockpiling ammo for Astartes weaponry kind of ridiculous. In the real world, an infantry unit doesn't stockpile tank rounds on the off-chance a tank unit wanders into their area and needs a resupply. It's up to a specific units chain of command to ensure proper logistics support.

Of course, all this is dependant on whether or not IG bolter ammunition is usable in Astartes class weaponry, which is apparently open to debate.

On a side note, I find the "3 magazine" limit that FFG recommends in the errata if you want to limit ammunition kind of ridiculous. The standard combat load in the US Army is 7 full magazines, and they're not wearing power armor.

arcticintel said:

If you read the errata again you will notice that a "3 magazine" limit is never mentioned, but 3 reloads is. A DW bolter comes stock with a fire selector which uses 3 magazines at a time. If you take the 3 reloads at face value, a marine with a boltgun would have 3 magazines loaded in the gun and 9 spare magazines on his person, plus 3 for his pistol, not including the one in the pistol.

Lynata said:

Are you sure about that?

From what I´ve read GW fluff doesn´t say that the same calibre is used, it just doesn´t go into detail about it.

The book clearly states on page 305 of the DW Corebook why and how the deathwatch were founded. The last paragraph above origins sections states that the DW are sometimes referred to as the Ordos Xenos chamber militant. Just like how the Adeptus Sororitas, and the Grey Knights are the Hereticus and Malleus respectively. These organizations work together against their intended foe, but remain separate entities! Division of power first off is rife within the 40k universe, hell Dark heresy's fluff and the previous inquisition codexs (and now current codex) always speak of this division of power! A chapter is an entity that in all respects a "peer of the Imperium" just as the Sororitas and the Mechanicus, Imperial Militants, Rogue traders, and Inquisitors are "equals" in a sense. Not many would dare oppose the Inquistions will, but some do, especially the Astartes! Second the Deathwatch rule book went to an extent explaining this division of power and how it is managed in the organisation section. It made perfect sense to me, and my already huge interest in deathwatch (Modeled my captain with a deathwatch shoulder pad to signify his time in the shadowy chapter). IT IS NOT a codex adherent chapter! There is no stated number of Deathwatch members. Also show me a loyalist marine who would not fight traitorous forces? Especially Chaos Marines?

Back to topic,

I agree with Luddite's methods of handling an important roleplaying aspect. Your players characters should always take the time to figure out logistics of resupply, especially for planned or unexpected prolonged missions. If that is how you as a gm wish to add as an element to the game. I know in in the star wars (d&d ruleset) we tried to keep track ( I took several bandoliers stuffed with ammunition! Never ran dry!)

Drop podding resupply

Thunderhawk airborne supply drop

Bandoliers

Ground vehicle transport (landspeeder, rhino, landraider even!) carrys additional ammo

I really like the idea of Inquisition store houses. If I remember from the Bolter and Chainsword forum, someone there had a well written short story that described a planet where (similiar to the watch stations) an Inquisitorial Obilitae is what he called it. Essentially a place to bring people for interrogation, small medical facility, data archive, and where a small armory is found too. again very much like the watch stations mentioned in deathwatch. Still It is a good idea, and would add a small element of inquisitorial interest in the planet, or even the actions if the kill team was desperate enough to try and get into said =][= place.

Edited for some grammar issues and spelling errors

Also, why not make a bit of a RP situation out it and have the players rendevous with a team of Inquisitorial Storm Troopers that are skulking in some ruins / undergrowth with dufflebags full of Astartes Bolt rounds etc.

Since the game mechanics are inconsistent with the fluff anyhow, for my game I just made a decision that normal "civilian" bolter shells are shortened with a much weaker charge and incompatible despite being the same caliber and Astartes Bolts are basically higher quality versions of "normal" Heavy Bolter shells (which are also 0.75 caliber), with Astartes Heavy Bolts are their own larger thing (1.0 caliber). This is (amusingly enough) actually consistent with the Fantasy Flight fluff as both Dark Heresy and Rogue Trader simply say that the standard bolter shell is 0.75 caliber and that Heavy Bolters use "a much larger version of the standard bolt shell with more propellant for greater distance and stopping power." This simplifies logistics in war zones greatly- Heavy Bolters are reasonably common squad support weapons in Imperial forces and therefore any military ammo cache worth speaking of is probably going to have a lot of "normal" Heavy Bolter rounds that a Deathwatch squad can use to resupply their basic weapons without a GM having to resort to orbital drops and Inquisitorial Logistics Ninjas. Just note that they need to subject their guns to the Rites of Field Cleansing more often to keep their Bolter's machine spirits happy with the lower quality ammunition they're being fed and be on your merry way. The only ones who potentially lose out with this solution are Devastators on long campaigns, and honestly if you've located a military supply source with bolter shells then they can probably scrounge up at least a missile launcher or "normal" Heavy Bolter to use.

Face Eater said:

I would, but isn't it a bit more sensible to just carry a half-dozen spare magazines in a satchel.