It seems that logistically speaking, the Deathwatch have a major hurdle to overcome, due to the fact that bolters used by Space Marines use different types of bolt shells that are incompatible with Imperial Guard bolters. So resupply seems like it should be a major issue for Deathwatch Marines, since unless their is already a Space Marine presence in their theatre of operations, it should be almost impossible to resupply on bolter ammunition in the field.

For example, I'm having a hard time seeing how supply dumps in Final Sanction would allow them to resupply on bolter ammo, considering the above about incompatibility issues with Imperial Guard bolters.

Yup: You're right. I imagine that Erioch literally owns thousands of tons of ammunition, but Astartes bolter ammo is going to be hard to get in the field. It's probably safe to assume that kill-teams are sent off on missions with a few crates of the stuff in the ship, or stowed in their transport. There's a chance that some navy vessels will also have lockers that require Astartes biometrics to open that contain spare ammunition et al, just in case Marines are on board and need resupply.

The way I dealt with that is there was a small section set aside with Space Marine quality ammunition in the case of a situation such as that came up. It's not a stretch of the imagination. It's not like it's an entire armory, more like basic ammunition for Space Marines (Bolt rounds, promethium, etc).

Where promethium should be the least problem as imo it's the same for Astartes or guard Flamers. Just the quantity used will differ.

What I am asking myself is: Does it have to be a different caliber alltogether? Or is it perhaps just a little different in the kind of propellant used and the metal used for the projectile. So perhaps the SM could, in an emergency, use the normal boltrounds instead. With the lower damage ofcorse

Compare it to RL ammo using lead or depleted uranium.

It the SM bolt ammo has:

• a stronger explosive to propell it out of the barrel, one that would destroy a civilian boltgun
• a better propellant for the rocket boost, that generates too much heat for a normal firer and gun to withstand without harm
• a denser projectile that could not be fired effectively without the first two

Combined you would get a kind of ammo very much superior to what normal boltguns use. But it could not be used by civilian operators because the recoil would be too great, the gun itself would be damaged by every shot and the firer would get burned unless properly protected.

Just an idea. I don't know if the fluff said somewhere that it's another calibre.

It is a different Bolt caliber entirely.

Also the promethium is a MUCH better quality than regular Guard issue.

Everything the Space Marine uses is basically considered Best Quality or better anywhere else.

Caliber is only a measure of diameter and not an indicator that a particular weapon can chamber a round.

My view is that an Astartes bolt round would be longer than a mortal bolt round. Along the lines of a .50 AE pistol round compared to a .50 BMG machine gun round.

There is always the question of the honour of the bolter; would a SM "dishonour" the spirit of the bolter by using lesser ammunition? Even in extreme circumstances?

DW

I build in supply options to my missions. Resupply comes from a few sources (and are mostly handled narratively)....

1) Carried with team - what the unit themselves can hump. Options for additional ammo, including ammo cases, exist.

2) On team vehicles - a good resource for topping off magazines. Extends the team's ammo supply.

3) Nearby active support resources - supplies can be brought in by the Rapid Strike Vessel/Strike Cruiser that deployed them via Thunderhawk, sent in via supply pod, etc.

4) On-site caches - I assume the Ordo Xenos and/or Deathwatch itself has established hidden operational caches on some planets, particularly large, important Imperial worlds. The team would need to find these for supply.

5) Improvise, Adapt & Overcome

6) Pull out the combat knife.

In Final Sanction specifically, I had the hope of resupply lie in the Imperial Stores, where the Quatermaster (or whatever the equivialent in 40k is) was a veteran of prior Imperial conflict, and always tried to requisition a smidge of 'the good stuff' in case other Imperial allies were in need of some support. He had a special stock he used to help the PCs.

I also allowed the KT to resupply using 'civilian' grade ammunition that did 'civilian' grade damage- I though about increasing jam rates and the like to represent using ammo that doesn't theoreticaly work in a larger gun designed to fire cooler rounds, but opted not to seeing as the reduction in damage was already a handicap.

And the fluff does NOT say it's a different caliber- bolt guns and pistols are .75, HB are 1. Uncertain covers the rest, as do other threads on that portion of the topic.

Talkkno said:

Only in this RPG, not in the 20 years of GW fluff that came before. I think you can easily houserule the compatibility - it would fit better to the setting, anyways, and might create some interesting roleplaying situation for awkward Astartes<->Guard interaction.

It should be mentioned that bolt weapons aren't really common for the Guard, however. As the normal situation has a few Commissars and senior officers using bolt pistols and heavy weapon teams using heavy bolters, your Kill-Team will likely find a lot more caliber 1.00 ammunition than 0.75 when they're searching a Guard armoury. If the respective unit is equipped with heavy bolters, anyways. The characters could easily restock their heavy bolters, but may get into trouble getting supplies for their basic guns.

I have taken several fluff things in mind. There are two sizes of bolter rounds one for human and one space marine. I put it like this human bolter shells for pistols, bolters and storm bolters are all .50ae caliber. The space marine bolt shell is .75 caliber but heavy bolters are actually the further size of 1.caliber similar to a 30mm cannon shell. The quality or the potency of space marine grade weapons are of course much better though it is also the simple fact they are bigger as well that give them that extra damage.

Now in regards to supplies I took it that in the vast stores houses on imperial worlds there is always a supply of space marine grade ammunition, see I imagine that the space marines like any good mobile force carries everything it needs normally. A space marine squad generally should have some sort of support such as a thunderhawk along with whatever ship brought them to the world they are on and that should be able to resupply them. But going back to what I was saying, I think it would be well within the realm of thought that the Departmento Munitorum would ensure that every world has a cash of basic Space Marine ammunition in one of its armored magazines.

Siranui said:

Actually, that's covered by 5.

Nuada_Obliage said:

So if we go with RAW and assume the bolts are different, the quesion stands as to whether or not the Departmento Munitorum would get to put their paws on the equipment in the first place, given that the Marines are outside and separate from the Adeptus Terra?

Because it's not the Munitorum that makes the ammunition. The Munitorum can ask for whatever supplies it deems fit, but whether they can put it to use is something different. Arranging for some forward supplies just sounds like good planning to me.

Data007 said:

True, but I know the Astartes have 'special' relationships with forge worlds and the like. I don't know enough about that political side of things to really speak knowelgably on the topic. Though it does sounds like good planning, I wouldn't expect many of the bean counters to do such a thing without direction from particularly thoughful individuals such as the Astartes themselves, governors of particularly volitile territories, or high commanders with a knowledge and/or relationship to the Astartes

You know, I just thought: How did the Kill-Team get to where they are in the first place?

If we assume they were transported by one of the now-independent Chapter's many warships (before the RPG's retcon this was arranged for by the Inquisition using Navy resources), surely it would have a lot of ammunition stored somewhere? A Marine could probably even vox the ship and ask for an airdrop. And if - for whatever reason - the ship is unable to remain in orbit for the duration of the mission they could still leave ample supplies in the landing zone, likely onboard a Thunderhawk that will otherwise remain grounded until the team returns.

PrimarchX said:

Really? I'd rate using a small, sharp piece of metal to assault an enemy position somewhere after every other form of improvisation...

I don't see it as overly likely that every back-water planet has an Astartes arms locker, but I do see it as entirely likely on Navy vessels.

Lynata said:

Perfectly reasonable explanation, though I'd be hesitant to leave ammo and gear in the zone in many cases if I were the KT.

I like the idea of hidden resupply cache scattered about the Imperium under everyone's noses.

There certainly are lots of statues and murals of the Astartes and the Emporer everywhere you go...

Siranui said:

When you get to improvise, adapt and overcome you're pretty much down to a pointy stick. My statement before on (4) was that important Imperial worlds would likely have cache locations - as part of an Inquisitorial facility or a completely hidden vault of supplies for example.

If the Imperium can keep the massive forces IG and IN supplied, then the comparatively minuscule needs of the AA are not going to be an issue.

HappyDaze said:

You say this and then you read the inane explanation that the IG uses Lasguns because it eases the logistical load. Puh-lease. Small arms ammo is the least of your supply concerns. If you're providing what seems like every platoon with a Heavy Bolter why not give them regular bolters, too? Just not in the fluff, I suppose.

Because a heavy bolter is a section/platoon level weapon. If you had a 10 of them in a company you could go through a good pile of ammo, but a company or regiment of guardsmen firing lasguns all day, they probably need a small power plant to kept them charged. I don't think guardsmen get taught alot of fire control, more likely it's shot the Xenos till it stops moving. The amount of ammo the whole Guard could go thorough in a day would most likely strip planets bare of lead, brass and cordite. Not to mention the logistics of getting it to them, it would be a big enough pain to keep the stocked on heavy bolter and autocannon rounds, missiles, a multitude of shell types and sizes, boots, uniforms, armour, food, water, shelter, fuel, naughty magzines, weapon cleaning kits ,and the Infantryman's Uplifting Primer.

PixelLibFront said:

Ahhh yes, the basic necessities of a soldier.