We have played about 10 sessions of RT now, and things are going well, but get the feeling that the players don't know about all their options since none of them have bought the RT book. There is no chance of powergaming this way, but also much less initiative from the players.

To get more out of the sessions they will have to learn the rules better, so is it OK to make them by the RT book?

Well, i doubt you can force them, but if you can persuade them with good reasons for having the core rulebook...

No, it's not OK to demand that your players buy the book. Suggest sure, but not demand.

My players were all eager enough to buy the books themselves after we'd started playing (One of them wants to buy every single FFG 40k rulebook released!) but I wouldn't see a problem with not letting them use my books in the middle of the game. It drags things out too much.

Our GM suggested us to buy the book, but simply offered up 100 extra starting XP to anyone who did. Not much by any means (good roleplaying will net you a lot more), but still fun. It also allowed us to lend out our books to those who didn't want to buy the core rulebook.

Forcing players to buy a book will likely loose you most of them. Giving them an incentive to do so that doesn't penalise the others to much should be ok.

Also: it might be a better idea to give them links to relevant sites in order to increase their knowledge of the universe. And at any rate there's just as much downs as there are ups to your players knowing more of the verse. In the end you are the GM so it's your version of the 40k universe. You can get some very annoying discussions if they do buy the books and you rule otherways or explained it differently in the past.

We did it with another system, but most players never open their own books anyway even after 2 years in the same campaign...

I played another group and they had read the book before the game and no one had bought it but where planing if they enjoyed the system and where thinking of doing a regular game.

It's mostly a personal thing, do you have proactive players?

If the group likes the system and the setting, by all means suggest that they buy the core book. If 40k is something you only play once in awhile then perhaps it's not that big of a deal. As Crisaron said, it's mostly a personal thing.

This is why my players love me.

I spend my weekends typing out quick-reference rules in easy to open .txt files for them to look at.

Also, creativity and innovation in tabletop gaming can't really be taught by a rulebook. Players either use the environment around them or they don't. One thing that might help is to ask them to narrate their actions instead of just saying "Half Action [Aim], Half Action [Attack]". This means a little bit more work for you as you have to interpret their narrative actions into appropriate game actions, but it might make them think outside the box as they try to describe their movements in cinematic style. I.E. "I leap towards the nearest metal crate in the cargo bay for cover, guns blazing as I do"

I'm with Fortinbras, I have all sorts of help guides made available via Google Docs for people.

One suggestion, if they are worried about cost (cuz Emporer knows these books are pricey) is to do what I did. I bought them in PDF form from Drive Thru RPG and just posted them for everyone to download. Core book is like 25 bucks, and you could split it up among your group pretty easily, since everyone would have access.

Johan B said:

If I am buying the book and taking the time to GM(for alot of us that means we probably have alot more then just the core book), they my players better have thier own book, own dice, own pencil and paper. Really just out of courtesy if nothing else, I do not want to have to loose my page to hand over my book to someone that does not have one and needs to look up something.

I'd be a bit leery about recommending people go out and illegally download PDF's of books they don't own and distribute them to others. Keyword being distribute. As long as you're controlling the files and you own the hard-copy already, I don't see the problem, in fact I have a PDF copy here at home so my wife can read it upstairs while I'm downstairs with the book collection, but sending it to other players to store a copy on their own hard drive strikes me as quasi-illegal at worst, and at best; cheating FFG out of their well-deserved royalties.

Transcribing a .txt file with the bare-bones rules and no pictures or any of the narrative backstory/gameplay examples is one thing. Full-color reproductions is another.

PantsCommander said:

You do know that's illegal, right? You've just engaged in copyright theft.

Well, another thing to do is buy a spare book as the whole group and then share that book amongst all the players. That way the book is cheap, players can take it home to read through the sections they are interested in and best of all: No copyright infringements!

Still, that means the GM forking out more of their own money to buy a second copy of the book. I'd suggest trying to persuade them to get the books, but you shouldn't force them to get them.

Having reread the Drive Thru RPG license, it appears I was mistaken. For some reason I figured this was a grey enough area (since it's not publically available using only legally purchased files), but I can see the arguments from the other direction.

Either way I'd still recommend using Drive Thru for fiscally minded players.

Again, just wanted to make clear that I'm talking legally purchased files. FF is local business for me, no desire to cheat them

First off, let me say that I don't actually intend to force people, more like strongly urge or warmly suggest. =)

The players are probably not the sorts to actually read the book too much, I.e. learn the rules by heart, learn powerplay strategies etc. so that's something I would have to provide anyway, and I prefer it that way to be honest...

What I guess I feel is that the players have missed out on the fluff and background in the books. It limits their scope, and I stuggle to convey the huge amuont of freedom and mystery which is available to them.

I have decided to give them an RT corebook for their birthdays (when they come up) It's a more positive way of going about it.

Yeah, I'll start to write up factsheets I think. Have been trawling darkreign for good templates.

Personally I feel that I earn enough to support FFG by buying their products. Nothing creative will ever be done if customers are not prepared to support creativity with business. Writers and artists you like and enjoy need more than encouragement, they need money. That's a very tangible and appreciated form of support . I'm sure most people here agree with me on this one.

PantsCommander said:

*The Emperor scentences you to flagellation and fasting!" WP-5 for one week!

No worries =)

Johan B said:

They may not be that sort now, but if they buy the book themselves they will probably read it, and you never know what crazy combos will stick in their head after that. And if you're reasonably certain they won't read the book anyway, then urging them to buy it is basically asking your friends to throw away their money.

Johan B said:

The rulebook may well have some fluff in it, but the majority of the the text is rules. If your primary desire is to show them the fluff of the 40k universe, there's plenty of it out there on the internet, for free. The youtube idea isn't a bad one. Start each session with a video or two of something 40k-related.

Johan B said:

Well it's definitely better than expecting them to buy their own, I suppose. It's not something I would do myself, though. Mainly because of the expense (the same reason I wouldn't ask them to buy their own copy), but also because I suspect having the rulebook will inform them more about the rules than about the fluff, which seems to be the thing you're after.

No

I have made quick reference sheets and laminated them with things like combat modifiers, influence and much more.

If they buy a book fine, but otherwise they get to fight over mine when they level up.

On several occations I have borrowed my own books to a player between sessions so they might study it.

Buying should never be forced, if they do so they must do so out of own interest.

regards

In my years as a story teller, I can deffinately agree that it is frustrating when players do not realize the potential thier characters could have if they just read up on what they can do however; demanding that players buy books is like playing Russian Roulette, some will gladly jump on the bandwagon just so that they can have a copy of thier own, but most will scoff at you and either make your sessions more difficult because they are frustrated at you for demanding they spend thier money on your game, or just leave the game alltogether.

In my experiance it is far easier to look at a couple of different options for players to read up on what thier character can do.

#1 Offer a minimal xp bonus (I usually don't use this one because I try to keep in mind that in some cases bonus xp can offset the game unless the entire party is getting the bonus)

#2 Sit down with the player between sessions and explain to them what options they overlooked at character creation and explain to them how these options (and others) would help thier character. After the conversation offer for them to borrow the book.

#3 Build a villanous NPC that is a mirror of the character (one of my favorites) and show them through good role playing what that character is capable of. For most players seeing a clone of them in action using the full potential of the class usually inspires them to read more.

I have also considered one of the options that I have read in this forum, to make print outs, or cheat sheets if you like the term better, and hand them out to the players. I know I will be using this idea for my Rogue Trader game since I have several players that want to play the game but are not fluent in the 40K universe so giving them sheets to explain who is who and what certain things mean is going to help them a lot.

PantsCommander said:

While copying your legal pdf and distributing it to your friends is not permitted, you could print out the pages relevant to them and give it to them during the session (for example the career path of each player, or the different parts of the equipment section). This would keep everything legal (AFAIK), give each player only the relevant information for his/her character, and would no longer necessitate each of your players to buy their own book.

Red Bart said:

This is what I did with the Career Advancement tables. The player of the Navigator went a bit further and used cut & paste to make a reference sheet for her Navigator powers and some of the relevant Talents.

I'm of the opinion that people should at least have the books with the character options they use, which in most cases is just the core book.

If your intention is to let them know what the 40k world is about, buy some of the novels ( "Eisenhorn", "Horus Heresy"the like)visit one of the 40k wiki sites ( lexicaneum.com ).

By far the best option, as mentioned already, is to let them be the unknowing, naive RT noobsshow them how twistedwicked the 'verse is by roleplaying their opponentsallies.