Morning Everyone

I need some rules clarification please. This weekend we had our first game of Tannhauser - using the revised rules and base set only. I was playing Union, my friend was playing Reich - we were playing the Castle Map - Death Match. Things were going well for the Union - I quickly managed to wipe out ShockTruppen, Stosstrupen and Eva. The small victory was only brief though as Shocktruppen was called back via reinforcement medal (giving Reich an extra 2 command) and Stosstrupen came back with his "Not Dead Yet" trait. Both were summarily killed again however.

Then it came down to finishing off the straglers. I was confronted by Hermann Von Heïzinger, who was using his Hermetica Occult. Here is where we had our first argument.
He was in the middle of the room - "Any character lacking the Obscura Korps unit affiliation symbol who wishes to move into a circle on your path must win a Mental duel (which does not require an action) against you first"

OK - so "circle on your path" - If Hermann is on a multicoloured circle - does he get all the colours on his circle as all the paths? Does he have to chose 1 path colour per turn?

How do Union win mental battles against Hermann? - I basically tried with all my troops - couldn't manage it - even with a command point boost. He seems very powerful - he was using Patmos Amulet to basically mind control my team every turn. I didn't have any grenades left to throw at him - as I expended them all in the first few turns on the other troops (mental note to save them for Hermann!).

If Hermann backs into one of the corridors of the map - and blocks the only leading path (coloured red) - there is, as far as I can see, no way to kill him - you can't go on the red path - unless you win a mental attack - which is slim to none comparing his mental abilities to the rest of the Unions mental abilities. So the game could end in a stalemate with Hermann blocking the path - and the Union not bothering because anyone who does get close is mind controlled.

Also - in the revised rules - is there clarity on the Occult Hermetica stating somewhere that it can only be used on one path (and colour) at a time?

Any other advice on send Hermann to the grave?

Many thanks
J

First I suggest you check out my Tannhauser University articles on my blog, I just did one on Hermann. There's a link in my signature, and a thread here called Tannahuser for Beginniers.

As for killing him, he is extreamly hard to defeat when he is using his Command Pack, especialy in Deathmatch. In Deathmatch there is now real way to force him on to path, where you can attack him. And that's really what you need to do because you don't have to fight the Mental Duel if Hermann moves on to a color your on, then you can shoot him, but in DM there's no reason for him to do that.

Thanks Miah - had a look at your blog - most useful!

Specifically for the Occult Hermetica though - and the paths - if Hermann is standing on a multicoloured circle (say at the junction of all three paths) - is the movement restriction in place for all three paths or just one of the paths (of Hermann's chosing)?

The official rules quote: "Occult, Hermetica • Any character lacking the Obscura Korps unit affiliation symbol who wishes to move into a circle on your path must win a Mental duel (which does not require an action) against you first. Losing the duel does not prevent that character from continuing his movement, it simply prevents him from moving into a circle on your path. A given character may only initiate this Mental duel once per activation. This duel must be fought each time a character wishes to enter into a circle on your path."

From what I read - if Hermann is standing on a circle with multiple colours - he is on multiple paths - from the quote above "wishes to move into a circle on your path" then he is on all three paths - and the Union player could not enter any of these paths. Which - as you state - leads me to believe that Hermann would have to move into a Union Players path for the Union player to have any chance of killing Hermann. Seems rediculously broken if it is to be played that way. If we were playing it wrong - and it applies to a single coloured path - then sure the Union has some kind of a chance to use another path to close in on Hermann. THAT rule makes sense to me. The official rules (if I am reading them right) don't make sense at all (in DeathMatch mode) as when the Reich player gets down to just Hermann - he can force a stalemate with players spending turns and turns trying to break through the mental barrier.

Your reading the rules right, the Union player would not be able to move on to any of the colours that Hermann occupies.

This is why Hermann should be your first target in Deathmatch, if playing on the Castle map, and the Reich is coming down the stairs you need to get to Hermann as fast as possiable, and start throwing Grenades/TNT.

But this is also why in my opinion Tannahuser is not really ment to be played in Deathmatch mode (other than to learn the rules). In a secenario or most other modes you can force Hermann into a dangerous path and take him out.

One other way to kill him is with Ramirez's Brothers Bomb, or maybe even Hound Dog, as "they" can get to Hermann without fighting the Mental Duel, also Voivodes can chanel a Magnifier attack to him (they don't have to fight the duel either).

I'm not sure the rules are broken, and as you'll probably learn I hate houserules, I prefer to find a tactic to get around a problem rather than alter the rules to make the problem go away. But if you want a houserule, here's one: "Only Combat Packs in Deathmatch" this solves most problems with DM mode.

Hope that helps.

I think you forgive an important specification, Thannhauser F.A.Q./Errata Corrige said

“Q: When exactly can a Trooper be sent in as a reinforcement? Is this possible in a 2 Command Point game?
A: Reinforcements are introduced at the start of a turn, before any characters are activated. In a 2 Command Point game, there is not currently a way to introduce reinforcements using Command Points.”

To use a medal (like Iron Cross 1st or 2nd Class, Silver Star, etc…), you have to do an action, and before that the character must be activated: so you can’t recall a reinforcement.

I don’t know if exist a “reinforcement medal (giving Reich an extra 2 command)”, I think you refer to Eva’s Iron Cross 1st Class, that was activated by Eva (like her action) before Eva’s death. But during the Refresh Token, rules say “Unused CPs from the previous turn are always lost, even if they arose from an unusual source, such as from equipment or a create”.

So I think you spent your time (turns) and used your equipment for an unbalanced combat, with a Shocktruppen in surplus.

I hope to be not mistaken.

Miah like that we share the same opinion , that you hate house rules (so do I ) a that DM mode is for teaching only. Because in other modes you see more balance in the game. In dm it's quite hard to win against Union since it has biggest firepower, on other modes when it's not just about big guns, the game is more balanced. My favourite is objective mode because you have to pick character according to their skills not just stats and stuff they get . Oh and scenarios, I love those.