My GM would like to test his tactical skills in the (arguably) over-powered for the GM

expansion SOB. To do this, he is allowing our 4-man team to choose our Hero and

his/her starting Skill. We have every expansion, but I think he said he's missing a

couple of "promotional" characters.

SO, using any Character and any skill from

the available expansions, what party would you put together- bearing in mind the

limitations of SOB (skills unuseable in the expansion are still unuseable)?

Zyla's built-in flight makes her good in encounters, and lets you buy Swim for someone else. That can get 2 heroes up in a lieutenant's face. It also saves her a skill, since she doesn't need Acrobat.

Plus, assuming that you're using the actual errata and not the promised errata that never came, once the OL is 25 conquest ahead Zyla is worth 0 and can start soloing levels. Even without this bit of cheese (which won't actually help you win the campaign) she's on of the best (if not the best) runner in the game.

McCordRM said:

I am categorically against using the 'promo' heroes that were not designed by FFG, especially Tobin, so I'll leave those out of the mix. If you are not, Tobin is ridiculously good in SoB and would take #2 slot and Kel is also extremely good and would be a strong candidate for #4 slot.

1. Runemaster Thorn with Koll's Mark. The teleport ability he has makes him the single most important hero a party can have with the wide open spaces in encounters and on islands.

2. Laurel of Bloodwood with Keen Sight. Her overpricing in CT is not so important in SoB where Divine favour helps keep CT score closer together regardless of other factors. Pure damage dealing is key, and her potential, even in copper, is highest of all (consider for example the Feat that gives +8 range, or cannons with +4/7 range). Keen Sight is critical for anti-shadowcloak (especially with cannons and long range shots) and also has the great +1/+1 which is effectively +2/+1 for her a lot of he time.

3. Tahlia with Tiger Tattoo/Weapon Mastery/Defender. But pretty much any decent tank will do here, preferably faster rather than slower. This hero will get the least priority out of the 4 during the game, often missing out on personal training upgrades as the least important party member needs to upgrade the ship or check the market/tavern etc. Your Ranged hero will hit harder, your mages and runners go faster and hit more often, if not harder. The poor old melee hero is pretty much a backup roll in SoB if the rest of the party is strong - the main function is to man the wheel of the Revenge....

4. Choice of 3, all very, very useful.
Astarra with Captain/Alchemist/Tiger Tattoo/Spry/Runner - your ultimate runner, even with the glyph ability reduced to 3 spaces. She is also a handy mage in her own right.
Carthos with Blessing - Pure damage dealing, great with cannons, and the Blessing adds +1/+2 effectively to Laurel...
Zyla with Runner/Tiger Tattoo/Spry - your other ultimate Runner.

I think your OL (what is this GM nonsense!) is in for a world of pain, and will then win anyway unless you get lucky in some encounters.

If anything, I'd suggest your main melee character (yes, Talhia's probably the best around) to go around with Shark Tattoo...far too good on outside encounters.

If you're allowed to use Tobin, then use him, since he definitely rocks in outside encounters in SoB. As for Kel, I usually prefer having only 1 mage in the party and in SoB I'd definitely go for Thorn, thanks to his teleport.

My favourite party would be something like:

Thorn + damage dealing abilities

Tobin + same as above. If you haven't Tobin in your rack, then go for Laurel.

Talhia + Shark Tattoo and damage dealing stuff (but if you can choose skills then also some other melee characters have pretty juicy combos, like Glyr, Corbin and others...but always remember: Shark Tattoo)

Zyla + whatever fits for a good runner.

Also, if you can choose skill and you have Talhia you should definitely give someone Leadership AND I'd give someone Pickpocket (I know Corbon shall definitely hate me for that). Now I run a few more campaigns I've slightly changed my idea on Pickpocket. If you have to spend money/xp on it, it's worthless. If you have it from the beginning it gives you a nice advantage, since it can really speed up your upgrade rate in the first part of the game, which is also the most influential for the outcome of the campaign. Of course, give it to one of your mass damage dealer (Tobin is a very good candidate, since he tends to single-shot a lot), definitely not to Zyla who's not going to kill anyone at least in the beginning, which is when you need the extra income the most.

Elric of Melniboné said:

There is no Leadership in SoB.

I couldn't hate you for suggesting Pickpocket, it is just a gross mis-application in mathematics. In your case, since it has been explained to you thoroughly, it appears to be a gross refusal to understand opportunity cost principles and actual (final) cost principle - well, those might not be the correct names, but they are the best I can think of to describe the problems with Pickpocket at the moment. Your own advice contains some of the seeds of your failure to comprehend... every time you buy a new skill, the cost of that skill is the current cost (amount you spent) of pickpocket.
But it's not something to hate over.

Shark Tattoo is a total waste because it simply doesn't do anything. Your melee hero's primary job in encounters is to man the wheel. Buying Shark Tattoo just encourages a generically slow hero to chase around vast empty spaces, making themselves unnecessarily vulnerable to sharks, giving the monsters an opportunity to man the Revenge's wheel themselves (the easiest way they can win most encounters) and usually for virtually no reward (Lts are virtually always faster and should always start so far away as to make getting to them a practical impossibility for all but the very fastest heroes). And on island levels the melee hero should be able to glyph to town first or second turn and then come back through the island glyph if the rest of the part and players are halfway competent. All in all, Shark Tattoo is most about half as useful as Tough...
I have to admit though, that I thought it was an important skill until I actually used it (or didn't, pretty much) in a campaign (at least with a dwarf the 2W are really quite important).

Corbon, I might approve what you say about Shark Tattoo, I had actually read on many treads it was useful, but since I haven't still played SoB (just RtL), I trust your considerations. As for Leadership, my bad, I didn't check it...Without Leadership and Unmovable around, though, I must say that Talhia loses about half her awesomeness to me. All considered, Hawthorne, Glyr, Varikas or Corbin (if you want a tank) might be better...Perhaps even Hugo The Glorious might be interesting, since he's almost undestroyable, but it should be tested before anyone can say.

As for pickpocket you always seem to miss the point that there may be things more useful than additional skills in the first part of the campaign, like equipping the party or buying dice very early on, something no skill allows you to do better than pickpocket. Gaining something like 400 extra coins per dungeon/100 extra per encounter can really make some difference. I've run a few campaigns with pickpocket and a few without it and I can surely tell the difference in the early outcome. I've also tested buying it early on in the campaign, and can say it's not worth spending 1000GC and 10XP once you can. I prefer experience-based considerations to math-based. That's why I appreciated a lot your opinion on Shark Tattoo.