So, we have been playing 2nd Edition lately and after playing Dark Heresy a lot, we are having a hard time not complaining about how out of date WFRP 2nd Ed is. And because we have read some of the stuff in the 3rd edition, we have been talking about certain things that would help our games that 3rd Ed has in it's rules (one big example recently was the party card and how conflicts within the party effect the whole group mechanicly).

And now I am ef'n trying to get the rest of the players in our group to get our Warhammer Fantasy GM the new rules his birthday (in a month).

I think by that time, we will have completed and uses most of the 2nd ed books that our GM has collected and he might just get into the new one. Especially now that those hard back books allow you to pick and choose the components you want to use for the game.

So, whatever you jerks! I admit it... I was wrong.

BTW, what is the difference between the Player's tool kit and the player's vault?

Glad you are giving the game a chance;

The player's vault contains the bits from the core set used by the players (careers, party sheets, action cards and the like), the adventurer's toolkit contains additional components (10 more careers, more action cards, different party sheets and so on) that expand on what is found in the core set/vaults.

regards,

ET

Whoops. What he said!

I don't think you were wrong. The game just wasn't complete, imho, for many 2e groups until the Player's guide came out.

jh

Emirikol said:

Although the core set alone was absolutely brilliant I do agree with you. It's not until now and having all the released material (except the player vault and GM vault), that it feels like a complete wfrp game.

It's also one of the most expensive rpgs I've played... but fortunately it's worth it

Very simplified:

Cool! Thank you for this info! I figured if we can all chip in and get him stuff for at least 5 players worth of game materials, then it will work out. That way he wont gripe about needing to spend the money on the game

GravitysAngel said:

I have to comment on this one. You could get the impression that you get ALL the cards etc. released until now in the new vaults. But you do not. You ONLY get the stuff included in the core set. If you get the vaults you will still have to buy signs of faith, winds of magic, adventurers toolkit and GM's toolkit.

The core set also has a lot more dice than the GM vault, so if you plan on using dice the core set is worth the price for the dice alone when you consider how much you'd have to spend to get the amount of dice in the core set.

So, would getting the box set and Adventure's Vault be a good start then?

I'd personally reccomend skipping the core set at this point and picking up the individual components instead. While it's true you'll get more dice with the core set, the players guides rules are more up to date and it can be frustrating playing some way and finding out certain things have been changed/fixed then having to remember all of that, plus the individual hardbacks are of far superior quality than the books that come in the core set. If you guys are buying the game for your GM as a present I'd reccomend the players guide and gm's guide for sure. After that you could get the vaults as well if you plan on using all the extra components (I like most of the components, but they're not for every group). As far as the dice go, if you guys do enjoy the game, some of the players may also want to pick up their own dice and that will solve any shortage issues (or you could just get more for the GM.

The players toolkit you may like if you want more options added, I'd really only reccomend it if you're using the components since then the price makes it worthwhile...not so much if you're going to play 3rd ed old school. Next on the list would be the creature guide and creature vault, especially if your gm likes to write his own adventures, however if you'd rather run a published adventure (probably a good idea for your first game to help get a handle on the rules), you may want to get a published adventure instead.

That's how I would prioritize the items I'd want if just starting out. Hopefully that helps.

I would recommend getting the core set.

1) It's available at a pretty decent price on places like Amazon, and will give you everything you need to experiment with WFRP 3, including dice (which you need quite a lot of, and will need multiple (expensive) packs if you don't get the core set. You need the dice. If you don't use them, you're not playing 3rd edition, and it will be very frustrating not to have enough for even one player to roll.

2) Download and print off the rules summaries / alternative GM screens that I think can be found on Gitzman's site. Present them to the GM at the same time as the box, so that when he is reading through the rules, he can refer to the summaries so that he doesn't get lost.

3) If you're going to get the Player's Guide, GM's guide and the player's vault and GM's vault, then you're getting everything (except most of the dice) in the core set but at a much higher price. You will get some extra material and errata, but not a huge amount.

4) If you like the first, experimental game session, then your next buys should probably be Winds of Magic or Signs of Faith, to get the corruption rules or the disease rules, along with more careers and a big new chunk of rules (the full magic rules or the full faith rules). I would personally recommend SoF as I think disease is more important than corruption, and the faith setting material is more relevant to everyone, whereas the college magic setting material is mainly going to be of use to wizards. Of course, if you actually have a player you know will want to be a wizard, and not a priest, then obviously WoM makes more sense.

5) Probably the next buy would be The Gathering Storm, as it's got more options for players, is a fairly long-ish adventure, and includes a bit of everything.

Thanks, Gallows, I'll make those edits! So, the Guides have the rules from SoF and WoM, but the Vaults don't have the cards?

Asmuth said:

I would just reenforce that you'd still have to buy Winds of Magic and Signs of Faith to have the cards you need for every Cult and color of wind. With either the Core Set or the Vaults and guides you still need both of these expansions if you want to use the spell/blessing cards.

Hi Justin,

Here is what i recommend to you.

Buy the Core set + Creature Guide/Vaults.

You ll play lovely with 3 players and with little glintch of dice if more. So you can add some extra 3 DICE PACK for 2 players more.

Your friend will have A HUUUGGEEEE SMIILLLEEE the size of the box and the beauty of the Guide is what he will see first !!!

On second time, he will have to buy quickly Wind of change and Faith for desease and mutation

BUT HE WILL HAVE ALL COMPONENTS PLENTYFUL !

Here is my story;

I was in your position two month ago.

I bought the C/P/M Vaults and all the Campaigns AND 5 PACK OF DICE 'About 200€'

I had the books in pdf....

Then I realised that i miss magic and priest informations and cards... Kind of ... lite Warhammer in fact ...

My 5 players, two of them wanted to play some not in the vaults (And Core Set) ... So i asked my bank and i bought all the rest of product I need :

Winds/Faith/Core Set ... 'Another 200€'

We had our first game yesterday night. TOO MUCH STUFF LOL

Result : The players, *** Fan of Warhammer 2e, enjoy deathly the session !

No matter what you want to get, the core set is absolutely vital. It would simply cost a fortune to put together a similar set with the vaults and dice packs, plus you also need all the expansions too.

I would buy the core set first and the players guide and then purchase with this priority. (excluding the EoN and TGS)

1. Core set + Players guide
2. GM toolkit + Adventurers Toolkit
3. Creatures Guide + Creatures Vault
4. Winds of magic + Signs of faith
5. GM guide
6. Extra dice

I would simply skip the players vault and GM vault as they aren't really worth buying unless you want more of each card.

If you were to start out with the players guide, GM guide, GM vault and Players Vault, then you would start out with just 12 dice at a much higher price than the core set. You would have to buy 2-3 dice set as well just to be able to play.

Wow, this is all good info! Thank you to every one for these recomendations!

I would disagree slightly. I think the GM Vault is worthwhile for any GM. It gives more dice, another set of Basic Action cards, more wound/condition cards, more location cards, and so on.

Replace the "Extra dice" on that list with the GM Vault, and that's pretty good ... although as good as the Adv.Toolkit is, I'm not sure I'd prioritize it over all the other stuff listed, unless someone has a real hankering to play one of the careers in it.

The GM vault only has 12 dice. The same as a standard dice pack. The basic actions are in the adventurers kit as well, so it depends on how many players you have. But in term of cost it's just much more expensive to go with the vaults. Extra location cards (duplicates that is) can be nice, but if you want the GM and Players vaults then you must really want duplicate material of what you already have in the core set. Otherwise it's just a waste.

I'm just saying it because getting the core set is very cost effective and not because the vaults are bad. If you don't care about saving money, then going with the guides and vaults plus 3 extra packs of dice is the way to go.

GravitysAngel said:

Get the core set and the rules errata off this site first, and play thru Eye for an Eye (the free mini adventure in the core set) or one of the freebie adventure pdf also available on this site like Journey to Blackfire Pass.

Official PDFs:

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_minisite_sec.asp?eidm=93&esem=4

If you find yourself hooked, then invest in the other supplements as you feel necessary. The Players Guide is, IMO, the single most useful, followed by the Creature Vault (the monster cards, which is a great idea). But they are all good supplements and they all have their uses.

I played 1e in the 80's and dallied with it longingly without a group to play it with during the Hogshead days, and more recently played 2e briefly. My players at the time were not into the Warhammer game system, so I converted both 1e and later 2e to the HERO System to entice them to play and gave that a spin for a while. I merged the Empire into another setting and filed off the serial numbers (changed the names) so that I could reuse lots of Warhammer material and that worked out suprisingly well. I've played Fantasy Battle, Blood Bowl, Man O War, and especially Mordheim. All in all, I've had a long relationship with the IP.

So, given that I really like the Old World and I'm also a game system snob, when I say that WHFRP3 is a really fun game and is also properly Warhammer-ish, it is not praise I give lightly.

I hope you give it a spin and find it to be as fun as I have.