The thing about "the secret" is, it's only the dark angels who treat it so seriously. Honestly, EVERY chapter has renegades (and apparently, the dark angels are the only ones who purge them with such... vehemence), and I have a feeling that the dark angels are the only chapter who takes it seriously enough that they haven't had any "new" ones since the Heresy.

Ultramarine: Hey! Who was that guy in the old Dark Angels panoply saying you were a traitor?
Ravenguard Dark Angel: ... Who? Oh, him? He's just a renegade out to besmirch our name. I've notified my chapter who will take him home and correct the issue.

Or Regular Dark Angel: He's obviously a raving insane traitor who I just shot in the face until he stopped spouting heresy.

Ultramarine: Oh... you mean... you don't just banish them and hope they won't cause anymore trouble until they realize the wrongness of their ways.

SpaceWolf: Ah, one of those, you don't send them away to learn the error of their ways in the honor guard of a Navigator?

Blood Angel: Or send them on a quest to redeem themselves?
Imperial Fist: Or let them take the Long Walk and battle the enemies of the Imperium by themselves until they die?

Dark Angel: ... what in the God-Emperor's name is wrong with you people? These folks are a stain on your chapter's honor and you just send them off to "be sorry" when they get around to it?

Chorus of Other Chapters: ... well... yeah?

Dark Angel: *facepalm*

Decent reactions to the knowledge that there are renegade dark angels happens in Blood Quest (Where the BA's on quest... really don't care, cause every chapter has renegades) and the... 4th or 5th Space Wolf book with the Dark Angels in it. It's a matter of personal honor, and if it were ever exposed... I actually think the Inquisition and the other chapters would give a giant... wtf? really? THAT was the big secret? Seriously guys... we just had an entire company go renegade last week... hell, half of the Blood Angels chapter under Dante tried to kill the other half because of a mutant who thought he was Sanguinius reborn... it's been 10,000 years of you guys hunting your renegades... I THINK you've done yer penance... cause otherwise... well, we all look terrible.

But DA's are the goth Asartes.

Without Angst they could not exist.

As part of their initiation they have the back of their hand stapled to their forehead, don't they?

Siranui said:

No, no, no. Raven Guard are Goth, Dark Angels are Emo.

Dark Angels wear green, they can't be Goth.

Siranui said:

I do love a debate

I think the rumors that exist of the DA's doing stuff is they're finnicky and they leave battle fields unnanoucned (they're not the only ones) due to reasons they never mention. They just pack up their kit and leave, making the rest of the folks on the planet go "Goddamn Dark Angels!" There are so many other conclusions you can take from their odd behavior that don't have anything to do with the betrayal.

From what I know of the Fallen, which is probably limited as I've not read much of the the (terrible) DA novels, I think they DO have a motive to keep their mouths shut, because if they start going off about how they're Dark Angels turned traitor, the Dark Angels will suddenly show up and kill you. Bragging about it would end up getting you killed, and I imagine most of who is left from the fallen (there can't be THAT many left) have gotten pretty good at remaining hidden, and the ones that don't know how to lay low got collected somewhere in the last 10,000 years. In addition, not all of the Fallen turned to Chaos.

And then it's quotations like this that make me say nothing but vauge rumor and heresy exist: "None know of these events other than the Dark Angels, their Successor Chapters and the Emperor on his Golden Throne. Even within the Chapters themselves very few brother-Marines know the full story. It is only when Dark Angels gain entry into the Deathwing that they learn that many of the Dark Angels who followed Luther are still alive."

But I do agree with Hostower, if someone else found out their secret, it would probably be a "wait, for real, it was some traitors 10,000 years ago during the time we lost half of everything else?"

SPOILERS!

In the novel Angels of Darkness a fallen Dark Angel Commander is interrogated

"What was he (The Lion) waiting for?" Boreas asked quietly. Astelan looked into Boreas's eyes, read the curiosity that was now there.

"He (The Lion) was waiting to see which side won, of course"

If some Fallens have this knowledge you would want to kill them all i think.

SPOILERS OVER

Bassemandrh said:

Yes, but remember, it's not sure Astelan talks the truth. It's an ongoing mind duel between Astelan and Boreas. Something that is great in this novel, who do you (the reader) trust? The charismatic and nice fallen, who ordered to fire upon the DA Fleet (see Horus Heresy novels) or the the not-so likeable Interrogator Chaplain, who does his duty ;-)

Maybe we get a least a glimpse of the truth in the missing 3rd novel for the DA in Horus Heresy, yet we just know, everybody thinks they are doing the Emperor's will and they were already secretive as hell even to another inside the legion...

I'm pretty sure we get Astelan is a just a whiny git from the 2nd DA HH book heh. Nothing in the first two leads me to believe that the Lion is actually going to sit it out and wait to see who comes out on top (if anything, by the end of the 2nd book, I'm pretty sure he would want to be sure Horus loses), but as was stated, I'm sure we'll find out in book 3 (can't fragging wait).

The reason the Fallen don't go running around spouting off that they're Traitor Dark Angels or that they know the big Truth of it all, is because that's the fastest ticket to getting 1 or more entire chapters of Unforgiven to show up with plasma guns on. heh on target, current fluff stands that the only ones who know about the Fallen in the Imperium are the Dark Angels, their successors, and maybe the Emperor on his throne (current 4E codex). Outside of all of that... that's a different story entirely but that's where it stands, and woe betide those who find out about it by accident (ie: that entire Black Templar crusade from the BT codex who accidentally caught one and made the mistake of not giving him over post haste...a nd is now "missing" in action).

Cypher seems to be the exception to the rule (on top of being wickedly badass) as during the EoT campeign, during his stint as "The Voice" he starts to rumor drop, but he's caught and escapes towards the end of it all, with no further anything happening, but that's the biggest leak in the setting to date atm (which hasn't happened yet in FFG timeline, still another, 180 years or something to go for that to take place). So, back on topic, as a GM, I would rule there simply is NO chance for someone outside of the Deathwing or Inner Circle to know about the Fallen as anything more than standard chump renegades... and if I was a Deathwing DA in the Deathwatch, if any of my Killteam looked like they might put it all together, if I liked them, I'd be doing my damndest to get them to stop thinking about it, and if I didn't like them, well, we know what happens to those poor folks when they do figure it out.

ItsUncertainWho said:

They used to be goth though.

Alex

Green can so be a Goth colour. Surprisingly, Goths don't only wear black

Goths don't often wear green, but the DAs will always be black to me, anyway!

They did used to be a very goth Chapter. I think the RG might have taken over as regards the colour scheme, but DAs were there first with their black imagery highlighted with white, copious amounts of angst, coupled with loads of 'we're so secret and special snowflakes' stuff in their backstory.

Sadly, they've really suffered at the hands of bad, bad writing. The only reasonably cool material I recall reading about them was stuff in the Deathwing expansion for SH.

It's quite amusing to think that the DAs are basically brooding and building their Chapter around hunting down a few renegades when they should possibly 'get over it'. I imagine that they lock themselves in their cells listening to Andrus El Dritch music too loudly...

I love Emo Angels "hunt fallen" theme, every chapter from first founding have some twist and story. U may compare it to medieval knightly oaths (from romantic ballads), no matter how dumb idea of vow is, oath is oath. Even if u must spend entire life doing something u see as cretin job u will do it anyway and with big fake smile.

And Siranui, 90% of new fluff is so cheesy that it hurts. (Blood angels alliance with certain cyber space zombie race serving sun eating wouldbe gods...)

I have many small (around 2k points) and two big armies (8k and 10k points) in TT, but if M.Ward, will do next Dark Angel codex i will pass that army.

And new Emo angels listen to Tokio Hotel in their secret chambers of weeping...