Help needed regarding PC combat actions and NPC skills

By ElComandante2, in WFRP Rules Questions

I've bought the 3rd edition a few weeks ago and plan to game master for the first time in my life soon (although I've been playing RPGs for 20+ years). But before I go live I have 2 unsolved problems which I find no answer to, even after my 3rd reading.

1. The combat rules clearly state that you can use ONE action card per turn. Does that mean that you have to choose to either attack (for example with the basic "Melee Strike") or Block/Parry/Dodge but not both? This is a bit strange especially if you compare to 1st and 2nd edition where you could do both (in most cases). By the way, isn't it a bit weird, that Block/Parry/Dodge all take 2 turns to recharge? In most other games I've played you always could defend and attack on the same turn. Is it me who has misunderstood the mechanic or has this been done on purpose (if so, why limit defense to every other turn?)?

2. Monsters have no skills but the A/C/E system, right? But why do the monsters action cards state Skill check: for example "Blasphemous Litany" (Cultists) is a Guile (Fel) vs Targer Discipline (WP) check? If I (the GM) want my NPC to use this action, I have to use one Cunning die. So once all dice have been used, the cultist can't do any other Cunning-based action at all any more, even if it would be another action. NPCs seem to loose their skills once the A/C/E dice have been used. Again, what have I misunderstood here? Do NPCs simply run their skills based on their characteristic dice alone once all A/C/E dice have been used?

Could someone please explain these 2 points? Many thanks!

I`m not that experienced in WFRP 3 yet, but I guess answers are:

1. You can use attack and block in the same turn. You will just suffer 1 additional fatigue for using extra manouvre.

2. Dont understand here what you mean... You are using your checks/skills as normal but you ADD extra dices of A/C/E to the dice pool.

Skolo is mistaken.

You can only use one Action on your turn, that is right. But certain actions have the " Reaction " Trait , which is for use when it is not your turn (like Active Defences, Riposte, etc). When you are declared the target of an attack you can parry for exemple, you tell your GM your character is parrying and use the card description to modify the attacker's pool (and put recharges as described). You also have a Priest Minor Blessing that is a Reaction, Wizard's CounterSpell, etc.

The Fatigue per extra maneuver is for those only, which are not "actions" (moving, picking up something, etc.)

2 - Certain monsters do have some skill(s) trained. It says so in the descriptions of those creatures (or you could customize them to have some). For instance, a Cult Leader is trained in Guile (from memory), which adds an Expertise dice as normal. (Chaos Warrior is trained in Weapon Skill, etc.)

A/C/E is just a bonus dice pool for NPCs, once depleted, you just roll the appropriate skill checks unmodified : Guile (Fel) vs Discipline (WP) : you roll Fel only or Fel + 1 Exp if Guile trained. You just lack extra Cunning bonus (you can only use 1 Expertise from A/C/E pool per roll, but can use several A or C, in this exemple C)

ok, so I was partly mistaken. Still, a question about not using melee attack and block/parry etc in the same round stays, becouse they do not have REACTION TRAIT on them, so you cant use them in the same round.

correct?

Treat "Active Defence" cards exactly like "Reaction" cards. The main difference is that everyone has them (the Basic ones) unless they don't start with the relevant attribute at 3. The non-Basic ones need to be purchased as Advances and then replace the respective Basic one.

You do not declare, on your turn, your intent to parry/dodge/block something that is not there (an attack). Re-read those Active Defence cards, it mentions "After you have been declared the target of ..." gui%C3%B1o.gif

If you want to be defensive on your turn, use "Guarded Position", it rocks!

Cwell is correct.

Regarding Dodge/Parry/Block. Those are "special" defensive moves. The 1 challenge die represents the normal defensive effort of an opponent to avoid being hit. The Reaction defense cards are an extra effort on the part of the defender to avoid the attacker. Hence, the 2 recharge. Assuming you had access and the ability to use all 3, a defender could use them all against a single attack. However, due to recharge, that would leave the defender without an available reaction defense against other attacks later in the same round or the subsequent round (due to recharge).

Cwell2101 said:

Re-read those Active Defence cards, it mentions "After you have been declared the target of ..." gui%C3%B1o.gif

If you want to be defensive on your turn, use "Guarded Position", it rocks!

now its clear to me. thanks

Thank you very much Cwell2101!

OK, I guess that "Reaction" (such as on the "Minor Blessing" card) is more or less the same as "Active Defence" (such as on Block/Dodge/Parry). Is that written somewhere???

So apparently (and please correct me if I'm wrong) "Active Defence" action cards can be used as reaction to an enemy's attack even if the Dodge/Parry/Block action card hasn't been readied during the character's turn. This is counter-intuitive as per RAW: a character can ready/use a single action card on his turn but the rules say nothing about using a different action card during a monster's or an NPC's turn (the combat example in the rule book isn't helpful either).

Can anyone please redirect me to the rules page which specifies that I can react on other character's turns with an "Active Defence" card?

Sorry if this is not really clear to me yet.

Concerning the other question I had (NPC skills), I admit that my example was a bad one as the cult leader clearly has the Guile skill. But the Imp for example can do the "Swarm of Whispers" which also requires a Guile check but the Imp doesn't have this skill. Sure I can always adapt my NPCs and give them whatever skills I need them to have but my question here is this: Why specify a skill if the Imp doesn't have this skill??? If I use the Imp as ritten it would just be a FEL check (vs Discipline), right? Why then not make it a FEL check? There is certainly a logical answer but I just can't see it.

Elcomandante said:

Thank you very much Cwell2101!

OK, I guess that "Reaction" (such as on the "Minor Blessing" card) is more or less the same as "Active Defence" (such as on Block/Dodge/Parry). Is that written somewhere???

So apparently (and please correct me if I'm wrong) "Active Defence" action cards can be used as reaction to an enemy's attack even if the Dodge/Parry/Block action card hasn't been readied during the character's turn. This is counter-intuitive as per RAW: a character can ready/use a single action card on his turn but the rules say nothing about using a different action card during a monster's or an NPC's turn (the combat example in the rule book isn't helpful either).

Can anyone please redirect me to the rules page which specifies that I can react on other character's turns with an "Active Defence" card?

Sorry if this is not really clear to me yet.

Concerning the other question I had (NPC skills), I admit that my example was a bad one as the cult leader clearly has the Guile skill. But the Imp for example can do the "Swarm of Whispers" which also requires a Guile check but the Imp doesn't have this skill. Sure I can always adapt my NPCs and give them whatever skills I need them to have but my question here is this: Why specify a skill if the Imp doesn't have this skill??? If I use the Imp as ritten it would just be a FEL check (vs Discipline), right? Why then not make it a FEL check? There is certainly a logical answer but I just can't see it.

All Basic Skills can be used by anyone anytime (as long as your GM allows it / they have a maneuver to make a skill check or action to use an action card requiring a skill check). Only Advanced Skills needs to be acquired 1st to be used (Education, Animal Handling, Tradecraft, Channeling, Piety, Invocation, Spellcraft, Magic Sight, etc.).
Basic Skill list : all the skills that are printed on the player character sheet, distinguished by physical & mental domains (for Attributes, Fatigue & Stress link purpose), or p.17+ of the CoreBook.

Regarding the books, i tried to find a text about Active Defense (& Reaction) traits, but did not found it. I did not really try hard though as i don't need it. The card description itself is clear enough. It is not an action that is taken during the player's turn and does not take his turn's action to be used (where "Guarded Position" is, with a correct description & skill check to get a lasting bonus).
It also makes no sense at all to use those actions during your own turn simply by reading the card itself, you cannot add a black dice to the attacker's pool, it's your turn to act you are not the target of a "... action" (turn by turn play, not RTS). The only way i can see it being used during your own turn if you are the target of a Counterblow/Riposte kind of action : you try to hit an enemy, he defends and you miss, he Ripostes, you can use your active defences. After all that resolves, it's still your turn but your action is done, it was the original attack.

I remember for sure reading about "Reaction" trait being the ability to use those in reaction to the requirements/trigger (Priest minor blessing is something along the lines of "someone is trying a skill check, you can help him by calling your god's favor upon him" or something. Same for the "Shrug it off" action card, "Dirty Tricks", "Trivial Knowledge", etc.

You could still use the link "Rule Question" at the bottom of the page to ask more precisely too gui%C3%B1o.gif

Elcomandante said:

Concerning the other question I had (NPC skills), I admit that my example was a bad one as the cult leader clearly has the Guile skill. But the Imp for example can do the "Swarm of Whispers" which also requires a Guile check but the Imp doesn't have this skill. Sure I can always adapt my NPCs and give them whatever skills I need them to have but my question here is this: Why specify a skill if the Imp doesn't have this skill??? If I use the Imp as ritten it would just be a FEL check (vs Discipline), right? Why then not make it a FEL check? There is certainly a logical answer but I just can't see it.

Problem then comes if a GM wants to use a better Imp, a more intelligent one, and lets it have trained Guile. If they had just written FEL, this Imp would not get the bonus dice now... or if you wanted to use the action for other monsters, one that had guile trained.

There are easy options to tweak monsters so they are either tougher or weaker.

  1. Modify their A/C/E. Even with the same stats a monster will be harder if it gets more dice to spend.
  2. Allow NPCs to use their expertise pool to add either yellow dice to their dice pool or a purple to an attackers pool (improved parry/dodge/block)
  3. Simply jot down the NPC as being a standard NPC +2 for instance. This adds 2 to all relevant stats. A super troll would get +2 to his strenght, toughness, weapon damage, armor soak, defence, wounds etc.
  4. Or do what I always do for every session. Create custom NPCs. I am currently playing the Thousand Thrones campaign and creating all the NPCs. This takes time, but once you buy the Creature Guide, Creatures Vault and possibly the Players Vault.... then you can easily create stats for NPCs and simply jot down what cards they have (and sort the cards before the session of course so everything is ready).
  5. I rarely give NPCs skills, because with my rule of allowing the expertise pool to be used as improved defence cards gives the NPCs enough options. Sometimes when I know the players will be opposing a NPCs skill (like stealth vs observation) I will write it down.

Thank you very much to all who have answered. Things are a lot clearer to me now!