This time i have looked everywhere including to the faq that was transfered from the old forum in which i found some amazing answers and i wonder why they never made it in the faq.

Anyway here we go and thanks for the answers in advance.

1) Rumors what happens if you flee at the first level or 2nd level of the dungeon? What if you flee in the rumor level? Do you lose the rumor (graveyard) or it is shuffled again (just discarded)?

2) A question i have been wanting to ask for quite some time. Rumors say are played according to the quest guide. In the quest guide it says that you tell the players about stat improvements some named monster has but no special abilities. Do you use that? I ask because my players don't have access to the quest guide so if someone doesn't know the exact details of a creature is in a disadvantage against someone who does. So how do you play it? You tell everything to your players or go by the book. (Even though by the time they play it a 2nd time the same legendary, rumor they will know everything about it)

3) Do you use the rulings of SoB in campaigns of RtL. And when i say rulings i am talking about things like the favor of the gods (or something like that) that the conquest rating of the players go up or down. (even though i find it weird that if you are ahead 50 points as an overlord means that the players just field a single 2 conquest player that now is an immortal player with 0 conquest), the nerfing of nanuk (that seemed right since he was ridiculous to start with), the ability of the Lts to finally use orders like the heroes (which i find natural and i always thought they forgot to put on the starting campaign).

So i would like to know what of the above you use if you still play RtL ofcourse.

4) And final a thing that has been bugging me. In the market it says that the market is populated by items when a players visits that market for the first time this week. But the whole paragraph is below restock, train, visit. So what gives? This is kinda vital as to if the players can get treasures from the market when they are inside a dungeon and restock on the market. ( My idea is that the visit word doesn't actually mean the visit action but they just used it for simply what it means)

I guess that all and i would like eveyones ideas on the above things. Thanks...

1) Rumors what happens if you flee at the first level or 2nd level of the dungeon? What if you flee in the rumor level? Do you lose the rumor (graveyard) or it is shuffled again (just discarded)?

AFAIK it's undefined, but we always played that everything reshuffle unless its specifically moved to the graveyard.

2) A question i have been wanting to ask for quite some time. Rumors say are played according to the quest guide. In the quest guide it says that you tell the players about stat improvements some named monster has but no special abilities. Do you use that? I ask because my players don't have access to the quest guide so if someone doesn't know the exact details of a creature is in a disadvantage against someone who does. So how do you play it? You tell everything to your players or go by the book. (Even though by the time they play it a 2nd time the same legendary, rumor they will know everything about it)

We play by the rules.

3) Do you use the rulings of SoB in campaigns of RtL. And when i say rulings i am talking about things like the favor of the gods (or something like that) that the conquest rating of the players go up or down. (even though i find it weird that if you are ahead 50 points as an overlord means that the players just field a single 2 conquest player that now is an immortal player with 0 conquest), the nerfing of nanuk (that seemed right since he was ridiculous to start with), the ability of the Lts to finally use orders like the heroes (which i find natural and i always thought they forgot to put on the starting campaign).

So i would like to know what of the above you use if you still play RtL ofcourse.

We haven't played RtL since SoB came out, but I'd vote against it. Some FAQ answers are for both, but the two sets are different games, and not meant to be played under the same rule sets.

4) And final a thing that has been bugging me. In the market it says that the market is populated by items when a players visits that market for the first time this week. But the whole paragraph is below restock, train, visit. So what gives? This is kinda vital as to if the players can get treasures from the market when they are inside a dungeon and restock on the market. ( My idea is that the visit word doesn't actually mean the visit action but they just used it for simply what it means)

They can buy treasures while exploring a dungeon.

Drglord said:

Unless they actually complete the rumour, I think it just gets reshuffled into the deck. I could be mistaken about that. The dungeon is definitely marked off as "explored" if the heroes flee, so they can't change their minds and go back in. They'd have to shuffle and redraw the rumour if they wanted a second crack at it.

I'd be fine with saying fleeing the dungeon causes the rumour to be discarded (to the graveyard) if that's how people wanted to play, but I'm not sure that the rules support that interpretation.

Drglord said:

Descent has never been a game where not knowing information really matters. It might be harder for someone who doesn't know the boss's special rules yet, but even those who do should still face a reasonable challenge in defeating it.

I guess I'm not quite sure what you mean by "someone who doesn't know the exact details is at a disadvantage against someone who does." The Overlord will always know the exact details because he's allowed to read them. The heroes are never "against" one another so if one player knows the special rules, he's free to share. Even with them knowing, the fight should be roughly fair.

I play by the rules as written. Information hidden in this way is usually pretty easy to figure out during play, I find. Even in those circumstances where the heroes lose because of the special rules, they'll know better the next time. Descent is not designed in such a way that a given dungeon should only be played once.

Drglord said:

I think that's a personal choice. I don't think using the SoB revisions that can be applied to RtL will break anything, but I also don't think they're absolutely necessary. Use them if you want, don't if you don't. Discuss this with your players.

Drglord said:

I'm pretty sure you're right, that the word "visit" in this instance is simply being used as a word in the English language instead of a game term. I'm quite sure that the market can be populated while in a dungeon (although it doesn't get repopulated - what you draw the first time is what you have to choose from until the next game week.) Since you can't take a Visit action and get into a dungeon at the same time, this would imply that the market will fill on a restock as well (if it hasn't been filled once already.)

Drglord said:

not sure, got to go, sorry

Drglord said:

We go by the rules, I think. We almost never did rumours in RtL - they are generally bad in copper, because the heroes give up too much excess CT, and not worth the effort in Gold. In SOB they are an important part of the heroes strategy to move the game as fast as possible.

Drglord said:

We are taking a break for now, with 4 comleted RtL campaigns and 2 complete (sort of) SoB campaigns. But we would not touch the Divine Favour rule if playing RtL - it has totally ruined SoB for us (among many things) because although it might improve the campaign balance, it totally destroys the dungeon balance and takes away most of the key decision points.
The new Raze rules simply don't transfer, despite many players thinking that they do and even using them. The situation is totally different, with different map styles (RtL one very central key location that can always be reached, SoB more varied and more difficult to move around), different Lt rules, different city balances and no Tamalir upgrades. Astonishingly, the most commonly advocated method for using these rules in RtL is to combines them with teh Tamalir raze (Tamalir only razeable as the 5th city), which just gives the worst of both worlds.
I think we would happily 'port' over the final battle rules - an area where RtL is seriously out of whack (OL's answer is simply don't let it get to a final battle, so it is not a disaster being out of whack) and the new rules look much more balanced.

Drglord said:

It is pretty clear that this is merely an ill-advised use of the normal english word visit. Note that it is not capitalised, nor in "" marks. Players can buy treasures in the market from inside the dungeon during a restock action. Note that the heading for that section is Visit, Train or Restock , so everything in that section applies to these three action types.

Steve-O said:

Overlord vs. Player is exactly what he means. Say, for example, there's a rumor leader with immunity to melee attacks. If the Overlord knows this and the heroes do not, the OL can end the boss's turn adjacent to the buff melee hero and the hero player is likely to use up at least one attack with no result, possibly more depending on how tricky the OL player can be. i.e. saying "he takes no damage from melee" vs. "your first melee attack didn't do anything to him." The latter might make the hero swing again, or try to interact with random terrain to trigger the ability to hurt the leader. If, however, the heroes all know that melee is useless from the start, they're in a much better position for dealing with the boss, because the melee character(s) won't waste time attacking him and can instead focus on clearing minions.

Steve-O said:

Discussing it is really no option since in the group of players there is a single player that will steal (literaly being caught stealing wound tokens), kill, cheat and maim in order to win and will at no chance take anything that he can abuse even to the point of saying i don't deserve as an overlord to take the 2 conquest tokens i forgot to take the previous week as the game week passed even if that has no real impact and it happened 2 minutes ago.

So discussing is out of the questions but as i have said they are lazy and do no research at all so they take my word on most ruling as i have printed most faqs.

Some thinks i would like to use is the below.

Nerfing of Nanuk. I mean come on seriously when he was made there was no advanced campaign so they could not have predicted that this guy can get 9 armor without even wearing armor by the middle of copper stage (5 melee dices, iron ring, enduring) i find the nerfing quite natural and think should apply to RTL.

LT putting orders. I always thought they just forgot to print that part in the RTL. They have all the orders are unique creatures and certainly won't unbalance anything.

Secret training +1 fatigue instead of +2. I mean come on that was huge error of fantasy flight since who in their right mind would take +4 instead of +2 fatigue save for the dwarf perhaps that comes with 8 wounds.

(Perhaps also the final battle rules of SOB that give more wounds to overlord avatar per token and make it a real battle)

So in conclusion i consider all the above to be just corrections of the rules so what are your ideas about that?

Drglord said:

If that's the case, then I have no advice to give you. I would not allow a player who routinely cheats to continue playing at my table. Either he leaves or I do.

It doesn't really matter what rules you want to use or not use, if the people you're playing with have no respect for ANY rules then the exercise of playing the game is nothing more than a waste of time. If you don't have any other friends to play with, then I feel for you deeply. If you do, I suggest you drop this one like a hot potato.

It's not about actively cheating but more of rule abusing and stuff like that. There have been times that in the whole fuss of things with multiple guard options i have forgotten to attack with a monster and he will even go against any player that reminds my anything and will have no problem at all in winning that way. For me i will allow them rewinds and stuff like forgotten familiars moves and such to go on without fuss since i don't want to win because someone forgot to move his player and the like. Anyway since my players have never so far reached the silver level since they seem to give up on copper after a beating even though i have explained them that once silver stage is hit is a losing battle for the overlord if he can't win on the map so they think that the overlord is heavily more powerful than them but seeing the items in gold and silver level adding the extra skills they will win by then i can see how a game can easily turn on it's head even if you are more than 100 tokens in front as players should dominate the gold level heavily.

How is stealing more wound tokens not "actively cheating"?

That happened once (that i know)