Heh, as soon as I have a decent version of Space Marines and Techmarines, I might do that. I've just got more of an uphill struggle than most.

Kage

Kage2020 said:

Ah, that sounds like a cheap cop-out (just teasing). A mini-idea about a situation/setting/challenge isn't so much dependent on that.

Alex

ak-73 said:

Actually, on my own behalf I think you're wrong. Getting the appropriate "feel" for a given Marine (or whatever) is a good thing. In this case I'm spending my time trying to figure out how the Adeptus Mechanicus would work. Kind of sad that I'm stuck with the last "class" but there we go.

Kage

LordZon said:

I am working a Sister of Battle into one of my campaigns for that very reason. Though you could concievably have a female space marine, the sisters bring something unique to the table so I have encouraged that route. I have done this using the idea of the cabal listed on pg 274 of the DH core book. One of the players is a Grey Knight representing the Ordo Malleus in the Cabal, the Adapteus Sorotias will represent Ordo Hereticus of corse.

*Spoiler Alert*

If you are looking for a place to a sister, in the first module in the new Emperor Protects supplement, there is a dead sister found in the camp. You could either make it that she is not dead, or there is a contingent of sisters already investigating the incident.

It sounds like they were already interested in DH, and I put alot of that element into my DW campaigns.

If i remember right there are 2 legions that were deleted from the records for something unspoken of.

Possible female marine expt gone a bit wrong or just hidden

SithFitz said:

Already covered, and nope, both the missing Primarchs are referred to as "brothers" and the remains of those two legions, in the fluff, were folded into the Ultramarines, hence why they're the single largest Legion during the Horus Heresy.

Black Shield perhaps?

Female Chaos Space marine on a path of redemption, always clad in armor, uses a voice modulator so people wrongly assume she is a he.

Why a Chaos Space marine? What better means to tweak it to the Imperium than to have them face defeat at the hands of a gender they felt unable to be space marines in the first place? How much more ironic that one of those very forces of darkness sees the light of the Emperor (or does she?) and joins the very force she was created to destroy. All the while unable to reveal her true identity.

Seems to work, at least from a role playing standpoint. Certainly lots of potential back story there. Is she unique? Is there a whole chapter of them back in the realms of chaos (perish the thought),. What happens when she gets badly injured, or her armor needs to be repaired?

Just a thought.

I'm not one to try and stop a discussion (okay I am sometimes), especially for those new to the forum or the thread in question, but you guys might spend some time searching or reading through this whole thread in addition to many of the "Female Space Marine"/"FSM" threads. There are a a lot of suggestons in those threads (amidst the flames, mind you) that might help you get your game to where you want it to be.

I only say this because the topic always ends up in a huge debate over canon, and people like me continually get sucked back into it

In direct response to TiverWHR01:

TiverWHR01 said:

What happens when she requires medical attention, or the Apothecary (or Librarian) decides to run standard purity checks after returning from a space hulk or chaos world. I response specifically here because I don't think it's 'just a female problem' here, as a Chaos Marine dude might try the same trick of beng in the DW while he tries to redeem himself. I'm not saying it's impossible, but if you want to stay close to the 40k world, there are going to be a whole lot of things this character is going to have to be worried about and hiding from, and a lot of story built around how they continually evade the prying eyes of the Inquisition that wanders the halls of the place they're camped in. Brother HidesHisFace over there with his/her corruption sitting at 50 or higher is going to shine like a beacon inside a watch fortress full of marines and inquisitors.

......Soooooooo.....Hasn't this topic come up before?....a number of times?.......If i recall it was started before the DW core book even came out

Why not work sisters of battle up to DW lvl and play them....especially with the release of Blood of Martyrs. There are some pretty awesome faith powers that are listed. Not to mention that the alt career paths that are presented are pretty boss.

Before any one says it either I didn't check to see if this idea was already posted as this thread is getting TL,DR ....also expect this to spiral out of contorl just as all the others did =P .....either way just adding my 2 bits

@Charmander

Everyone knows that any Chaos marine that is like that is going to belong to Slaanesh....and is therefore also most likely a Herm

(may have opened a new can of worms with that one)

Michigan said:

The hate towards any idea of icky girls getting to be Space Marines is bizarre and irrational.

My feeling is women can certainly be Marines and any pseduo science that says otherwise is just Imperial sexism at work.

But for some odd reason a lot of 40k fans are about as reasonable as the Taliban on this issue.

Kid Kyoto said:

It's just that a lot of us think that the idea of universal political correctness (as in: even in mindless fiction) sucks. That's part of why we play 40K, including xeno-ism and genocide.

Alex

Ak-47 you made comments that made much more sens before!

I play 40k cause I want to be a misogenist with maniacal tendencies okay!

I don't think you should do promotion too often...

crisaron said:

I think he means how its quite a double standard to want to have female marines (for political correctness) but tto be ok with the genocide, xenophobia, intollerancce, that make up the foundation of the imperium.

Besides, the palatine class and special gear for unnat toughness should really turn this into a non issue for women unwilling to play a male character.

The new faith talents can be stupid powerful if used right.

make her play a transvestite space wolf should be fun for her!

this is venison fur around my power fist, here is rabbit fur, cause the hydroliks leak all the time and anything else would be too expensive you know...

here is a ruby I got while killing a dragon on XYZ, see how it is so bright... What you want to know about the dragon, okay look at this badge i got it after all shinny and crux terminator something....

Kid Kyoto said:

The point I've tried to make a few times is that the reasons a female player wouldn't want to play a male Space Marine (too macho and voilent, not sensitive enough) are the very reasons that a woman wouldn't enjoy playing Deathwatch in the first place, even if you say her Space Marine has boobs...

crisaron said:

I think this is a hairy suggestion.

Alex

Hiromoon said:

See, it says quite plainly on page 27 of the DW rule book that all DW players start with 12,000 xp, plus an additional 1000 bonus after that to reflect personal choices. Let the wife make a hardcore SoB Seraphim (jump pack Sister), Dominion (heavy weapon specialist) or Tactical or whatever she likes, kit the character out with appropriate weaponry and other gear (vox, auspex, any other stuff) and let her join in on the fun. She gets the benefits of using faith (haven't looked at the Blood of Martyrs book yet, just the Inquisitor's Handbook fyi). Allow her limited benefits from squad mode to reflect some training but not full training and allow the Marines to benefit in some limited way to her faith abilities and run with it.

The hate towards any idea of icky girls getting to be Space Marines is bizarre and irrational.

My feeling is women can certainly be Marines and any pseduo science that says otherwise is just Imperial sexism at work.

But for some odd reason a lot of 40k fans are about as reasonable as the Taliban on this issue.

Regarding the above quote, you have to balance your "Real World" view and opinions, with the view, opinions and culture presented "In Game". In Game, there are no female Space Marines. There just aren't. It's not hate. It's just the reality of the setting. Attempting to claim otherwise is just inflammatory hyperbole and nothing else.

2nd Edit: Somehow, I still fail at quoting after the fact. Ah well.....

+1.

40k humanity are a horrible bunch alright. It's part of the charm of the [game] universe. 40k players refusing to accept female SMs isn't being 'unreasonable' and sexist; it's simply staying true to canon. In the same way that LoTR players might object to dark-skinned elves.

Siranui said:

Which is a problem.

We play games to have fun, ruining someone else's fun in order to 'stay true to canon' means players have their priorities backward.

A major point of the 40k universe is that the Imperium has firm and inflexible rules that make the Catholic Church or the IRS look mellow but NO ONE follows them. Everyone is a heretic in some way or another. And there are good stories to be had there.

So if the Noble Knights Space Marine chapter 3000 years ago started admitting women then that could be a pretty cool plot. Do they hide it (not too hard when everyone is 7' tall and in power armor)? Do other chapters and the Imperium tolerate it cause it's not worth a war? Or are they hated, hunted and loathed?

Breaking fluff rules adds to the game, adds to the universe and enhances fun and interest.

Enforcing them as though we were real world inquisitors depresses fun and cuts off story opportunities.

It's only a problem if there are players around the table who are being excluded, of course. Adhering to canon is not a problem if nobody is excluded or offended.

If people are likely to be offended, then we have several options: Play another game, break canon, play a member of the opposite gender, or work within canon to find another solution. For the sake of a consensual reality I personally favour the later option.

After all: Fans already 'wanted' female SMs, so GW went out and developed the SoB and built them into canon. Designing female SM Chapters to me seems to be re-inventing the wheel and making it the wrong size.

Yes; breaking with canon does allow new story-arcs. Of course it does. The pixies that live in every SM's backpack in our alternative-reality game could be the basis of dozens of story-arcs. But then so could the can[n!]on machine spirits. Canon provides a framework for a shared reality. I'd argue that developing storylines within canon requires far greater imagination and flair for narrative than simply declaring 'anything goes' and installing pixies in wargear, or whatever else you fancy: 'Make believe' is easy when there are no rules at all.

Kid Kyoto said:

I'm not sure which sources you're citing when you say the "...NO ONE follows them [the rules]...". Story-wise, it might be interesting, but I wouldn't have a hard time arguing that having a female SM, "hiding" in power armor would still be instantly noticeable, simply because there is already an STC in use for female power armor. And it is obviously feminine.

The problem here is that you're (the player) trying to take your Real World views and apply them directly to a game. This has always been the bane of setttings that are less than democratic in nature. And please, lay off the heavy-handed hyperbole. it can easily be said that the one person you're defending is ruining the fun of all the other players.

As for your assertion that "breaking the rules adds to the game". Maybe they do sometimes, but if your rules breaking causes the game to devolve into ethics discussions instead of actually playing the game, then all you're doing is keeping people from playing the game. To put it another way, let the GM add the drama into the game. I'm sure the GM is perfectly capable of putting difficult decisions that might impinge on personal honor in the game without having to go through marathon sessions of Snowflake Player A whining away about how they can't do what they want when they want.

Michigan said:

HERESY!!!! no i think there should be some female primarchs its kind of sexists altho the sisters of silence are pretty badass when you get down to it.

PatchesOHullihan said:

..... HERESY!! The great and holy Emperor of mankind never made female Primarchs.....

Also just to put this out there I think that SMs can't procreate.

EDIT: forgot to add this

@Illithidelderbrain

I agree with your idea..........Making an up to rank SoB is the best idea to overcome this problem....Especially with the new DH release of BoM.

Having a PC that has the True Faith powers is awesome

i am a girlie and i total in love playing a space marine - space wolf at that......if girls don't want to play male charaters....theres the door see you next week when we play some light and fluffy....mmmm thinking of fluffy thats a wolf for ya....

I don't always want to play girlie charaters....