What additional units should be included in the FOTB expansion? Besides the T34/76, SU-122, and KV-1, what other vehicles, tanks, guns, or other accessories would make this expansion a truly excellent representation of the Eastern Front? In my opinion, the war in the east is distinct from the western front because of the classical matchup between superior firepower (Germans) vs. superior numbers (Russians). Likewise, many of the tactical battles were decided by leadership and tactical skills of German soldiers and Panzer commanders and their variety of weapons in combined arms kampfgruppes.

For the German Kampfgruppe:

1. The Puma armored car. Used for recon. Rules could include allowing this unit to move into cover and remain unspotted, or could improve the firepower of friendly units firing at enemy units within a certain sight radius of the Puma, (maybe 2 or 3 hexes?)

2. The Wirblewind Quad 20mm flak tank. Used on the eastern front primarily against infantry. A unit that could provide some interesting scenarios where mostly infantry units are engaged, possibly as a reinforcement option.

3. Wespe or Hummel self propelled artillery tank.. Again, a most useful unit against all those Russian squads trying to overwhelm the kampfgruppe.

4. The 75mm Pak AT gun. The standard defensive unit against the Russian horde of T-34 tanks (besides the 88mm flak gun.

5. The famous JadgPanther 88mm assault gun tank. Just got to have at least 1 show up as a reinforcement if the T-34s break through.

6. German sniper unit/figures.( Maybe in kneeling position with rifle scope obvious) You just know there is going to be a Stalingrad scenario.

7. German Panzer leader (upper half) which could be placed in the commander hatch of any German tank.

For the Russian Mechanized Company:

1. The 122mm howitzer, used quite often as a direct fire weapon at closer ranges. Usually in a bunker as part of a static defence.

2. The 76,2 mm AT gun, usually plenty of them, as at Kursk, deployed with infantry and minefields.

3. Submachinegun figures. The classic submachinegun infantry riding with the T-34 tanks. Rules could give them excellent firepower but reduce their range to 2 hexes. Makes for some wild infantry assaults, or T34 overruns with infantry assault combined.

4. Sniper figures, (Maybe more prone, with bi pod) . Could be used to represent an anti tank rifle unit as well. Going to need a few of these in that Stalingrad scenario. Maybe special rules for snipers to allow them recon capabilities

5. Distinctive Commissar Leader figure. Maybe combined together with a jeep as a unit to "inspire" other infantry squads.

Accessories:

1. Wreckage figure to replace destroyed tanks. Rules could allow an engineer vehicle to repair the wreck. The wreck would be a stacking point but could be removed by engineer unit or towed back to a repair station.

2. Bunker models, in which the AT guns, or larger 120 mm mortar unit could be set into.

Thats all I thought of for now. I am sure there are plenty of others. What do the rest of you gamers out there think?

For the German Kampfgruppe:

8.- (Sd Kfz 184)"Elephant" "Ferdinand" German SP Assault Gun/Tank Destroyer 8.8cm(3.5") Mounted on Porsche Tiger Tank chassis. This was a heavy assault gun/tank destroyer with a fixed superstructure. Completed in time for Kursk offensive.

9.- (Sd Kfz 164)"Nashorn" (Rhinoceros) "Hornisse" (Hornet) German SP AT 8.8 cm Gun. Big and powerful SP artillery piece with the 88mm gun on a 24 ton chassis. Chassis design combines best features of PzKw III and PzKw IV. Interim tank destroyer. Open fighting compartment, thin armor and high silhouette were problems. Saw action in Italy, the West and Russia .

In many scenarios the US start with a swarm of sherman. I just look forward to play with a swarm of T34 instead... And according to the description, the T34 is going to one beast of a tank compared the the sherman...

Miscellaneous other stuff that might make the game even more interesting:

1. metal bases and magnetic base figures (much easier to remove or add). The base could be flatter than the plastic base which would make the figures more realistic looking, as if they were actually on the terrain tile. Another base type could be a clear plastic base similar to the original type.

2. An additional set of counters that are red with white figures/symbols, to use as reminders what actions units are taking. I saw them in the rules book, but there were none in the set that came with the basic TOI game.

3. Prepainted 144th scale plastic tank and vehicles from Can-Do Pocket Army or similar type company. That may be asking too much, but it would really be quite a nice game with such detailed models. And a storage box designed especially for the models to fit into. If I am not mistaken, the 144th scale model tanks would be just slightly larger than the PzKw-MkIV model in the original TOI. About like the size of the Tiger II model from Normandy expansion set.

4. Additional sets of prepainted figures from Axis &Allies minatures to match nicely with the 144th scale tanks. For German: The panzergrenadier unit and the "commander" unit (which almosts looks like Rommel with his hand pointing) are my favorites. For Russian: conscript unit and the submachinegun infantry unit (A&A) are about the right brown color to differentiate them from the German infantry. Theres also a Commissar officer with pistol.

5. Some jeeps to be used with commander units.

Some other models: Russian: T34/85, SU 152 German: Maultier- halftrack with Nebelwerfer

6. Airplanes (like those in the Memoir 44 air pack) on the clear plastic bases. Makes a really nice addition to the game when airstrikes are available and planes can get shot down. Which makes have AA guns interesting as well.

7. Combined deck of cards, or a fewer number of decks,( rather than so many decks with only about 10 cards each). Thats probably already in FOTB from what I have read, but not sure yet.( just my own opinion,) as other players may like all those individualized decks for more detailed scenarios.

Well, thats all for now. Maybe if I type enough words and keep posting, the Fury of the Bear designers will see all this imput and do something to make the game worth spending the money. And then make it available to purchase in the near future. Does anyone think the designers are reading the posts on this forum?

VanCamper said:

Uh… no.

At this point seeing any additional units is looking more like a pipe dream every day.

The thing about tide of iron is that its a miniature game based on scenarios. And, lets face it, if you have played a scenario once, the interest in playing it again is not that good. In addition, the opening scenarios are not very good. Tide of iron has simple nice neat rules, but which gives a fearly historic correctness feeling to it. But what I'm getting at is that it does reqiure more support than a regular board game.

Compare it to for example battlestar gallactica the board game (also a good game) which you can play over and over again based on the same game and same rules. There is almost no need for support. And an expansion is just a bonus.

Tide of iron is different. The players want new toys to make new scenarios, cover more fronts. There are allways more rules which are strange and odd. A constantly income of good scenarios is required etc. I think its as simple as fantasy flight games underestimated the support requiered for such a game.

But when that is said, I love miniature games in generall, but I hate games work shop, atleast warhammer 40k. And its a pitty that the biggest miniatur game on the marked is an horrible game.

id like to see some cavalry units and some tank rider rules would be nice

ROO said:

Tank riders are a must for the eastern front.