Wow...Brotherhood are now officially playable for sure.
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=1713
Funny thing is that this week I just built that deck (Neutral House w/ Brotherhood and out of house yummies), so this fits in perfectly.
As I have said many times (tongue in cheek):
~All we need now is a Ghost of High Heart reprint so that guy actually get to play with his card without it being rotated prematurely
Just to make sure everyone is paying attention, you do get that you will never be able to trigger Hollow Hill and draw when you play a neutral card, right?
Right - I would be splashing a lot of other house characters.
Too bad no locations (or attachments) though - I would love to get GTM's and Iron Mines as well (although I can still play Alliance I guess).
I've been playing with a Neutral-noble deck for a few months now. It started out as Night's Watch (Mil and Int agendas only), then went to Wildlings (Stealth and reducer), but this location will make the deck switch to Brotherhood. I'll even add Joffrey back in and Balon just to try and get the extra card draw, and I might even be able to replace Alliance. Might make the deck more reliable now.
And after a year or so of this then I guess it's time for some AROK reprints like Black Walder?
Geez, I would think there was enough nuetral hate out there right now already, but who knows
rings said:
Geez, I would think there was enough nuetral hate out there right now already, but who knows
The only thing is that the current neutral hate, makes you hate yourself for wasting precious card slots.
FATMOUSE said:
rings said:
Geez, I would think there was enough nuetral hate out there right now already, but who knows
The only thing is that the current neutral hate, makes you hate yourself for wasting precious card slots.
Isn't that the point (about meta cards)?
MWNK/Rein. really isn't an empty spot(s) if you want to go that way.
rings said:
Isn't that the point (about meta cards)?
MWNK/Rein. really isn't an empty spot(s) if you want to go that way.
Well, if you want to create any level of consistency you pretty much have to run 9-12x of MWNK/Rein. That's a lot of deck space for an OK army, and "meh" events. Then you have to have 2-3 gold laying around, not to mention it's a Limited Response. The Limited part isn't too big of a deal, but Responses are fairly cancelable when facing Martell, which is probably the most popular House for Brotherhood at the moment. Though, Hollow Hill may change that once it comes out. Of course Brotherhood isn't the only deck type running neutrals, but I think basic character/location control is currently more effective than running MWNK/Rein.
hey so mwnk rein meansssss what cause im lost
Excellent, time to build that 21 refugee deck I've dreamed of!
Seriously though, it could work and it'd be great to see all these mighty warriors like the red viper, blackfish, stannis etc just being run over by an endless stream of homeless guys...a bums rush if you will...
Think of the events as 1 cost, 3 strength characters and they are not all that horrible. They certainly are rarely if ever 'dead cards' (i.e. cards that you CAN'T play if your opponent isn't playing nuetrals). And a 4 cost, 5 strength army with no attachments and two icons is never 'dead' either. *shrug*
Are they the best cards in the game, every game...probably not. Are they underpowered vs. non-nuetral decks but way overpowered (as any stealing effect is) vs. nuetral decks? Yep! And that is the definition of meta cards (see: Traitorous Crows)!
I never said they were dead. I don't equate "OK" and "meh" with dead. The Crows are (or were, I should say) a much more effective meta-card, in my opinion. Post-errata, they are more or less dead. We'll only see them in NW decks, which we probably won't see much of, if at all
It will certainly be interesting to see if MWNK gets some action. If there was ever a time to run it, now would be the best, but even against a neutral deck it takes some luck to pull it off. Unless you're running Lannister or Summer, the costs seem rather high. Only time will tell. I still think other character and location control is better to run at the moment, but I certainly wouldn't mind being proven wrong by a tourney winning deck.
I agree with rings. stealthy renown dudes for one gold - not really meh IMO. More like why not? The whole thing comes down to what events you cut to fit them in - or do you go over that dreaded 10-12 event threshold?
The cancellable thing is a drawback - but that's why they are meta cards.
If you run Dobbler's Agenda, do you worry about that 10-12 even threshold any more?
Stag Lord said:
Because they aren't actual 1 gold, printed 3 STR, stealth, renown, character cards. As Kennon points out, Knights of the Hollow Hill will make them more worthwhile; but in general, non-setup, non-marhsal, monocon, printed X STR, needing to lose a challenge type of the same icon, and have to pay 1 gold (don't underestimate how much most of usually rely on reducers for economy) is pretty horrible. Stealth and renown bring it up to "meh" (which isn't bad, but it's not good). Just because a card can trigger a potentially devastating effect on another card, doesn't make the original card good. I know that's not what you're saying, and I know rings isn't saying that either, but I think it's a factor, if not a subconscious one, when trying to justify the use of the card. The intrigue one actually is pretty bad, despite Stealth and Renown. When your opponent has intrigue it's vulnerable to claim, and when your opponent doesn't have intrigue it will never leave your hand. The same can be said of the military and power ones, but to a much lesser extent.
I actually think the Summer and Winter ones are better than their monocon counterparts. They don't have renown or stealth, but you can lose any challenge to play them as tricon Armies, making them much more versatile. Not to mention, they are 4 STR (still printed X STR) and have deadly. That said, it must be your season (which admittingly seems easier to maintain these days than in the past). The -1 Winter makes it more difficult to have that extra gold, but the Summer one shouldn't be too difficult to play due to the income bonus. If my deck was season dependent, I'd run those before running the monocon ones.
I agree the intrigue one isn't as good, due to you having the chance of losing it before you play it (actually all of them have that drawback). And they are all hurt by things like Confession and the new Holy Bara location.
But, to me dead cards are cards that you can't use if they are not used for their meta ability (say, the discard all nuetrals event).
rings said:
But, to me dead cards are cards that you can't use if they are not used for their meta ability (say, the discard all nuetrals event).
Again , I'm not saying the cards are dead cards. I've never said that (although, I did suggest that certain icons could be sitting in your hand for most, if not the entire game given your opponent's characters' icon distribution and STR in a challenge type.). I'm simply saying there is nothing special or particularly good about the monocon reinforcement events to make someone run them given their drawbacks. Knight of the Hollow Hill, may alleviate some of those drawbacks, but I haven't tried or seen this yet; so I'm not going to speculate even though I have an opinion on what would probably happen.
So you just run three "Retreat and Regroup" to trigger MWNK, and not worry so much about pulling off the combo. Or winning the tournament.
What will tell whether MWNK makes a comeback will be how many decks run OOH cards thanks to the Neutral House and Brotherhood agendas, and the crazy Stark Bolton steal decks.
see - and I think there is soemhting "special or particularly good" about the reinforcements: they are way undercosted characters with important abilities: stealth, renown or deadly/tricons.
You have to decide if the fact they can be cancelled and that they can't be setup outweighs these benefits. I'm really not as worried about fear of Iwnter anymore (and quite frankly - as a Baratheon player I was never losing sleep about it in the first place).
So if teh event/chaarcters are good enough on thier own (in a dedciated deck - garnted) then MWNK is kind of a no brainer. And a nice check on Wildlings, Brotherhood and teh neutral house if it ever becomes popular.
Stag Lord said:
What has it to do with Fear of Winter?
Stag is bringing up Fear because of the drawback of the Reinforcements being non-setup cards, thus making you more vulnerable to ramifications of Fear first turn.
As I stated before, the tricon events are much better than their monocon counterparts. If you really want to run MWNK, the best Reinforcements event line-up is probably 3x Summer (or Winter much tougher on economy though) Reserves, 3x Retreat and Regroup, and 3x Missing Recruit. Maybe throw in 1-2x Beguiled Bodyguard for some extra consistency or swap them with Missing Recruit if you feel the power icon really suits the needs of your deck more.