After finishing up on Dusk at the end of The Haarlock's Legacy, we're all Rank 7/8 and on the cusp of Ascension. The sacrifice made to realise what had to be done to stop Haarlock's return was made by one of my acolytes, one of his few pieces of significant/recurring backstory: that he had a love interest. The Dusk Hag sent the Daemon in the Mirror after her and it is wholly presumed that her soul has been devoured, her body possessed.

Now, as you might imagine, this player is pretty peeved. The other characters argued the point in calling him an idiot on the point, that he should've drove a harder deal. In any case: he made his choice and now has more'n a slight vendetta against the Dusk Hag. (The only 'show of power' she made was to snap someone's wrist for being smartass and to general otherwise only give the 'idea' of great power.)

The question then is: what to do with her? The Witching Dark has since past, the acolytes are stranded on Dusk and the expectation is that the next session will see us a month or two later. (My NPC/tag-along for the Legacy managed to get a message out to another of my NPCs whilst the PCs arrived on Sinophia in the present-day as one of my own additions to the Paths of Time, so he's due to be bringing a ship, hopefully, to Dusk.

Anyhow, as we're approaching Ascension, I highly suspect one of the major parts appealing to the Acolytes is 'making their own vendettas Imperial Business', wherein one is surely likely to go after the Dusk Hag, amongst others (notably the Logicians).

Does anyone have any thoughts on this mysterious hag? I have a few vague ideas, but I'm simply unsure at present.

Well, the Dusk Hag could quite possibly be one of the Seven Devils of Calixis. Radical's Handbook, page 97.

-The Eater of the Dead: Mord'dagan, supernatural beast of legend, godhead of the Saynay cannibal cult, Dusk.

Although, only the name "Mord'dagan" really ties this together, which is purely circumstantial. The name itself is pretty similar to a Celtic goddess named Morrigan, Morgan or Morrigu who was generally viewed as a negative entity of war, strife and prophecy.

Anyway, what makes this attractive is that it gives you not just some lonely old weirdo living in the Dusk swamps, but pursuing a vendetta against her will put your players up against the legendary Saynay cannibals. That's pretty win, in my opinion.

As the godhead of the Saynay, fighting her would probably involve destroying numerous altars and temples to loosen her grip on Dusk, before a final, climactic confrontation as the characters cleanse her final unholy sites of Worship.

Also, if the Hag is one of the Seven Devils, she's one badass daemon. Perhaps the party needs to track down a holy artifact and use it to defeat her (before returning it to the Ordo Malleus). If you haven't already run the Space Hulk scenario from Purge the Unclean, that would be a pretty good side adventure. Although they might have to track down some clues to the location of the Hulk first (having it appear on a collision course with whatever planet they are on might not be the height of subtlety)...

As a part of defeating her, the players might learn about the other Devils and start investigating what the heck they are...in the process stumbling across the Hyades locks (of which there also happen to be seven...)...

I'd say writer her up as some kind of annoying figure who disappears from the 40k forum that started DHRP when the Inquisitor's Handbook wasn't even available to go to some overly commercialized Lala land of a forum where everything that BL publishes is amazing and no voices of dissent may be raised, lest the ban hammer falls.

That said Xisor: Exterminatus. A single Cyclonic Torpedo will see that the Dusk Hag never again sees the light of day seeing as how her worship is entirely based around Dusk. Without so many local cults paying credence to her, she becomes an idea that no one remembers.

The Baron said:

I'm part of Xisor's group, and in my GM run, this plan is unlikely to work, as the Dusk Hag managed to down a starship in my arc...

I played her less of an outright antagonist, but more as a monstrous entity which barely used the acolytes to remove an opponent to her motivations.

Also [spoiler for Xisor]: She may have found a way to spread her influence beyond Dusk, by infecting the soul of one of the Acolytes.

LordLucan said:

Didn't think I'd see you here Lucan. How have you been, my old friend?

The plan would work . Launch a cyclonic torpedo from far enough away... or transport it down to the surface... if all else fails, nothing like a good old fashioned genocide (to quote Ian Watson "We will restore order through wanton terrorism! To slay is to pray!").

As for infecting the soul of one Acolyte... nothing that can't be solved with a bullet and an extra large mop

Well, according to RT the Saynay cannibal clans are already in Koronus.

And as a major warp power, I doubt she's constrained to one planet...unless of course she was bound there somehow...

True, true.

I think we're using her as a 'stranded' sort, where she's simply at her most powerful on Dusk and her influence declines as it extends away.

Or perhaps she's in exile? Not quite bound, but held back by threat?

My personal choice, mainly because it's not terribly common in DH threats, is choice. or whimsy, to an extent. Monstrously powerful warp powers aren't just about conquering the world or destroying all civilisation. Some of the most unholy powers simply live tricking idiots into giving up the things most important to them whilst hiding in a swamp in Space Australia...

I still say one good genocide could break her power.

Or, maybe, instead of a genocide you could always get the Ordo Hydra in on Calaxis

As I recall, the astropath's plan at the commencement for dealing with the Ordo Hydra was genocide too.

I think my character, Talon, will be pushing her plan in the following way: encourage someone else to deal with it. It might be her homeworld, but in her mind that puts her a little too close to the problem...perhaps. Therefore: have someone else do it!

(Nominate Hek & Silon)

Having said all that, the Saynay are in Koronus, hmm? Intriguing. Dusk's the 'very edge of proper space', I like the idea of odd cults 'inspired' by her that sort of spin off as little whorly vortices scattered about the place. Used, but not a grand conspiracy. Bloody irritating and surprisingly powerful/influential, but not a 'threat' in the same way as many other cults. Hmmm...

My personal guess is that she...and the other devils...are probably bound to something in their locales: IE the Hyades Locks. Or even that they are the locks somehow.

Just what those locks are, how they function or what they constrain is pure speculation, but it does seem like something that could be related to the Tyran Star (although that could be said for most plot devices in Calixis...).

My approach to the hag:
I take her as a witch that grew so powerful that she is now bordering on daemonhood. Similiar to the witch featured in the " Pumpkin Head " horror frenchise, she unleashes the powers of the warp on the bequest of others..for a price. In my version, the price always included "her share" which she sold to demons for powers on her own accord (leaving her "customers" with the ultimately sour side of the deals).

As long as she is on the peak of her power, it is nearly impossible to face her on everything but her own terms. What one would need to find would be a tool to take her powers from her. Weakinging her supply in "petitioners" would be one option. In addtion, some holy weapon might be in need as well. Bombing the whole planet would be an option, but since the Imperium sacrifices untold lifes to actually TAKE this planet (as a colony) I do not think the Imperium will allow such an exterminatus. Or more precisely: will declare the offender EXECOMMUNICATES after the deed.

So, it would be aquiering a suitable holy weapon (from the Ministorum, me guesses) and then a lot of cult-hunting on dusk.

Gregorius21778 said:

I.e. Either destroy the entire planet or commit genocide.

Listen to the man Lucan and Xisor. He knows what he's talking about!!

(High-five Gregorius21778! )

Blow up the planet? with what? The ship that rescues them is not theirs or equipped with cyclonics or virus bombs, and calling down an exterminatus might be hard, as Talon and the gang are not massively popular with the Inquisition (Theta cell cause massive collateral damage. I've decided in my arc to see what happens when this casual attitude of blowing everything up catches up with them...)

LordLucan said:

LordLucan, my good sir, have you never read Inquisition Wars?

They send a coded message with the three D's in it from an anonymous pierce of communications equipment, either don't use their Inquisitorial call-sign or use another Inquisitor's, and kaboom. Space Marine kill-team comes in and kills every single living thing to the point that the planet no longer exists.

As for backlash (by the way, it's interesting to see Xisor recycled Talon), there's the famous political plays of the Inquisition. Official sanctions won't work seeing as how a casual attitude to blowing everything up describes Istavaanists, Monodominants, and Recongregators. In fact, each of those three factions would approve of Theta Cell's actions (Istavaanists because it caused conflict, Monodominants because it cleansed a powerful warp entity and a great deal of heretics, and Recongregators because this causes a flux in the Imperial Guard recruitment posts that will cause certain worlds, like Acerage, to undergo an increase in Imperial attention and thereby a change in their archaic form of government). Those who wouldn't approve are primarily Libricars and Almathians (maybe the Xanthites pending how many of them don't like losing a daemon to consort with like the Hag).

Thus no official sanctions could be leveled seeing as how there would be as many, if not more, supporters of their actions than those against it. Of course, the Libricars and the Xanthites have been to take "unofficial sanction" if you get my drift. Particularly the Libricars who would have a heart attack at the very thought of destroying Dusk.

Recycled Talon as a girl, I'll have you know. Much more rounded than Mae has been.

Regarding sanctions for the Cell's actions in destroying planets: they'll come largely in the form of execution, I should think. Evidence for 'what the Dusk Hag is' resides almost soley within the mind of our group's massively tainted and distrusted psyker. The others, our 'resurrected by Mara and now retired Scum' and 'our mad Lychen guardsman' have since moved on to the protection of another of my characters (now an NPC and Halo-device-sporting High Judiciary of Sinophia), and thus are being 'sidelined' for a while.

That leaves our (highly uninformed) Sollexan Secutor and Talon herself. Talon, however, is likely to be the executor of any such sanction. That is: she's resolutely Amalathian at the moment. A dictum of 'non interference' (or rather: kill those who make a ripple) seems emergent for her at the moment, and so she's devoted to stopping people from messing things up even more. Persuading her that destroying Dusk is a good idea is unlikely. This does, of course, present a fine opportunity for other player's to turn on Talon, I'm sanguine about that.

Regarding the Dusk Hag: because of her current status as 'almost untouchable' by other powers, the other factor to consider is that our characters simply cannot know what we know about her. Our psyker has a bee in his bonnet, an insufficient motivation for genocide in the eyes of his peers, mainly because we disapprove of psykers taking the lead. Distrust and all that.

Even Talon's knowledge is limited by her own speculation. In her view there's still bigger fish to fry: super-powered daemon-talking psykers are simply not the biggest threat out there. The Logicians, some other hereteks and other Inquisitors were almost ready to seize the Haarlock legacy on almost equally successful footing as Theta Cell was: Pursuing the Dusk Hag is a side-quest.

Of course, if there was a way to actually *discover* that the tube the Dusk Hag had in her hand contained the Haarlock Warrant, I imagine that'd change things. But that's a meta-curio at this point, we've no proper way of knowing and no proper way of finding out. The only way I can see of knowing is allowing Nico, our psyker, to get close enough to 'press for information' but still be rebuffed. This'd build a team's vendetta and allow the team to relay the information, one way or another, to the Inquisition and setup an 'anti-Dusk Hag' campaign wherein, for some points, genocide/planetkill is indeed an option.

Unfortunately, we can't yet achieve that, so it has to remain far in the future. *Or* we allow someone else (NPC) to have that encounter and relay the details back to the Inquisition and finally back to Theta Cell (or any other game's player group of acolytes!)

The Baron said:

I am sorry, Baron, but you get me very very wrong. I do NOT recommend to blow up the planet (the Imperium seems to want this world) and I do NOT think that genocide is the solution (since I do NOT assume that EVERYBODY on Dusk is a cultist bowing to the Dusk hag).

But a major cleansing, including a lot of villages to cast to the fire, should be fine. This alone will not solve it, so. One does only need to root out those unsaveable, but to keep together those sheeps that are threaten to leaf the flock. Fire alone is not the answer unless it goes hand in hand with preaching and spreading the word.

I hope I'm not too late to the party to chip in a few ideas.

I don't really know all to much about the Dusk Hag or the Saynay cannibals, so I wont pretend to know what I'm going on about, but a thought occurs;

Bladehate said:

Bladehate said:

A twist on these two ideas; What if said temples weren't originally intended as a place of reverence towards the Hag, but instead a way of binding her to Dusk, put in place by either a Inquisitor gone radical and using his blashpemous knowledge to seal her there, or a darker power seeking to exploit her for their own ends... OR perhaps temples could originally have been a place of good, but over time the Hag has slowly corrupted their followers, the Saynay, in an attempt to free herself (possibly in a huge Xanatos Gambit, hoping that someday someone would come along and destroy the 'cursed' temples).

The only reason I'm suggesting this is that I enjoy mind ******* the PCs;

"Yay you succeeded in destroying the last templum, the Dusk Hag thanks you for freeing her, and says that because of this devotion she will be sure to spare your souls until last, before promptly disappearing..."

Of course you'd have to hints as to what is really going on, which might be more trouble that its worth..

Well thats my two cents anyway... Hopefully I haven't screwed up the established cannon too much