Thank you for the quick response. I guess for some issues such as the Doppelganger's skill O remain contentious and will have to wait for clarification from FFG in their next revised FAQ.

However, I have yet another question. What happen if Doppelganger becomes insane? Will it retain the characteristics of the character he has copied once he is restored? From what I think, it will lost its text ability of copying and therefore when it is restored, it will just be a plain Doppelganger with no icons and no abilities.

Am I thinking the right way?

Curious: has anyone attempted to use the "Rules Questions" link at the bottom of the page to get an "official" answer to these questions?

Reason: there are 6 rules questions that I have been asking through the link that have not been answered. I first sent on 11/17/10 and have resent once per week, the last being yesterday... I am curious to know if anyone gets a response from FFG around rules issues...

Tokhuah said:

I'm waiting on my May, 2010 question still.

Going back to doppelganger, I'm still not 100% convinced as the card doesn't state "pay x and then put into play....", It says "when you play, pick a character and x is = to character printed cost". It looks to me that the decision is made before playing the doppelganger.

msommi said:

Yes, but the language is unclear. I see both sides. You could argue that no card comes into play or has its effects active until the cost has been paid. If so, then you have to pay the X value before you could apply the effects. In other words it is not a copy until after it is actually played. (So no come into play affects could actually work, I think.)

Conversely, you could argue that the card basically copies another first to create a cost and effect. Then it can have come into play affects, as well as cost reductions, etc.

Or maybe there is another way to interpret it as well...

You did put it in a very clear way, professor. The x ia not set until the character is chosen. Also, in my opinion, my version is more in style with the character, as a dopplelganger is an exact copy of a character meaning that every part of the character is being copied including entering effects and discounts. It is also a much cooler card this way.

Regardless, it still says "printed cost". The printed cost of the AA is three.

Well sure, its printed cost is 3, and the cost is reduced by 1 because it is an investigator and there is already an AA on the table. So you would have to pay 2 to play it. Just like a regular AA.

TheProfessor said:

So... are you also suggesting that if I had three priestesses of bubastis in play, and three ghoulish worshipers I could copy my opponent's Shubby with Dopple by exausting all the priestesses and using a domain with a single yog resource on it despite Dopple being neither an Ancient One nor a Shubby card until after it is played?

I simply disagree. The way I see Dopple working is this:

1) You announce you're going to play Dopple.

2) You announce which target you're going to copy.

3) You check the printed cost, and pay that cost.

4) Dopple enters play, becoming the copy.

It's in step 4 that it turns into the AA or the Deep One or whatever. In fact, given that, I can see arguments where Emerging Deep One doesn't necessarily trigger since it's after you play it from your hand. Although I still think it does since when it entered play it became the EDO and it came from your hand. Either way it triggers AFTER it enters play. The same applies to AA I believe. Dopple isn't the AA until it enters play. I don't believe there is some ephemeral time when it is in your hand, before it enters play, that it exists as the AA. I believe it is a Dopple in your hand, you determine the cost, pay it, and it enters play as the AA.

Another thing I was thinking of...

Lets say you have a Dreamlands Fanatic in play. Through some mechanic some other character leaves play. Could I then play Dopple for free, as a Dreamlands Fanatic since I'm claiming that he has that response text since I'm going to make him a DF? If you make the argument that the cost to play him as an AA is reduced by one since you're playing him as an AA, then this scenario has to also apply. In both cases they would have to exist as the target card, while in your hand, prior to paying the cost.

KallistiBRC said:

If shubby wasn't a unique character I would say yes.

KallistiBRC said:

I would say also yes. That's the way I see it. If this seems too powerful, remember that doppelganer exist in play as long as the original is in play.

The cards refers to the printed cost of the card being copied. X is for sure the printed cost. It doesn't say pay the printed cost and then put in play. It doen't say how you put in play a character, So even a DF can be fully copied.

But it's just speculations here. I'm happy with both solutions as long as we know which one to use. This doppel is really stirring some S...

""""So... are you also suggesting that if I had three priestesses of bubastis in play, and three ghoulish worshipers I could copy my opponent's Shubby with Dopple by exausting all the priestesses and using a domain with a single yog resource on it despite Dopple being neither an Ancient One nor a Shubby card until after it is played?

The dreamland fanatic has a triggered effect in response of something. You put into play the Dreamland Fanatic by triggering its effect, you don't play the Fanatic. So again it can't work with the Doppel. The Doppel's effect works only if you play it.

Dadajef said:

I agree 100% actually. My point was actually to illustrate that if you start following the idea that the Dopple becomes another character in your hand and gets all the text before it actually enters play, it opens the door for all sorts of stuff like this.

KallistiBRC said:

Yeah you are right. probably it would get too wild and out of control.... like playing a flock of dreamland fanatics all in one go.

Additional question came up in our games yesterday.

I think we covered it before, but cannot recall 100%.

When Doppel is in the Discard Pile...and you want to use an Unspeakable Ressurection on it ....what happens ? Also....can you play U-R on it....(paying, 3 for example) - and then announce it's coming into play as a selected 3-cost enemy character in play ? (say, Agency Groundskeeper)

* - also, he's a good example....when you play Doppel, you ignore all such restrictions as Loyal or Steadfast (that would normally be affecting you if you tried to a play a "real" copy of a given card - instead of having Doppel copy one in play) .....right ??

- Lastly ....I had a situation (pretty cool by my opponent) - where I managed to get Yog-Sothoth (the new one) into play pretty early - like Turn-4....and things were looking good. Part of the reason was 1-Seeker of Mysteries, and then me playing a Doppel - copying the existing Seeker of Mysteries . . .

Well...my opponent pulled a great trick out of his sleeve, just when he needed it. He used Demented Librarian to look at the top 3-cards of my deck..putting 1-on the bottom of the deck, and the other two back on top, in his chosen order.

He then played Horrid Dreams - which I think is a 3-cost Miska card that makes the opponent discard the top card of his deck...and then that player must choose and sacrifice a card of the same faction (that he has in play) - if able.

Since he had just gotten to RIG the "flip" - with Demented Librarian, he KNEW what I would have ....that's right...it was a Yog-Sothoth card. Result...I had to sac a Yog card (the only ones I had in play were Doppel and Yog himself).

So what we paused for, for a moment, was .........is Doppel actually still a Yog-card at this point, and eligible to be sacrificed ? - - - or is the "exact copy" wording that the card uses, mean he is ACTUALLY a "Neutral Card" - with all the wording, etc - of a normal Seeker of Mysteries..... ?

* - we played it that he had, in fact, 100% transformed into a Neutral card - and thus I had to Sac Yog...... - grrr..... well played by my foe, however !

Sounds good ?

Rosh87 said:

For the Unspeakable Ressurection: While Dopple is in your discard pile, he'll be a 0 cost card since the X is "Unless specified by a preceding card, card effect, or granted player choice, the letter "X" is always equal to zero." It's in the discard pile, so its not copying anything, so X is 0. So yes, you can use UR to bring it into play w/o draining a domain or anything.

The reason you wouldn't need to pay 3, in your example, is that the effect only activates when played from your hand. Coming in from the discard pile doesn't activate it's passive text. So while you can use UR to bring it in, he'll only really be useful as a combat/insanity buffer.

For the Loyal/Steadfast restricitions. This is another example where if you follow the flow that you announce the target, set X, play it, and then it becomes the target character as it enters play you don't have to worry about the Loyal/Steadfast/CostReduction/FactionRestrictions/etc. It's the Yog card named Dopple until it enters play at which point it switches to the target.

As for the the final question.... Well now that's a tricky one. Using the "becomes an exact..." logic, I'd be inclined to say you played this one correct. I think the easiest ruling that removes most ambiguity is the "pretend you had another actual Seeker of Mysteries card sitting in the Dopple's place" at which point it's Neutral and Yog is the only valid target.