Related to said spoiler:
That would be a pity, as it's rather cliched. Then again, perhaps a hallucination at least sometimes is not a 100% accurate prophetic vision and represents what the marine fears rather than what's true.
The Storm Warden Primarch
CaptainLoken said:
Salamanders. I believe the background says that the Salamanders were never divided, but the coal black skin and glowing eyes, despite being due to a malfunctioning gland, could be tied to genetic conditions on their home world too. The Salamanders recruit from the natives of only one world, so perhaps their geneseed would behave differently with another human population. They DO tithe geneseed appropriately to the High Lords, so it is possible that another chapter was created without their knowledge.
Salamanders didn't have a Second Founding but they do have Successor Chapters. The black skin is due to radiation on their home world.
My bet is on Ultramarines or White Scars. I do find it annoying that so many DIY Chapters feel the need to be snowflakes with Traitor geneseed or a mysterious Primarch. I assume in this case it was at least done for purposes of story so it could be revealed later.
Hidaowin said:
In the adventure in the GM screen
Spoilers!
Hallucinations cause the Space Marines to have different nightmarish visions, the Storm Wardens visions relate to a demonic Primarch roaring at them to join him. This makes me lean towards Angron or Mortarion as the Storm Wardens Primarch.
That.
Balodek said:
Salamanders didn't have a Second Founding but they do have Successor Chapters. The black skin is due to radiation on their home world.
My bet is on Ultramarines or White Scars. I do find it annoying that so many DIY Chapters feel the need to be snowflakes with Traitor geneseed or a mysterious Primarch. I assume in this case it was at least done for purposes of story so it could be revealed later.
Yeah, that is why I am ruling that out. There is already a lot of hinting that the Blood Ravens are made from Thousand Sons Geneseed, so I don't think it should be overdone.
The loyal Death Guard that got away with Captain Garro became the first Inqusitors.
If I remember correctly, the two missing primarchs / legions where here to let players create their own chapter, without referring to a specific primarch (GW wise). So, Storm Warden could come from here. I would be disappointed if they came from a traitor legion, as GW is reluctant to make loyalist traitor legion successor. Blood Raven could be an exception, as they are the video game iconic chapter and video games tend to have a wider public (so less attached to the fluff and more attached to the special or heroic aspect).
The Adeptus Terra is clear on this subject : There is not a single space marine chapter coming from the traitor legion. So, there isn't and it is heresy to even slightly doubt it. May HIS word be known by all !
Cifer said:
That would be a pity, as it's rather cliched. Then again, perhaps a hallucination at least
sometimes
is not a 100% accurate prophetic vision and represents what the marine fears rather than what's true.
If you want to avoid cliché, then WH40K is going to be very hard to do, especially anything to do with Space Marines (or Eldar, or Orks, or Tyranids, or...).
If there isn't anything to do with the number 9 in the Storm Wardens, then it's most likely Angron given this new information. Mortarion and his legion were obsessed with the number 9.
SpawnoChaos said:
If there isn't anything to do with the number 9 in the Storm Wardens, then it's most likely Angron given this new information. Mortarion and his legion were obsessed with the number 9.
Isn't Mortarion the leader of the Deathguard? If so, they are obsessed with the number 7. Papa Nurgle always bets on lucky number seven.
The number 9 is the obsession of Tzeentch worshippers.
Brother-Sergeant Cloten said:
CaptainLoken said:
Some of the successor chapters of the Blood Angels (I believe the Blood Drinkers) claim to have conquered the Red Thirst. I agree that the Blood Angels should probably be excluded, as the flaws appear to be present in all chapters, but suffered (or conquered) differently, not simply absent.
The Lamenters, they are allso a chapter that went trator during the Badab war. There is alot of doubt as to weather its really a "cure" . That does bring merit to the point that Space Marines are so invaluable that even chapters that have gone traitor have been forgiven.
Xalendar said:
If I remember correctly, the two missing primarchs / legions where here to let players create their own chapter, without referring to a specific primarch (GW wise). So, Storm Warden could come from here. I would be disappointed if they came from a traitor legion, as GW is reluctant to make loyalist traitor legion successor. Blood Raven could be an exception, as they are the video game iconic chapter and video games tend to have a wider public (so less attached to the fluff and more attached to the special or heroic aspect).
The Adeptus Terra is clear on this subject : There is not a single space marine chapter coming from the traitor legion. So, there isn't and it is heresy to even slightly doubt it. May HIS word be known by all !
All that video game fluff is approved by GW...
As two the Missing Primarchs... If you recall Horus goes back in time and sees the creation of the primarchs, One of them isn't missing Horus kills him while he's still in his pod so to speak.
Ah but that was a vision. I wouldn't put much credence in the idea of Horus actually cracking the pod. And he already knew the potential inside would be unrealised, a big hint that primarch was already lost by the time of the Heresy.
As for the Storm Warden primarch, I lean towards Khan still. Visions can easily be sent to mislead.
Decessor said:
Ah but that was a vision. I wouldn't put much credence in the idea of Horus actually cracking the pod. And he already knew the potential inside would be unrealised, a big hint that primarch was already lost by the time of the Heresy.
SPOILERS:
Subsequent background in the Heresy series - specifically, a couple of different scenes in The First Heretic - suggests not only that the two lost Primarchs survived, but had legions all their own, and that something happened/they did something that forced the Emperor to strike them from the records, an event that the other Primarchs swore never to speak of, and that the legions they left behind were folded into the Ultramarines.
On a similar note, the book also contains evidence to suggest that Horus' supposed vision of the laboratories might not have been a vision...
There's some more info here, on the lost legions... warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/%22Lost%22_Legions_%26_Primarchs
moepp said:
Aren´t only the chapter of the second founding so closely connected to their progenitor legion/chapter? I thought the later foundings only share the geneseed with one or the other legion, but are otherwise not specially bonded to their "parent legion". Ultramarines aside, who kinda seem to be everyones buddy.
In that sense, I wouldn´t discard the Dark Angels as possible progenitor legion.
moepp said:
Aren´t only the chapter of the second founding so closely connected to their progenitor legion/chapter? I thought the later foundings only share the geneseed with one or the other legion, but are otherwise not specially bonded to their "parent legion". Ultramarines aside, who kinda seem to be everyones buddy.
In that sense, I wouldn´t discard the Dark Angels as possible progenitor legion.
it differs from chapter to chapter, all the dark angel successors for example are part of "the unforgiven" an hunt fallen angels with their deathwing companies
and a vast majority of blood angels have the red thirst and black rage, while similar to many of their parent chapters rituals
the multitude of ultramarines chapters some pay a lot of homage to the smurfs, some don't, its a mixed bag
also just because a chapter doesn't have any known 2nd founding chapters doesn't mean that they never had any successors at all
remmeber that the salamnders, raven gaurd and iron hands were horribly depleted after the site massacre, theres no way they could have, at the time, given up any marines to form a new chapter, but that doesn't mean that after replenishing their troops that their tithe of gene seed wasn't put to use to create new chapters,
One thing I think you're all mostly forgetting?
There's no reason a successor Chapter founded early enough in the Chapter's history couldn't have maintained a stable seed. Remember, all the chapters originally had everything, it's just degradation over time. And if the mutation that killed one of the traits happened after the Storm Wardens had their records sealed then it's possible the original chapter doesn't know so they haven't gone to their successor for the means to stabilize their gene seed again.
And on the topic of the two missing chapters. When the Fist's Primarch is musing during "Mechanicus" about the coming of Horus, he briefly mentioned he could call up the two missing legions. Which earns him a pretty fierce rebuke. So they're still around, but whatever they're doing is important enough (Or their disgrace so complete) that even in the face of Horus it was unthinkable to summon them to the aid of the Emperor.
Was just rereading the Radical's Handbook for DH and found a mention of Sacris.
It's in the Bray Lexicon sidebar on page 97.
Possible Spoiler
It mentions that one of the Seven Devils of Calyx 'The Empty Hunger' dwells on 'Drusus shrine world/Sacris'.
Some kind of dead xeno warp entity that causes lethal psychic phenomena. I'm guessing the phenomena take the form of terrible storms that need warding...