Ok, so who do we think their Primarch is? Lets take a look at our possible candidates

Lemen Russ: Considering there hasn't been much done with the Space Wolf geneseed, and the Wardens don't have any animalistic features, I am going to say no.

Rogal Dorn: If it wasn't for the fact that they have the Sus-An Membrane and the Betcher's Gland, I could consider him as a possibility.

Sanguinius: They don't suffer the Black Rage, and blood doesn't factor much into their culture, so he is a no.

Vulkin: They don't have pitch black skin, and don't do anything special with fire. Again, going with no.

Corax: I recall that the fluff saying that the Raven Guard and their successors being rather pale. The Wardens make no mention of any special appearance. Plus, they aren't super stealthy. Going with no.

El'Johnson: Nothing in their Geneseed saying no, but the whole Fallen issue I think precludes them.

Ferrus Manus: I doubt it. They don't really have any special connection to machines like the Iron Hands

Khan: This is a possibility. Though they don't seem to make use of bikes like the White Scars, they share some symbolism, as well as being rather aggressive, even for Space Marines.

Guilliman: Too easy to say yes.

Any other thoughts?

My instincts were Khan when I first read the background. The lack of bikes doesn't matter as far as being a successor chapter. I would also say that FFG went out of their way to not duplicate Primarch lineage in the six core chapters.

Khan just seems to feel right.

Guilliman is a good bet, as for most Codex Chapters, however i do not really care. FFG made a good effort with Storm Wardens, their own Chapter Past is much more important, than the origin of their Primarch. For me the basic Chapters are more then characterful enough however, i would have prefered Salamanders, Iron Hands, Ravenguard, White Scars and Imperial Fists, even some successors like Flesh Tearers and Crimson Fists being in the book isntead of Storm Wardens without any second thought.

I would agree that the White Scars seem apt as the founding legion - there is a fondness of thinking of the marines tanks as steeds mentioned.

In addition the clannish medievalesque culture of highland scots on Sacris is not a million miles away from the mongol horde.

Rogal Dorn would be my second favourite with the extra glands being explainable as some kind of experiment.

To stir the pot I'm going to throw out Mortarion as an option. The wardens are tough as nails, resolved and stoic - very old school Death Guard. Perhaps the wardens are founded from Eisenstein loyalist geneseed.....

Aren´t only the chapter of the second founding so closely connected to their progenitor legion/chapter? I thought the later foundings only share the geneseed with one or the other legion, but are otherwise not specially bonded to their "parent legion". Ultramarines aside, who kinda seem to be everyones buddy.

In that sense, I wouldn´t discard the Dark Angels as possible progenitor legion.

They hail from Primarch Chuck Norris or maybe Primarch Bruce Campbell.

Gaurdian31 said:

Fixed this for you.

Nice, thank you.

As Emperor Bruce Campbell once said:

"Good... bad... I'm the guy with the Golden Throne."

Back on topic:

I think it would be Guilliman.

The one on one dueling aspect of the Storm Wardens has Imperial Fists written all over it. The armored column vehicle rush has Black Templars written all over it. But, as said, their gene-seed takes the matter in a different direction.

There has been some real speculation about the Blood Ravens coming from the Thousand Sons in the Horus Heresy books. The Blood Ravens do not know who their Primarch is either. It's possible that the same situation applies to the Storm Wardens.

IF a traitor gene-seed is the source of the Storm Warden's gene-seed, I'd have to say it's either surviving Death Guard like mentioned above or surviving Emperor's Children/Sons of Horus gene-seed.

Personally, I think they come from a stock of either the 2nd or 11th legions. It would certainly be a much more exciting theory, especially with the concept of the vault in main Deathwatch Storyline. Who knows whats in that vault

My honest opinion is Angron.

Sounds ridiculous, I know. but consider:

Angron, prior to becoming Khornate, was an honourable gladiator, seeking glory in the ring of honour. This action seems to have been inherited by the Storm Wardens.

They are hardy and ferocious in melee combat, favouring large blades to draw much blood.

As their Primarch's Curse levels up higher and higher, their inability to back down from any challenge is a mirror of Angron refusing the help of The Emperor on his own home planet.

Lastly, their histories are under Inquisitorial seal. There needs to be a REALLY good reason for this, which is what made me think of this pseudo-heresy to begin with.

My 2 pence.

Jim

Also their chapter colors are close to the pre-heresy World Eaters as well.

WGXH said:

Sounds like we have another case for the Crimson Fists.

Alex

My only issue with looking one of the traitor legions for their origins is that there is already a lot hinting at the Blood Ravens being from the Thousand Sons.

This could be overdone.

Gaurdian31 said:

Norris's geneseed is too potent for any human to survive being implanted with it.

OK gang, the Geneseed has very little to do with a Chapter's tradition or current doctrine. Except for some BIG exceptions, such as the Red Thirst or pale skin, Geneseed enables a Space Marine to do what they do, not determine what they think or believe.

For example, the Ultramarine's Geneseed comprise over 2/3's of the existing Chapters in the Imperium, but each Chapter is VERY different from their Geneseed founder.

Look at the Mortifactors, for example. They were a Second Founding Chapter based off of the Ultramarine's Geneseed. They are NOTHING like the Ultramarines. In fact, Uriel Ventris almost had trouble dealing with them, as they were so different from his Chapter.

So, just because a Chapter has a specific set of Geneseed, doesn't make them too related to their founding Chapter.

What is MOST important, are the FLAWS that a specific Geneseed imparts to a Chapter. All Blood Angel successor Chapters all suffer from the Red Thirst and Black Rage. The only successor Chapter that did not, the Lamenters, were damned, and almost destroyed. Because of this, many Blood Angels consider them cursed.

So, what do we know of the Storm Wardens? All of their Implants still work. That rules out the:

Blood Angels: Black Rage and the Red Thirst.

Imperial Fists: Missing Betcher's Gland and Sus-an Membrane.

Space Wolves: Enlarged canine teeth and Mark of the Wulfen.

Raven Guard: Missing Mucranoid and Betcher's Gland. Pale skin and dark eyes.

Salamanders: Onyx black skin and bright red eyes. (Malfunctioning Malenochrome gland)

The Dark Angels are pretty much ruled out, as ALL of their successor Chapters are known as the Unforgiven.

That means that there is a 66.67% chance that their Geneseed came from the Ultramarines, or a 33.67% chance that they have Iron Hands or White Scars Geneseed.

If you want, they could have one of the two "missing" Legion's Geneseed, but that is a pretty far stretch, as GW has NEVER done anything with them officially.

For what it's worth...

The Raven Guard are missing the Betcher's Gland also?

The Salamanders have no successor chapters according to the fluff, the Space Wolves only one. From sheer volume suggests Ultramarines, plus the fact they are close to Codex standards than the other remaining chapters.

WGXH said:

I am siding with Jim here. From the books we see that not all members of the original legions sided with their heretical brothers. They were then snuffed out, but some escaped. Yes few to be sure, but some none the less. I really like stories of redemption and think that it would be really cool for something like this.

Well... What I'm going to do for my game is this:

<NON-CANON by any stretch this is for my own game don't get angry!>

The Storm Wardens are from the First Founding. The last fragment of a Legion. At the time of the Crusade they lost their primarch and the rest of the Legion was incorporated into the Ultramarines. (Which has recently been hinted as having happened to the Lost Legions). Except for, somehow, what would become the Storm Wardens. The Nemesis incident revealed a long hidden/forgotten truth. All of those who found out and knew were placed in stasis and the Inquisitorial seal went over the whole thing/

This does riff off of the Blood Raven/Thousand Suns hook but since my players don't know any of that backround I'll just steal it.

CaptainLoken said:

Some of the successor chapters of the Blood Angels (I believe the Blood Drinkers) claim to have conquered the Red Thirst. I agree that the Blood Angels should probably be excluded, as the flaws appear to be present in all chapters, but suffered (or conquered) differently, not simply absent.

Imperial Fists. Man, their attitude would be perfect for Storm Wardens, but the Betcher's and Sus-an Membrane are what makes these guys non-starters. However, does this flaw go all the way back to the Second Founding? I think it does, as the Black Templars have the same problems.

Space Wolves. The teeth and Mark of the Wulfen aren't the problem. The problem is that the fluff explicitly says that the Space Wolves were divided only once, to form the ill-fated Wolf Brothers. Also, it is hinted at in Thousand Sons that the Space Wolves can recruit only from Fenris due to the genetic engineering that created the native Fenrisians ("There are no wolves on Fenris").

Raven Guard's missing Mucranoid and Betcher's Gland may or may not go back to the Second Founding. Not all of their successor Chapters have pale skin and dark eyes, so it is possible that this gene seed degradation happened after the chapters split.

Salamanders. I believe the background says that the Salamanders were never divided, but the coal black skin and glowing eyes, despite being due to a malfunctioning gland, could be tied to genetic conditions on their home world too. The Salamanders recruit from the natives of only one world, so perhaps their geneseed would behave differently with another human population. They DO tithe geneseed appropriately to the High Lords, so it is possible that another chapter was created without their knowledge.

Dark Angels. Again, their geneseed is pure, so while they could not be a known Successor chapter, the Imperium does have samples of their gene seed, correct? A chapter could be raised without disclosing the source of the geneseed, correct?

Ultramarines, Iron Hands, and White Scars all seem very possible, but I don't think you can rule out the Raven Guard, Salamanders, or Dark Angels 100% based on what is definitely known. Considering that the White Scars already have a successor chapter known as the Storm Lords, the Storm Wardens would not be too far fetched, would it?

My money says the Khan.

Is the IF/BT's implant problems a result of mutation, implantation procedure, or a mix of both, I thought I read that they do in fact "have" them, they just don't work. Perhaps the Storm Wardens just have a different technique?

Personally, I like the whole mystery to it. Doubt we're ever going to get a straight answer. Or perhaps this will become the big reveal at the end of one of the pre made campaigns they release.

The background does say that there is a reluctance to use Dark Angel geneseed. I can't remember where, but there was a chapter whose origins are explicitly stated to be unusual because it is believed (not confirmed) Dark Angel geneseed was used. Now, that doesn't rule them out, as they are only "reluctant" to do so, not that they have only ever done it once (There are only 3 "official" successors who are not confirmed Second Founding, and two of those have an unknown founding, so could even be Second Founding).

I am guessing Ultramarines, largely as they don't have much that links them to other chapters, and Ultramarines descendants make up the majority of Chapters. I could see White Scars though.

Now I have checked up on Lexicanum, one descendant Chapter for the White Scars is known as the "Storm Lords", and seeing as many related chapters share similar themed names I would have to say White Scars are looking increasingly likely. I don't put much by them sharing some combat styles though, as they are meant to have picked theirs up from their homeworld of Sacris.

In the adventure in the GM screen

Spoilers!

Hallucinations cause the Space Marines to have different nightmarish visions, the Storm Wardens visions relate to a demonic Primarch roaring at them to join him. This makes me lean towards Angron or Mortarion as the Storm Wardens Primarch.