frightening servo arms (2d10+14 pen 10 no other melle weapon is that strong)
LIES! The powerfist on a Str. 5 character (easily done with a bit of effort) does 2d10+15. On str. 6 it goes up to a staggering 2d10 + 18!
Techmarines and multiple attacks?
You are right that was an awfull lie
My point was just to show the already great strengh of the techmarines. Yes you could at some point do more damage than that, even the 2d10+16 for mastercraft servo harness.
SpawnoChaos said:
Since I allow a Dodge and Parry reaction in my game, I'm just going to make it so that the Servo Harness adds an additional attack that can use up another reaction.
So, it would go like this:
1st Reaction used to Attack with the Servo-Arm (this can use up either the Doge or Parry)
2nd Reaction used for other Servo-Arm, Plasma Cutter, or if Ranged the Fyceline Torch (this uses up the other remaining reaction)
3rd action is the Attack Action with the Omnissian Axe
This way the Techmarine can get 3 attacks with any combination of Mechadendrites that they choose. This makes them more flexible for the situation; while the Assault Marine gets more attacks, they are only going to be with their chosen weapon vs. the Techmarine having more options with less attacks.
I think it balances out in the end.
I'm also confused as to whether the Servo Harness adds an additional 2 Servo Arms, or if it replaces the original Servo Arm with the arms located on the Servo Harness.
The RAW states that the Servo Harness has at a minimum 2 Servo Arms, combi-tool, plasma cutter, and fyceline torch. I took that to mean since the Servo Harness is a separate piece of kit that you acquire, it would add 2 Servo Arms to the one you already have.
Then again, the model would disagree with this notion.
Yes, I'm quoting myself.
I tested this concept this weekend with the groups Techmarine and it worked beautifully. The Assault Marine WAY outpaced the Techmarine in attacks and damage, but the Techmarine had many more options at their disposal. It also was pretty cool to see some of the "Doc-Oc" action of the Techmarine.
Thebigjul said:
Right the whole point of this thread was about the fact that when Techmarines get a servo harness which adds an additional servo arm, a flamer, and a plasma pistol they dont get any additional attacks they still get their normal basic attacks and the ability to use only one of the weapons as a reaction.
maybe techmarine are short on melee attack, but get a flamer horde weapon) + plasma pistol (heavy armored NPC) and 2 frightening servo arms (2d10+14 pen 10 no other melle weapon is that strong) is already a nice gift, more or less 70 req points for free. More or less all you need to get as weapons for all encounters.
Buy some elite advance and look at what you got.
Tried to figure out how to make my Techmarine (Dark Angels) strong in defense and close-combat!
Choosing the 'Flesh is weak' and later add on with an extra Mechadendrite Arm I were thinking of making the character a walking 'human/machine tank' with good melee attacks to take out the bad guys in front and those bad-asses charging towards my Space Marine fellows.
I am not looking at 'maximizing' the attack output but want to make a difference in defense and offer some tough resistance in close-combat. I have also skills like security, trade - armourer and lore skills.
How would I plan the next couple of ranks in order to get some of the offence below?
i) one mounted ranged attack weapon (bolter/flamer)
ii) on top of that the general mechadendrite arm for close quarters;
iii) servo harness with (2 arms), the basic maintenance arm (combo flamer/plasma), and a smaller general utility arm
iv) finally he got two hands for an Axe and a Shield
With this kind of set-up how would you rule the number and type of attacks available, and what other talents/skills he needs to utilize them properly?
What other armour and defence skills/augmentations would you recommend?
I've read through the options and all the rules in the core rulebook and it seems to me that there is a different way to solve the amount of attacks "problem" of tech-marines.
In my opinion it would be; to "give" them the trait: Multiple-Arms when the Space Marine aquires Servo-Harness Integration, limiting the extra attacks to 1 untill the tech-marine gains a Servo-Harness.
This extra attack will be made with either his servo arm or a mechandrite weapon, but without using the reaction skill and not with a 2nd weapon in hand.
This leaves the tech-marine to gain back his reaction skill or gain a 3d attack by spending his reaction skill (if invested in the use mechandrite weapon skill and mechandrite weapon implant).
As soon as the Servo-Harness is gained, one extra attack is awarded the tech-marine for having more arms then before.
Explanation:
1. Servo-Harness Integration states:
The Techmarine has had his implanted systems integrated with a many-armed servo harness, allowing him to use its pincer-arms and weapon arrays
as if they were extra limbs of his body.
This would mean that the space marine now functions as though he had more then 2 arms.
2. Traits:
They may be gained through other means later
in life, but they are almost never gained through choice.
As indicated in Chapter I: Character Creation, player characters acquire certain traits as a result of their origins, experience
or other factors that make them who and what they are
.
I'd say that from the moment the tech-marine has Servo-Harness Integration, he is a not what he was, but is changed as he integrates his servo harness into his being.
3. Multiple Arms:
This creature has more than one pair of arms. It increases its Toughness Characteristic by +10 and gains a +10 bonus on Strength Tests involving movement such as Climb and Swim.
Finally, the creature may use the Multiple Attack action to gain two attacks on its turn.
If the creature also has the Swift or Lightening Attack Talent, this trait increases the number of
attacks they make with a multiple attack action by +1.
The tech-marine has gained the feeling of extra arms from the servo-harness integration, the trait states that he'd gain 2 attacks, but when interpreting most of the rules that are describing anything gained, it usually means: replaced with.
So, instead of having 1 attack and gaining 2 to have a total of 3, I'd say replace 1 attack with 2. As the multiple arms come from his one servo-arm and possible mechandrites, 1 extra attack would be more balanced. If that attack is done with his servo arm, he can't use the reaction skill to attack with
that arm
again. Therefor if done with a mechandrite weapon, he would be able to attack with the servo-arm as a reaction as that arm hasn't been used that round yet.
4. Astartes Servo-Harness:
The ingenious machine spirit of a servo-harness is capable
of far more sublime communion with its master than a simple
servo-arm.
A character with Talents that make him capable
of taking the Multiple Attacks Action may use any weapon
(or equivalent) on his servo-harness for any of the attacks he
would normally be allowed, subject to all normal limitations
including weapon Class. Additionally, the Techmarine may
use his Reaction to make a single shot or strike with any one
weapon on the harness.
Exceptional servo-harnesses enhance
the servo-arms to Exceptional as discussed above, and add a
+5 to all Skill, WS, and BS Tests made using the components
of the harness. The Servo-Harness Integration Talent is
required in order to use a Servo-Harness.
As the Servo-Harness integrates multiple arms with the tech-marine, the amount of "limbs" that are available increase, therefor the amount of attacks should increase as well, this would be in line with the trait multiple arms.
============================
There are no rules violated with this explenation, although you could argue about the interpretation of the multiple arms trait and the amount of attacks a tech-marine should receive.
=========================
I am still figuring out how you could use Machinator Array
Here are my views on that however:
It seems to me that you could integrate any
one
weapon you could normally wield into your servo harness or if not availble, onto your servo arm. If integrated onto your harness, it would count as an mechandrite weapon and the appropriate talent would be required to be able to use it as a weapon. For instance:
Breaching Augur could be mounted on the harness, and be used as a tool, unless use mechandrite weapon skill is trained, then it's available as weapon as well.
=========================
Would love some feedback on my views.
This very question came up in our campaign recently and while reviewing the latest errata I came across a line that added both two weapon wielding talents to the general advances table at rank 7 for 800xp each. The writer's intended all marines to have access to those talents and simply forgot to include the relevant entries in the core book.
https://www.facebook.com/download/756767604393526/Deathwatch%20Living%20Errata%20v1-1.pdf
the entry is on page two directly under the heading: general space marine advances.
With the Multiple Arms Trait and multiple Attack the Techmarine and the Multiple Attack gains 2 Attacks.
Does that mean he gains two Melee-Attacks in one turn or 2 Attacks equal to 2 Actions ?