if it comes to serfs it depends on the chapter its hard to generalise. I can bet that Iron Hands for example love theirs.

if comes to automation level on Astartes ships 60k crew mean that ship is very automated, by RT Lunar class Cruiser need 95k crew and its only small 5km spaceship. Battle barges are by size compared to true battleships, witch may have crew of around 180-250k.

On number of Serfs and Dark Angels chapter...

insane 5 Battle Barges, 10 strike crusiers, 8 rapid strike vessels and ofc THE Rock. that chapter have probably biggest number of serfs amongst other chapters.

boruta666 said:

I wouldn't use any crew or ship statistics from Battlefleet Gothic, as it never overly tied in with any written fiction or other systems, plus is about decade old now. If you use the figures in the Rogue Trader books, an Astartes Strike Cruiser is going to have a crew somewhere between a light and standard sized cruiser, minus a few % due to more advanced systems and automation.

i have used RT ship rules to determine ship crew, not BFG. RT = Rogue Trader by FFG

bmaynard said:

I second Lexicanum, awesome source for background.

I have read a lot of black Library books and I can tell you this. Most chapters do hover around 1k, but that is they draw from reserve companies for the man power to dive vehicles. However this is newer fluff. You can not, and I mean you really Can't rely on any fluff older than the current edition because GW has a tendency to rewrite history and make it seem older information never existed.

That being said... All chapters do rely on a mixture of servants. Be they straight up slaves, indentured, serfs (made of loyal followers, or failed initiates who somehow still lived after failing), and house carls (house carls for all intents and purposes are like squires and personal attendants to certain marines). House carls are explained in Flight of the Eisentein. One such house carl was an initate who failed but did not die from the initial implantation and trial process used to make scouts for the Death Guard. Although most chapters or legions at that point said house carls are a dying breed. This of course is before the imperium fell back into dark ages and superstition. The book also goes on to explain from the days of the Crusade and Heresy that most ships be they Marine or Navy use mortals to crew the bulk of the ship with Marines taking command and barking orders. Also plenty of proof that Marines often walk on board any ship and start taking over command from the Captain.

Space marine fleets can not fully be crewed by marines, and often strike cruisers have no more that 20 to 40 marines usually as even normal marines only ship small groups or only company strengths across the stars. Only in absolute dire circumstances do marines gather at chapter strength in an engagement. These rare occurances aside from heresy / crusade have been the defense of Mcragge, The defense of whatever shrine world against the Eldar (again by Ultramarines), and Battles such as for Reach.

Anywho back on topic, Deathwatch is indeed very limitted in personal staffing per the marines and by fleet standards as everything is variable. Although it safe to assume they have a few ships to spare and vehicles for each sector. So Erioch probably has something like only one to two rhions period for the whole sector and maybe one predator or land raider etc.. This means these vehicles are highly prized, decorated, and have an NPC crew you can have fun with as a DM. As for ships inquistion would call upon Deathwatch, and only if situations are extreme. Since The marines are stretched thin as is only a single squad or two will usually be deployed, since a whole cruiser can not be dedicated to the, it may result in transport by an imperial navy vessel, RT, or civillian.

In addition, for story purposes (some one sayings psst master) A marine depending on chapter may actually be allowed to bring their personal housecarl only if they had one at all. This can open up for intrigue, especially of mistrustful DA players trying to learn about their fellow Brothers fearing they may be fallen or that they find him suspicious. The DW fortress will have some menials that serve all the chapters and will attend to polishing armor etc...

Forgive me if this is a big ramble or rant but there is so much info regarding how each chapter is different and it varies from each author's point of view or the story they wish to tell.

Mercs? Hell no.

Most of the menail stuff done in space marien chapters are done by sevitors, serfs/ slaves, failed initates ect. The people that stack the bullets, load mags, handel supply and other logistics. The 1000 marien thing is actual fighting strengh from what I under stand. In the current 40K codex, the armory has something like 12 land raider, 12 preadator tanks, ect. It would make sense that the operators for that equipment, would be attached to the armory, tech mariens in training maybe? Quite possible the crews do most of the mundane maintenace task, such as change track, lube, change out simple parts, the crap that a tech marien should not be bothered with. ( We train 18 year old morons to do simple maintence task multi million dollars tanks) Plus you figure 1 space marien to captain each strike crusier, or more depending if all the officers on ship are Space mariens.

Terminus_Est said:

Rynn's World.

Terminus_Est said:

Related Oblivion's Edge Spoiler:

At the end of that mission the battle for Avalos concludes by a Deathwatch Battle Barge arriving. It seems as if the Deathwatch are in any instance exceptionally well-equipped. Any one care to guess how many Marines man that thing?

Anyway, as a side note, I plan to let it be commanded by Watch Captain Servais (see GM Kit) - not only will it introduce the NPC (their new Watch Captain) but I plan to use him to built a little suspense. After completing the hit-and-run on the hive ship the Emperor's Wrath will pick up a blip in the warp, sth the size of a large battleship (or hive ship) or a small fleet. Visual scans confirm nothing. Captain Cobb will take no risks and opt to leave battle, Hadros will make some suggestions how the kill-team could possibly land a final blow, etc. In the midst of their preparations, the ship will their ancient ECM shielding and start to lay into the kraken escort and finally the hiveship, relief and cheers and much hugging among the crew are bound to ensue. "Lord-Captain, Lord-Captain, we now have a visual!" <leaps up> "On screen!" *gasp* <dark shape... with silver =I= and skull cuts smoothly across the screen> "Sir, it's the Final Retribution!" Everyone: "Hooray!"

Just to avoid the 'Cavalry comes, mops everything up, takes you home' standard stuff. Now back to topic.

Alex