When thinking about possible character ideas for deathwatch, I came upon the concept of a sniper. Deathwatch are covert forces, often operating behind enemy lines and engaging in assassinations, so having someone with the team who's a little more dedicated to sniping than "yeah, I did that once when I was a scout marine..." would make sense (also, guys in power armour with powerful single-shot precision weapons are

Firstly, what chapter is appropriate? High BS will be paramount, so Dark Angels and Ultramarines would be fitting as Black Templars, Storm Wardens, Blood Angels and Space Wolves all have a pronounced tendency towards melee. Of those two, the Dark Angel chapter solo ability seems a little more useful as the character likely will spend some time away from the team.

Secondly, what specialisation would fit? The two abilities of BS and AG are somewhat antithetical for deciding it - the only one with cheap AG is the assault marine, but he's pretty much useless when it comes to better shooting while the Devastator has expensive AG. The Devastator is further focused on heavy weapons, though presumably, one could talk to ones GM to let the Immovable Warrior apply to accurate basic weapons. His ranged weapon talents are pretty good already. The third option would obviously be to go for tactical - when you don't know what else a character should be, go for Tac. As the second weapon with Accurate is a boltgun, bolter mastery sounds fine too.

Thirdly, after mulling the whole thing over a few times... what would you say are the odds we'll be seeing a Deathwatch Scout career any time soon? It really seems there's no stealthy character right now. The only one with cheap agility also gets the rather stealth-defeating feature of the humungous Jump Pack.

Cifer said:

Since everyone can get Move Silent, Concealment, etc, everyone "can" be a stealthy character.

Also, since when would an Assault Marine have to take the Jump Pack with him? I could easily see an Assault Marine that didn't wear a jump-pack and instead wore Scout Armour (especially if they were Space Wolves, because of their veteran scouts seeming to be good assault troops) would make a great scout.

Otherwise, a Tactical Marine in Scout Armour would make a good Scout, since the costs for the characteristics needed are fairly average.

I'm actually playing a sniper character in our DW Campaign currently.

And I'm angling towards becoming a scout as opposed to coming from that background. Space Wolf Tactical Marine is where I built from. Wolf Senses and the chapter advances for tracking are a great way towards making a good forward scout. I also spend a good bit of time ahead of and away from the main party, so I always get my bolter mastery with my stalker. Combine that with the 1/2 action for aim, the +10 for accurate, a red dot laser sight and another +10 for short range if within 100m and you've got a +50 to hit with every shot without surprise. And 5d10 (keeping 4 - Tearing) + 11 (wpn + bolter mastery + mighty shot + Master crafted) is no joke for damage potential from 1 shot.

I doubt they'll come up with a scout class any time soon as most marines (everyone that isn't a space wolf) pass that point before they'd ever be thought of as Deathwatch material.

However, it isn't that hard to run as one. Switching from Power Armor to Scout armor alone gets rid of the negatives to your stealthiness from size. Pick up a chameleoline cloak if you have access to whichever book the rules for it are in and you're hiding in style.

@Millandson

Since everyone can get Move Silent, Concealment, etc, everyone "can" be a stealthy character.

Ok, make that dedicated stealthy character.

That's one of the things I like about the generic Marine advancement scheme - it allows everyone to branch out a little even if something is not directly tied to their specific role. However, I'm sure you'd agree there's a certain difference between using a generic career and pushing it into a certain direction and taking a career that was meant to do that - after all, you could also strap a heavy weapon onto a tactical marine and rely on his ranged talents and the general ones to replace the Devastator.

Also, since when would an Assault Marine have to take the Jump Pack with him? I could easily see an Assault Marine that didn't wear a jump-pack and instead wore Scout Armour (especially if they were Space Wolves, because of their veteran scouts seeming to be good assault troops) would make a great scout.

They wouldn't have to, but large parts of the career seem somewhat focused on it.

@bmaynard

I doubt they'll come up with a scout class any time soon as most marines (everyone that isn't a space wolf) pass that point before they'd ever be thought of as Deathwatch material.

Almost everyone in Deathwatch has already passed every stage of the normal Marine tour (scout-devastator-assault-tactical). It's only when the characters get seconded to the Watch that they take up the specialization they were most comfortable with - and there's no reason why this couldn't be their scout job.

Howdy!

Any speciality that can take BS, AG, Per, and Int advances can go the route of the sniper.

Certain chapters and specialities are better.

Just have fun and flesh out a theme.

I was all set to draw up my Techmarine Sniper. I figured that since he would primarily be a "support" character, that he might find a good use in being a sniper. I was thinking that since he's already a techie geek, that it's not much of a stretch to imagine him carting around specialized ammo and using his servo-arm to anchor him to high visibility perches.

I checked out the sniper rifle, but was underwhelmed with the overall damage output. But the Stalker pattern bolter was looking really interesting... until I noticed that it has a Reknown requirement. So I'll have to do some levelling with my Techmarine first, but once I do, I can't wait to start modding my Stalker gun and taking specialized ammo for the job.

Do any of the specialities get any gear that would help the sniper ?

I note that the tactical marines in final sanction were the only ones with special ammo. If they have something to encourage them to use more special ammo that other specialities, it could be helpful for a sniper.

Howdy!

Don't forget about the missle launcher. Its an amazing sniper weapon. Plus 0 reknown requirement, and only 10 rec. to aquire.

Frag(2d10 pen4 blast8 dev1), Krak(4d10+6 pen 10 blast1), and Incendary(1d10+3 blast5 burn) missiles make it very flexible. 250m Range means 1k shots.

I have a Blood Angel tactical marine that I intend to develop into a sniper. They get the talents later on that will allow precision sniping ànd tehy start with a bolter with fire selectro.

So I took SIgnature Wargear and kitted out the bolter with a Silencer, telescopic sight and dipole maglogs, with the remaining points I took Stalker ammo so every mission I start with; standard ammo; clip of stalkers and another clip of special ammo of choice (thanks to the tac marine ability).

Oh and my power armour has the 'Fury' history, resulting ion agility and initiative boni.

Voilà, the roadmap has been set.

*Ahem* Missile snipers? Not exactly stealthy mate...

Meph said:

It is if none of your foes survive long enough to sound the alarm.

Bilateralrope said:

As long as there fiends are all either a) in the blast zone, or b) deaf.

Anyways back on topic,

We start our Deathwtch campaign on sunday, with me playing for a change. I'm planning on going Space Wolf Tac Marine but playing it as a Wolf Scout. I'm only ever planning on using my power armour when the mission demands it (boarding actions, dangerous atmosphere, etc) as scout armour is 0 req.

I'll let you know how successfully the Tac career manages the forward scout role.

Surak

So I took SIgnature Wargear and kitted out the bolter with a Silencer, telescopic sight and dipole maglogs, with the remaining points I took Stalker ammo so every mission I start with; standard ammo; clip of stalkers and another clip of special ammo of choice (thanks to the tac marine ability).

Wow, I might have to do a bit more reading! I didn't know about all those goodies!

Bilateralrope said:

Bilateralrope said:

Or the shriek of the flying missile, or the hilariously loud sound of the explosion, or the sound of the launch, or the contrail of the flightpath of the missile... All sense of logic tells me that sniping with a missile is as effective as cutting a steak with a hammer...

You can't but a Silencer on a Boltgun.

Best Sniper Rifle: Stalker Boltgun, Stalker Shells, Scope

Meph said:

That just means that we have more targets that need silencing.

Stalker Boltgun + Kraken Round works wonders too, Range 300m, Pen 8, -30 to detect

Meph said:

If you look at the rules, you can't take Specialist Ammunition as Signature Wargear.

Howdy!

Brother Maynard has been running one in my game for a while.

Here are some tips:

Bolter with telescopic sight until you get "respected" then Stalker boltgun with red dot sight

Stalker rounds are great in the bolt gun especially on full auto after an aim action

Fury like lightning on power armour

Buy a chamoline cloak from DH use the conversion chart

stummers- instant silence

Tactics- recon/ stealth to get team skill synergy

totum of the sun wolf +3 awareness

auspex +20 awareness

Astartes harness- go vertical

mini mines to buy time and space

Dipole mag lock on a "balanced" melee weapon to parry the sneaky genestealers

Be alone but within support range of team and charge/run range of the assault marine

Frag and incediary grenades to cause mayhem

COVER AND CONCEALMENT!

Thanks

MILLANDSON said:

Aww shocks! That means that 20req points for kitting out a standard weapon is always way too much... as the weapon modding options are extremely limited....

major shultz said:

Sorry, but you can't combine AIM and FULL AUTO, so Stalker rounds only help with +20 To Hit and -30 to hear it. The Auspex requires a Tech-use test to use, which most newbies don't bother to get (at least until they come across a door they can't blow up and they don't have a Techmarine...). You'd be a bit screwed if all this isn't Signiture Wargear, as the GM can quite happily not let you have it, which makes a nasty GM like me happy

Sorry, but you can't combine AIM and FULL AUTO

And the reason for this would be...?

You'd be a bit screwed if all this isn't Signiture Wargear, as the GM can quite happily not let you have it, which makes a nasty GM like me happy

Yeah, not letting the sniper get optimum sniping gear makes perfect sense for a Deathwatch Armourer and will certainly make the mission run much more smoothly. I've got to agree there.

foxfax said:

You're quite right that a character concept can be invalidated if a GM doesn't let them have access to entirely reasonable quantities of bog-standard gear that they should explicitly be able to get. Assault Marines are also bad if they can't get any melee weapons beyond a chainsword and their Jump Packs have chronic "mechanical issues." That doesn't tell anybody anything that they don't already know- a GM can more or less negate, fundamentally alter or destroy your character at a whim since they control the general reality of a game. If this is done in an interesting manner and spirit of cooperation it can be interesting. If it's done routinely because the GM is bad/adversarial/"nasty" it's generally time to find a new group.

I was eyeing up Tactical Marine for a "sniper" style character. They get both Target Selection and Eye of Vengeance in their advance scheme. They can also grab nifty bonuses to shooting bolt weapons in solo mode (not inappropriate for a sniper).

Having a stock of specialist ammunition doesn't hurt either.

foxfax said:

Sorry, but you can combine AIM and FULL AUTO.

Check the rules before you tell people they can't do stuff when the rules say they can

MILLANDSON said:

Fair enough but in my game you can't.

Alex