Hey guys:)

Ive been having trouble keeping up with my party in terms of damage output in fights. one is a slayer and he just seems to kill everything. Now I dont know the rules and have no idea how the system works, which is probably why my last commoner/type/thing character was bad in general. I am allowed by my gm to create a new char, but I dont know what I should do...

I have a number of concepts, but I have no idea if it is even possible to create characters like that and if they will be any good. Could you guys help me with that?

Here are some of the concepts I thought of:
Warrior/wizard: guy wielding a sword lit on fire by magic, belching cones of fire from his mouth, and carrying around some armor to keep him alive while dealing (magical AOE) damage at close range or melee.

Witchhunter/pistol duellist: a guy carrying around a belt full of pistols and shooting the hell out of all things evil. multiple shots / big guns are awesome

Warrior priest: like the ones from sigmar, Hammertime!

Could any of these concepts work and be effective in combat?

Thanks!

Why do you need to keep up with the Troll Slayer in combat? That's a character usually built exclusively around fighting.

Unless you have a bunch of 2's in physical stats, you should be able to get by in a fight. You won't at all be the main guy, but you aren't as useless as in many other games.

Doesn't your party have a different niche for you to fill?

Crucial things to make a "proper" min-maxed character of any kind:

1. Make sure you have AT LEAST a 3 in each of your physical stats (so you don't have to buy dodge/parry/block later).

2. Don't buy talents at the beginning. Max out your SKILLS (because they'll never be cheaper than at creation and you get a bunch FREE). You also get a free Ability card at the beginning (0) points. Make sure you consider your stance. Some cards are simply retarded when it comes to a particular stance (and shouldn't even be used..leaving me questioning why there even is an "opposite" side to some).

3. Use a halberd

jh

Doc, the Weasel said:

I didn't really think of that, to be honest The game has focussed on combat until now, so I thought it was a really big part of the game, like D&D usually is.

Im probably a big big noob, but I have no idea what stances are :s What makes some of them overpowered? (or what makes others weak?)

Thanks for your general tips guys! maybe I shouldnt try to compete with a slayer

Instead of trying to build a character that competes with the Trollslayer at combat, build a character you are happy with and then ask the GM to include more stuff that would play to your characters strengths. The trollslayer is probably as good as it gets when it comes to combat, but there's a lot mroe to WFRP than just plain fighting.

For example, here's our group and what we do:

Thug: Best fighter. Doesn't do well when trying to reason or charm people, but can use Intimidate well.

Apprentice Wizard: Knows arcane stuff, good at figuring out prolbems through research. Can shoot fire.

Smuggler: Can survive a fight, but tries to avoid them (or hide behind the thug). The social face of the group who uses charm and guile to get what he wants instead of brute force.

Think about what roles your other player characters fill and think if there's something they DON'T do that you could do.

And if your GM only keeps throwing combat at you and nothing else, he might want to think about other ways to write adventures. Unless he made clear at the start that this would be a combat-heavy game.

The game is focused on combat as long as the GM (and players) want it to be. But if that is the kind of playing that your group likes, there is little point in you trying to create characters that are good in other niches (like talking, sneaking or knowledge). One thing you should know is that WFRP is nothing like DnD4e when it comes to player balance, the careers are very specialized and some careers are very weak at combat.

Just a piece of general advice (don't take it the wrong way, it may be that you're having fun as it is and don't need my ideas), I think you'll find that roleplaying will be a lot more fun if you quit worrying about things like "who does the most damage" or "who get the killing blow" (we have MMORPGs for that ). Try to focus on your character, what the character feels in combat, and try to think up cool moves (Perform a stunt is a really nice action) and describe what your character does. Personally I find it way more satisfying when playing a Commoner (or something similar) that manages to just kill one beastman, while being really scared, desperate and out-of-his-league, than playing a Troll slayer doing a gazillion wounds and killing his fifth. Of course, people are different, you may not at all feel the same way.

It sounds to me that your group is playing more of a standard dungeon crawl, where playing a combat-weak character is not so fun, so in that case I'm all for making a combat-optimised character. Do you want to create a character that works well together with the rest of the group or are you more interested in creating a character that can output a lot of damage? What other characters are in your group?

For example, if you don't have any defensively minded characters, maybe you should make one (soldier, mercenary, thug, ironbreaker) and get some actions that can help protect both you and your allies, Troll slayers really benefit from someone covering their back through the use of actions like Improved guarded position. With a S/T of 4/4 you can be both good at defense and also output some damage.

Some of your ideas could work, some comments:

Wizard/warrior: Hmm, you can't really make that work in Warhammer, sounds more like a DnD thing to me. What you can do is a Bright wizard and get the spell that let's you create a sword of fire. That works but, similar to the Troll slayer, will be quite easy to kill. In case you go this route, I suggest getting a Toughness of 4 (Strength can be kept at 3, since the spell can give extra) and buying Weapon skill at the first possible chance as a non-career skill. Make sure to get a Quarterstaff to use as a defensive weapon.

Witchhunter, pistol freak works fine, but is only available at higher rank. Using pistols is also very costly, you would have to get some extra money from your GM to get them from start.

Warrior priest of Sigmar is a great concept and works fine, see this thread for a discussion about building such a character:
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp?efid=149&efcid=3&efidt=376195&efpag=0#376789

Thanks for all your advice guys! You are right! We play a lot of RPG's, but sometimes people irritate me with their "look im the best @something" characters. Especially if they talk about that all the time, while trying to create opportunities for themselves to shine.

I dont think we're dungeon crawling, but i think we will be a bit more combat heavy than say a vampire setting (White wolf WOD). Im not sure what the other characters are, but I think a mage, ranger, and something else.

I kinda let go of the pistol dude, he was more of a way to shine than to play a fun character. The mage also, because it doesnt really fit the warhammer fluff, and you guys made me remember that its more about the fun of the game than the "look at me im the best" factor.

I do still like the priest of sigmar hammer dude.

I wondered however, is it possible to get a pet companion? aka can I make a while lion like the ones from Warhammer online? because their concept art looks awesome! (yeah, I usually base my characters on cool pictures that have a great atmosphere in them I know im superficial ^^) but they seem to have an awesome feel to them, and probably very useful in a group (armored, pet who can be annoying, some damage with a weapon, etc) if I take some hindering skills that impair movement or something
I dont have the book tho, and my friend who does is out of town on business, so im not even sure this is possible

If it is remotely possible to make a white lion, i think im going to go that direction. that way, i'll have a character that is decent in combat with some utility, and play a fun character, that wasnt built to just kick ass, but to be fun

Thanks!

How a bout a viscious little dog? Is that something?

White Lions are not really possible yet, but ratcatchers are. Not the best in combat but they can teach their pet dogs some neat tricks that can hinder your enemies or keep you alive.

its in the first expansion (forget its name), check it out.

-L

Lucas Adorn said:

What are ratcatchers good at, besides catching rats? That means I cant just pretend my rat catcher is a white lion right? because of the suckness in combat?
Thanks for the advice tho, I hope my GM has that set

Hey,

A number of the others made great suggestions, but I figured I'd jump in.

Milkshaker said:

There is a way to do this, but its a rather finicky build. A bright order wizard get the spell 'Flaming sword of Rhuin' and 'Shielding Winds of Aqshi'. In essence this lets you melee sword/staff (or possibly sword/shield), while soaking with your magic. Its tricky to build right, but can be a fun character to play. Not so much on the firebreathing. Oh, and with the errata - Bright Order mages I believe have the biggest punch possible. It might take them a few turns of channeling to whip out a massive boosted pyro, but they definitely have the biggest punch in the game that I'm aware of.

Milkshaker said:

Grunt nailed it. This is doable, but impossible off the bat (witch hunter is an advanced class) and very expensive, since a pistol is worth 5 horses, and the shot isn't cheap either.

Milkshaker said:

I actually built my priest from the advice in the linked thread (I was the one that started the thread) and he's proven very very fun. Also, I am the heavy hitter in the group, but also get a fair bit of social interaction, and some nice party buffs.

As a point of note, our Gambler is a social master. He uses agility (with nimble strike) in combat, but his forte is his many party buffs and social cards. He can stop an enemy in his tracks with a Winning Smile, or use Dirty Tricks to provide the rest of us with a free white die on attacks. He's combat capable (he doesn't just fall over dead) but has very few combat-specific actions, he just makes the rest of us look **** good. When we're up for social situations though he really shines. He uses Twisting Words and various reputations to help us investigate, and corners suspects for information etc. In other words, his character doesn't hit hard, but instead makes ALL of us hit harder, and he's the heavy hitter when it comes to non-combat situations (it helps that he's noble and somewhat wealthy with connections).

I mention this because if you have a troll-slayer, mage and a ranger, I'm not sure they need another combat mook or heavy hitter. A priest of shallaya (healer) might be interesting, or a social master - which would have the advantage both of making you useful, and not forcing you to compete in a well covered field.

A rat catcher is definitely a cool character to play, but you should get into the mindset. Dirty, Poor, and catch rats for a living. And that's just your dog. Seriously, there's a fair bit of fun to be had when you can't smash something. Just because your clothes smell, your teeth are rotting, and you can't save enough brass to buy new traps doesn't mean you're not useful. People like that are overlooked, and know of places others have forgotten. From what I've seen of the pet cards and trick talents - they're fairly flexible in combat as well (although definitely not as heavy hitting). I don't know about white lions (albeit, I don't have the volumes of info some of the others on the forums do) in the reikland, but you might be able to convince your GM to let you have one (although not sure its much for catching rats. Probably eats more each day than you can catch). Alternately you can look into Amber mages and just turn into one. Great thing about this game - possibilities are endless.

Just remembered.

As an alternative to having your own pet lion you can be a wizard of the Amber order and turn yourself into a wolf/Bear/raven. Quite handy and bears are powerful fighters. its not lions, but pretty close.

That mage is in the winds of magic expansion. pretty cool stuff.

-L

Oh that all sounds cool! Ratcatcher is out of the question though, because we dont own that set sadly (I checked with my friend).

So im nearing closer and closer to warrior priest. How do spells work? can you pick or do you get what fate chooses for you? (and are there offensive spells as a warrior priest to buff yourself with?)

Shinma, could you tell me how exactly you buid your warrior priest at the start of your campain? I dont understand half of the game yet, so its quite difficult to make something out of it.

That wizard of the amber order also sounds very nice! Is it possible to start as one at the start of a campain? (assuming we start at the lowest level)

thanks guys, youve been a big help so far!

There was a discussion on building a Priest of Sigmar some time ago (and it was created by Shinma actually ):

www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp

It may help You with some ideas

Check out the linked thread, there's some gold advice there. Ultimately your problem is that you have to learn the rules a bit. I can list my build but I'm not sure it'll make much sense without knowing the why's.

I ended up with a 4,3,4,4,2,3 with int as my dump stat (which I'm raising to 3 with non-career advances). Picked up one point of wealth to afford robes and a greathammer (had to sell my crossbow). 2 points in the skills category. One extra action (picked sigmar's hammer and a buff).

Hope that helps.

shinma said:

Yeah you're (and the rest too ofc!) are helping me a lot!

Yeah I read the thread earlier (its the same as you linked yourself, if I saw that correctly). I asked for your build so that I could determine what the discussion was about, hoping to understand it better by placing it all in a bit of context. I am usually better at that when I have an example to work with. This way I can read why people made certain decisions, and that way draw my own conclusions

Was your warrior priest a heavy hitter (as you called it ) from the start? And what spells should I be looking for from either the core set or winds of magic to support that heavy hitter / tank role?

<3 you guys!