I've made some characters for a one shot and when I started calculating Incumberance I found out it is nigh impossible to encumber a marine...

Example:
Symeon, a Blood Angel Assault Marine has a strenght of 40 and a toughness of 40 (SB 8 +2 from power armour + TB 8 = 18)
When I look up 18 on tabel 7-7 (Lifting, Pushing, carrying) I noticed he could carry 1350kg before he would gain any penalties!

So looking at his Equipment:
Chainsword 10kg
Power Armour 180kg (Doesn't Count)
Bolt Pistol + Ammo 8kg
Jump Pack 50kg
Combat Knife 2kg
6 Grenades 5 Kg

Total: 75kg

One of the Characters I made, a Storm Warden has strength and toughness of 50, The Power Armour History which grants an additional +10 Strength (+30 Total) so he reaches a SB+TB of 23, That is of the Chart, but if I extrapolate its:
Carry: 3600kg
Lift: 7200kg
Push: 14400kg

Fortunately they als included a list of what was reasonable to carry, so now how to figure out how to requisition a giant sturdy backpack so we can carry more stuff...

Fortunately they als included a list of what was reasonable to carry, so now how to figure out how to requisition a giant sturdy backpack so we can carry more stuff...

Presumably, the regular backpack would be as big as possible while not encumbering the Marine by pure volume. Getting a bigger one that really lets the Marine use his entire carrying strength would probably reduce his agility.

But can the Apothecary actually carry a wounded buddy (presumably still wearing power armour) on his back?

Assuming his carrying strength is sufficient and he's willing to accept a certain penalty for agility-based tests related to maneuvering in cramped corners - why not?

Probably two of them, including their gear...

Then you can combine two Assault Marines for Mecha-Shiva!!!

What about when the marine is on a high gravity world iin scout armour ?

Looking at the RT carry chart, that could hurt. Especially if heavy weapon weights are scaled up like the rest of the weapons.

At last nights game it was suggested that the devastator should use his magnetic boots to 'surf' on the assault marines back effectively giving him a heavy bolter turret. Needless to say I didn't allow it but under the encumberance rules it is technically possible.

Well, good that you stopped that marine-surfing madness because y'know, technically World Peace and controlled climate change are also possible...

Santiago said:

Why?

Wargamer said:

Encumberance isn't the issue with such a maneuver. Flight physics is the issue. Such an idiotic maneuver would cause the pair to become massively top-heavy and both controlled flight and proper landing would become impossible. The amount of force that a jump pack exerts is enough to turn a marine into a blood smear if things go wrong, and they would 100% without a doubt go wrong if the idiots tried that.

Make that two blood smears...

Yeah, well we tend to play by the 'Rule of Cool' in our group and the guys weren't really serious when they suggested it but it still highlights the encumbrance problem.

The real limiting factor in SM carrying capacity isn't, as I see it, a matter strength but of space. Those suits of power armour are pretty form fitting and marines don't wear webbing apart from the odd belt pouch or pistol holster. My ruling for the game I run is that a marine can carry the following:

1 Melee weapon or 2 handed ranged weapon

10 basic or pistol reloads (heavy weapon reload count as 2 basic or pistol)

6 assorted grenades

1 combat knife and 1 pistol

other assorted kit (multi tools etc)

this seems reasonable as the most a marine can cram into his armour in one go without needing some sort of external backpack or knapsack (like the backpack ammo supply).

Wargamer said:

This isn't the first RPG with characters that are strong enough to carry absurd amounts of weight. The answer has always been pretty much exactly what you are describing: the use of volume as well as mass, and the use of common sense. If, for instance, a player thinks they can requisition a second ammo backpack for their heavy bolter because hauling it around would technically not exceed their carrying weight, they're being foolish and should be told so.

The Lift/carry rules section appears to be completely identical to the previous games (including the line about backpacks or satchels... Space Marines generally don't lug around bags!)... as mentioned, given that it's easy for Space Marines to start off the chart at rank 1, this does get messy. If the weights progressed according to a consistent function, we could derive the higher ones, but the curve takes a huge upward turn at higher levels.

It's hard to say precisely what this means: as an example, the Techmarine's Servo-Arm (SB 14: 75x2) is described as strong enough to lift up one side of a Rhino to change a track. My Storm Wardens Librarian is about as strong (SB 13: 51x2+30) ... at least he isn't strong enough to lift a Rhino outright (according to Imperial Armour, they weigh 30 tons).

This gets really obnoxious with the throwing rules... lobbing multi-ton rocks around can do a number on the scenery.

Possibly weights should be calculated without Unnatural Characteristic modifiers, and then apply those to that number. IE, SB 8 + TB 4 = 12, which is 112kg carry, x3 (Treating two x2s as a x3, per general guidelines, but x4 wouldn't be unreasonable either) is 336. So carrying another Space Marine would probably be encumbering, but not require a test, and I could probably drag two at a time. A Space Marine who doesn't have the +Strength armour legacy and has a base Strength of 40-49 could drag another Space Marine, or lift him with a Strength test. Sounds about right to me.

As an aside, the section mentions how the armoury "describes several weapons designed to be thrown at targets"... except there are no non-grenade thrown weapons in the Deathwatch book. Which is a shame, as a SB of 13 makes them pretty nasty. I'd do more damage (on average) with a Frag Grenade if I didn't pull the pin... Javelins with the Mono upgrade are near bolt pistol damage (single shot, anyway).

I don't have the rules books to hand at the moment, but does a Marine even count as encumbered if his armour has no power?

Kage

Not as such - but he needs to make a strength test at a -40 to even move.

Which is kinda odd when you think about it...

I find it hilarious that a marine in power armour can pick up one his Terminator buddies and hurl him bodily at the enemy without much effort.

"Throw me closer! I want to hit them with my hammer!!"

Cifer said:

A suit of unpowered power armour is more than just weight, though; the joints and servos will cease operating, locking up, meaning that the warrior has to strain against the natural resistance of the armour's mechanism.

@N0-1

That's what I assumed as well, but that reasoning will only get you so far when we're talking about people whose pushing abilities tend towards going over 9 tons (let's just think about what that means in kg...).

Cifer said:

Well, if they're strong, consider how strong their armour has to be to be of any use to a warrior so mighty...

Kage2020 said:

Only if it pushed him over the weight limit. The rules for moving in an un-powered suit seem pretty specific: you have to make a -40 strength check to do more than sit there in one place (note a check, so your unnatural bonus won't help), and if you make the check your movement is reduced to 1 and you continue to take -30 on all tests based on moving around (which I would say would include aiming/firing/jumping/dancing/etc)

ddunkelmeister said:

OMG! The image of the Leman Russ with its commander poking out of the turret brandishing his sword and pointing comes to mind.

" Drive me closer! I want to hit them with my sword! "

-=Brother Praetus=-

Wargamer said:

Solution: Magnets!

The book even points this out with the dipole maglock. No need for webbing when everything sticks to you.

Of course, that same thinking is giving me Ork weapon ideas.

(note a check, so your unnatural bonus won't help)

I think this one can safely be assumed to be unintentional - you've got Unnatural Strength, strength beyond the ken of any mortal man, but on the only test that depends only on strength, it doesn't help you? I don't think so.

Howdy!

The house rule we use to limit the "golf bag of guns" challenge is to limit "end items" as such:

2 melee weapons plus the combat knife

2 pistols counting the starting bolt pistol

1 basic weapon, usually the starting bolter

1 heavy weapon or an extra basic weapon

1 backpack option (jump pack, backpack ammo, servo arm, missile launcher loader, etc...)

Hope this helps.