NUKE (Terran-Ghost)

By LoKu2, in StarCraft

I doubt the use of this letter!

Suppose that my front-line unit is a Ghost, using NUKE, LOCKDOWN also used to attack a Reaver. We are in a battle of three skirmishes.

But solve the first skirmish of the Ghost, and it survives, so the ability to NUKE can be used. Reaver also survives because the Ghost of attack is 0.

My other two skirmishes was lost. It left only a Ghost versus 3 Protoss units.

Resolve the Splash Damage, then my opponent have to destroys 2 additional units.

The question is:

The additional word means that only can destroy other units skirmishes?

Or you can also destroy the unity against which the letter appeared? (in this case the Reaver)

sorpresa.gif

All of the opposing units that survived from all the skirmishes in that battle are valid targets. Your opponent gets to choose which 2 of the 3 surviving units are destroyed.

By the way I thought that Nuke card in the expansion would be improved. I still think that it is to weak - because you must research it after every use. What do you thing about it? In my play group we implemented a new rule - nuke card can be returned to hand by paying its cost during the Build order. After few games it works well - nuke become useful(if terran fight with another terran or protos) and not overpowered.

My special tipp: You can also use the nuke card for non-Ghost unit due to the high (7/4) secondary combat values. It's like a third Stim Packs card. :-) And you don't need to put it back to the reseach deck if you play it for a non-Ghost.

Well, combined with Medics the Nuke really is much more effective than earlier in the game because the Ghost has a greater chance of survival. Imagine pairing him with a Corsair, Valkyrie or Devourer demonio.gif That's a really nasty one.

Stefan said:

Well, combined with Medics the Nuke really is much more effective than earlier in the game because the Ghost has a greater chance of survival. Imagine pairing him with a Corsair, Valkyrie or Devourer demonio.gif That's a really nasty one.

You are really making a great argument to build the Defence Module at least by the time you get units with only air attacks...

Excellent strategy to help land the nuke by the way!

But how to land the nuke is not a problem - it is not hard (at least against terran or protos player, who doesn't use archons). The main problem is that nuke after use returns to the technology deck. You have to use another research order, pay its cost again and wait, until it comes to your hand. And you are doing it for only 2 enemy units killed after splashes.

Lets compare it witch psionic storm for example. Psionic storm gives your frontline unit +2 attack (which usually in enough to kill enemy) and splash damage. So it allow you to destroy 2 enemy units. Yes, you need 2 units (nuke needs only ghost), but it is easier to use + you buy 2 psionic storm cards. And what's more, if you for addition research technology with recharge ability (both technology cards are cheaper than 2 nukes), you can use psionic storm in every battle, in which you really need it.

Termit said:

But how to land the nuke is not a problem - it is not hard (at least against terran or protos player, who doesn't use archons). The main problem is that nuke after use returns to the technology deck. You have to use another research order, pay its cost again and wait, until it comes to your hand. And you are doing it for only 2 enemy units killed after splashes.

Lets compare it witch psionic storm for example. Psionic storm gives your frontline unit +2 attack (which usually in enough to kill enemy) and splash damage. So it allow you to destroy 2 enemy units. Yes, you need 2 units (nuke needs only ghost), but it is easier to use + you buy 2 psionic storm cards. And what's more, if you for addition research technology with recharge ability (both technology cards are cheaper than 2 nukes), you can use psionic storm in every battle, in which you really need it.

But, if you use a golden research order (which should be a no brainer if going Nukes) then it is actually more effective then The Protoss Psi storm. Beacuse you can use it in tandum with cloaking and no matter what happens you're gonna knock out two of their units. Which is WILDLY effective if you are using your ghost to "clean up" after a battle. Which, is how the ghost should be used when dropping nukes. Play him as support in the forst battle, then go in with cloaking and a nuke to drop the hammer on the stragglers if your first onsluaght is a failure.
NOT TO MENTION that nuke can be used defencivly more effective then the Psi storm. Bunker and nuke. Bring it. Plus, lets see that Psi storm stand to a EMP.
They only advatage I see is that is a High templar and a Ghost face one another, the Halliucination trumps the Nuke pretty much every time.

Oh yea, Guess who's a big fan of the Nuke. Not because it is Hella Effective, but because it is funny to take down a planet with one unit while your real army is beating on another.

Well, yes and no. Normally you research the Nuke with a golden order, so you have it when you need it. And it can be used for really devastating effects if you need to kill a lot of units. And remember, it is also a defensive weapon (very hard to use the Psionic Storm that efficient like the Nuke). But I agree, it is very weak. A possible houserule would be to give the Nuke "Collateral Damage", at least. It should be able to do that :D

Firstly, it is not so hard to counter cloaking. Ghosts are only used against terran or protos players. And they always research theirs detector technology to counter cloaking. And if you use cloaking, you need place to withdraw. Sometimes you dont' have where. To land nuke you must very often prepare more ways for ghost to survive.

Secondly, if you use ghost in defense, your enemy will be ready for your bunker - if he is not, then I don't know why is he attacking. And countering bunker is quite easy - he need splash damages or 9 attack value. I only agree that nuke + lockdown + bunker against terran or no-Archon protos player is very devastating when defending.

Thirdly, I don't agree that psionic storm is not as good as nuke in defense. I think that it is even better. Why? Because you can use it against every race (even EMP don't help your enemy, because you are placing your supporting unit after him) and it allow you tto destroy 2 enemy unit. Yes, you need second unit to do it. But when you fight as a defender, the main problem is that it is very hard to gain attack bost to kill enemy unit. Psionic storm helps very much. And it is very easy to use it. And even if nuke would give you better efect (2 enemies killed with only 1 unit) you have to use anotcher order and pay it cost to gain it again. And as protos, you have another psionic storm in deck. And you don't have to buy it again.

Lastly, yes, psionic storm can be very easy countered by EMP. But only when terran player is defending. And are there any other ways to counter psionic storm? Only destroing 2 very cheap units. And nuke is easy to land only on terran or no-Archon protos. So psionic storm is easier to use. Even if you use nuke against terran, it is strong. But you need too many research orders and too many resources to use it more times.

Yes, of course you are right. I just wanted to point out that Nuke has its (very limited) uses. Normally, I wouldn't bother research it, but I don't go after Ghosts often either.

You make some good points, and you are right. Psi storm is crazy strong. You would be a fool not to research it. The thing that makes nuke so useful is it can be executed with solely the ghost in the battle. A nuke won't contribute to big battles as well as psi storm. But you won't ever be able to run threw a planet behind enemy lines as well as a ghost.
It all comes down to compairing Apples and Oranges. Psi storm may be better then nuke, but Terran don't have access to Psi storm.
I do agree that Nuke seems kinda nerfed. Like how is it not going to have collateral damage? You telling me if I drop a nuke on a mineral feild, it WON'T waste the workers?

Yes, it wasn't replaced. But still, that should be houseruled. The Nuke is still not too good.

As I said before, in our playgroup we implemented a new house rule: Nuke can be returned to hand by paying it's cost during build order. After few games it works well.

Other possibility could be: after destroying 2 enemy units you can gain collateral damage or you can destroy one more enemy unit.

What do you think about those ideas?

Sounds weird, with the third unit....Nuke instantly kills two, so this "condition" is always fullfilled. One could rule that it destroyes three...

It's a choice after playing nuke - should I destroy his base taking collateral damage or should I destroy his all army selecting another enemy unit destroyed?

Aaaaaaaaah, that explains it. Yes, that would be a possibility.