What would the benefit in game mechanics be in a superior leather armor? An additional black die when an enemy attacks?

+1 Defence sounds about right. Or reduced encumberance.

It's entirely up to the GM. It should be a modest advantage.

I chose +1 defence for Superior Armor (+1 misfortune die to enemy attack pool).

It said somewhere in the equipement section that Superior Items would contribute 1 Fortune die to applicable checks, Armor doesn't have any but a fixed penality to attack rolls (Defence).

I was wrong. Leather armor gives 2 soak. Not Def. So, it would make sense a superior armor benefit soak. Why would improving the quality of the leather make you hard to hit? It makes more sense to absorb more damage instead. Still, +1 misfortune die makes more sense from a game mechanics viewpoint.

Also, the rules states clearly that a fortune die is awarded to a superior items. Since defence items give MISfortune die, it looks like the rule was written for weapons. Either this, or was not clearly written in the first place.

So, what makes more sense to you. A superior leather armor should have a +2 soak +1 def, or +3 soak?

plutonick said:

Defence represents the armour making landing a significant hit less likely.

+1 Soak (3 Soak total) is a +50% increase in effectivity. Imo this is too much.

I think both are too powerful and would probably go with the lighter encumbrance or some other slight advantage.

Superior quality gives: 1 fortune dice for offensive checks (weapons, lockpicks etc.) or 1 misfortune for defensive checks (armour, shields etc.)

Giving additional soak and defence is way too powerful. Such things should be given to magical or storydriven items/equipment.

If you give +1 bonus soak to a superior leather armour (50 silver), it becomes as good as a chain mail (100s (1gold)). For half the price!!!

As above, Superior Leather is 2 Soak and 1 Defence.

A Soak increase would be the same as a Weapon Damage increase (a fixed effective value of the item : either the damage, or the soaking of it), which is way too much. Its reserved for Magical-type equipment.

Superior quality has no effect of the defensive benefits of the armor. Instead, it is more durable, less likely to break or be damaged, less encumbering, looks nicer. In essence, it does exactly what the rules say Superior quality does. It gives a fortune die on any rolls made regarding the armor.

dvang said:

This.

I would also give a fortune die to social checks where quality armor could impress.

The way armor scales, adding to any of it's stats is a huge bonus.

Looking at it mechanically, the issue is that giving a defensive die makes Mail Shirts obsolete. You get the same soak, defense, cost, and rarity for one encumbrance point less. Why ever buy a Mail Shirt, they are just as common?

Doc, the Weasel said:

I think the same way. +1

dvang said:

Historically the protection value of armour did vary by its design, material and manufacturing quality. All mail shirts for instance were not the same in terms of protection.

This brings up a more general point about how 'realistic' you want to play things in a pre-mass production setting. A typical player seems to think he can walk into an armourer and find a full suit of chainmail off-the-peg. However, a more realistic situation would be the PC spending an hour or three being fitted and then the armorer working out the dimensions for the suit. The PC might then need to come in a few more times before his suit is complete - weeks or months after the first visit...

Cheaper armour might be adjusted to fit - links added/removed. But good armour was uniquely made-to-measure for the customer. Imo superior quality means both made-to-measure and the best design, material and craftsmanship. Imo it is perfectly valid to give superior armour a modest protection and/or encumberence advantage.

Doc, the Weasel said:

If you find that Superior is too easily find-able, then add another +1 rarity to it. Even increase the price. The mail shirt sould be a common/vulgar (not common from the availability table of the rulebook) piece when a Superior armor is not. I will offer my group the possibility to aquire 1 (only) Sup Leather Armor in Stromdorf only because there is a Tannery there, once they "helped" the city. Remember that you cannot find stuff whenever/whereever you want. You need to look for it in the right places. You will find very little metal stuff in Stromdorf (in my opinion), when you'll find lots of leather based (at per TGS book, lowered access level on leather, augmented on certain goods)

Also, a merchand will want to keep his top noch pieces for high end customers, not rifraf / adventurers. They'd rather sell to the Gold Tiers people, as they pay (per the rule book if you need convincing with rule enforcement, se Economy chapter and Gold tier) at least double the book prices for stuff, which would make them pay x20 for Superior equipement...

You argue that the Defense bonus (misfortune die) is not ok for some reason, then why the Weapons should have a bonus Fortune die then ? It has the exact same effect (the high quality of the product helps in the role of the item -> attacking for one, defending for the other)

The social Status approach you argue is not really valid too since the Superior Weapon would have the same social impact (and bonus if one), it's beatifuly crafted, decorated / engraved, etc. the same an armor piece could be. Both are notice-able and may have impact.

Since both are technicaly involved in the combat process, you need to treat them equally with the Superior craft property. Either none get the technical bonus (Fortune/Misfortune), or both have it. Same point for a Social bonus or not, either both or none.

Technical Combat -> bonus or not, for both Armors and Weapons

Story Telling & Social interactions -> bonus or not, for both

I will keep the +1 Misfortune for Superior Armors to be in par with the Superior Weapons giving +1 Fortune.

I will also use social approach, but not as a fixed bonus to dice pool. It will be sometimes a bonus just to be able to speak to some people (Nobles who would not speak to simple mercenaries for exemple), or sometime a malus / indrance, when speaking with commoners (copper / silver tiers) if the PCs are seen as Gold tiers people. Having the right tool for the right situation applies also to the way you look