As all Space Marines are Unnarmed Masters (1d10 + SB damage, non-Primitive) and Improvised Weapons do 1d10-2 + SB damage, Primitive & unbalanced, is there ever a reason why a space marine might use an Improvised weapon?

It also seems odd that leverage and momentum doesnt come into it and swinging a ceramal chair over someones head does less damage than punching them (note that unnarmed master doesnt assume the space marine is amoured).

SJE

Nothing says I don't like you as a chair on your head in a bar brawl...style points!

I think that's sort of the point, though - Space Marines are trained to fight with every part of their body (which they have learned to turn into a deadly weapon), but not with non-weapons like chairs and other unwieldy things.

I think that's sort of the point, though - Space Marines are trained to fight with every part of their body (which they have learned to turn into a deadly weapon), but not with non-weapons like chairs and other unwieldy things.

Pretty much. Leverage is all fine and dandy, but you can't grab others with a chair, you can't twist their limbs and do other nasty stuff with them. I don't think it's unreal- er, make that "improbable" that a Space Marine can do more damage by pure bare-handed martial arts than with an improvised club.

I guess it also might depend on the concept you have in mind when thinking about " wounds ".

In the olden days of WHFRPG 1st, a character actually only got wounded in the stricter sense of the word when he was down to what, 2 wounds I think, and then severely, critically wounded after that.

Since the whole franchise, especially the WH40K, isn't really an exercise in damage model simulation, I figured that the "damage" incurred by any and all weapons sort of reflects a mixture of combat luck, advantages and exhaustion. Once the wounds are gone, and the criticals start, the weapon type starts making all the difference, narratively - since only then anything is really wounded as such....

So yes, they get better combat results with the gun-kata type of martial arts, but that is not to say that the space marines fist necessarily damages more than a sledgehammer / other brutal improvised weapon you think of.

it coulkd also be in there for npc's who aint uber killy marines to use as they inclede traits and talents that are not used by marine chrs for that express purpose

Well, you see, in the beginning, each primarch was instructed by the Emperor in the way of Ansatsuken. Eventually, though, Horus and several others were consumed by the Satsui no Hadou.

Sanguinus was slain...

But the Emperor had better timing...

And this is why a space marine can hit you with a dumpster and do less damage then by hitting you with his fists!!!!!

I'd rather parry a power weapon with an improvised weapon than my arm!

darknite said:

Which is funny, as a wooden table leg has a 25% chance of stopping a weapon that can cut through adamantium.

Which is funny, as a wooden table leg has a 25% chance of stopping a weapon that can cut through adamantium.

It's actually got a chance as large as the user's WS - power weapons can only sunder when they do the parrying.

Cifer said:

and this makes more sense..... how ?

Presumably, you'd be intelligent enough to block the non-powered parts of the attack - the attacker's arm, his hand, the guard and hilt of the weapon...

Otherwise, Power Weapons would turn into an I-Win button against anyone not armed with an equivalent weapon. The way it is now, you can still parry and deny your enemy his parries through feinting. Thus, the Power Weapon is pretty strong (it entirely prohibits Multiple Attacks if the enemy wants to keep his weapon), but not overpowering.

In fact you'd be better off parrying with your bare arm than a table leg as your bare arm is your own 'Natural Weapon' so its immune to sundering.

Wargamer said:

Touche'!

BaronIveagh said:

So... Much... WIN!

Wargamer said:

Block. 40,000 years and block is still the best defense against anything.... except a throw.

"We have used a new process, Corax, to create these new force grown clone marines..."

"What sort of process?"

"We call them shotoclones..."