Ok, so some of us were gathered last night and discussing out top cards in game. So I thought I would start a thread and get some discussion going and list what I believe are the top 5.

First, the criteria - in order to make the list, three primary characters were evaluated: Cost, ease of use, effect. Just for clarification cost can mean gold cost, influence cost, or any other type of costs; ease of use can refer to either the ability to trigger/activate the effect and/or the ability to put it in a deck without restriction; effect can be relative to both in game and meta-game effects.

So on to my top 5

1. Golden tooth mines. Easiest repeatable draw in the game.

2. Venomous Blade. Easiest repeatable kill in the game.

3. Castellan of the Rock. Easiest repeatable kneel in the game.

4. The Red Viper (PotS). Costs are high, but clearly the best power grab character in the game.

5. Valar Morghulis. Plots fall into a slightly different evaluation scheme, but I couldn't leave this out of the top 5.

Dobbler said:

1 GTM ~funny that you feel this way greg, I thought it was only a 2 gold replacement effect the first turn you played it...

2 Castellan - still really makes the kneel go round (though if you take him out lanni kneel is still strong...maybe just not as easy)

this is where I start to veer away from your list (i like venomous blade, but there are times when it can miss or just be a bad matchup. Red Viper's location and attachment vulnerabilities can be devisitating, valar can really ruin you own day and not your opponents) and focus on house themes.

3 He calls it thinking......cancel and +2 STR.....yes please

4 Forever burning....where would targ be without this card.....talk about repeatable and thematic!!

5 LIV. This might be just a little personal bias, and it might not be as good without intimidate but I find it to be a great card. Naval escort might have the higher potential for a pump location, but that draw just comes in handy way too often.

My top 5:

1) GTM - same reasons.

2) Castellan - easy and repeatable. Sure he's an ally, but that barely matters.

3) Burning on the Sands - No cost, saves your butt, or ruins your opps. plans. No renown, no uo, no vigilant, no winner. LOVE this card.

4) The Red Viper - High price, but the immunity makes him worth it. Just watch out for those Brothels, AGH, and those city plots.

5) Wintertime Marauders - ~Watch out for that summer! (Although, with less season tech running around these days, I wonder if we'll see more of it?) Seriously though, 3/3 with Army and Ironborn traits, a war crest, and the ability to discard dupes, limited locations, and any other non-unique card. You've got to make it winter, which is easy enough to do, but requires some deck space. The card just fits so nicely into house GJ with saves and war crest tech.

Runners up include:

Venomous Blade - Cards that see play that I really care about it hitting: Alannys GJ, Val, M. Aemon, or Syrio. Even if this card was not around, I'm not convinced people would be playing any other STR2 that don't currently see play (ie. Core set Robb, Ser Ilyn). Still cheap, and repeatable.

Seductive Promise - Always in he back of my head. Not so easy to trigger, but potentially game changing.

Valar - It's all just preparing for it until it hits. Then, you prepare for the next one.

I am on the same page on:

1a. GTM

1b. V. Blade

Valar (EVERY deck has to know how to deal, yo).

The other two are very worthy (Red Viper to me has to be put in with Price of Blood - he isn't that good without it), but I would say.

4. Val - if you can't deal with her, you are going to have a hard time beating that sort of consistent card advantage.

5. Seductive Promise - stealing is just too good.

RV and Marauders need other cards (as do some other power cards like Forever Burning) so I just couldn't really put them up there. I have never been a Castellean fan with their cost and ally and non-unique-ness, but I know I am in the minority there

Dobbler said:

~ You probably don't know, but players will forget to trigger respoinses. That can leave this card in play past the Challenge Phase. So I really don't know why this is your #2.

but players can forget to do alot of things.

You can't really say that Ven Blade, which isn't terribly complex to play, is highly dependant on player skill. At least not so much more than the other cards in his list.

Forgetting to trigger responses has nothing to do with how powerful a card is, it has to do with how good of a player someone is. If that's the case, lets knock down our opinion of every card that has to be triggered, or remembered for that matter. People forget about passives as well. Is Castellan any less of a power card because I forgot to trigger it before? Nope. How about forgetting to draw off GTM one turn? Nope. What about that time I won a pow challenge by 7 and forgot about the Seductive Promise in my hand? Nope.

I think what Rogue30 is saying is not that players can forget to trigger VB, but that they do . For some reason, it's just a forgettable card. Happens in my meta all the time.

I think I'd still include it in the top 5, though.

Actually ~ means sarcasm/joke on this boards.

nurambar said:

Ya but players also forget to bring back Forever Burning in Dominance or pop Syrio back into shadows as well. Personally I forget about Forever Burning far more often than I ever forgot about Venomous.

Like stated, I don't think you can base an evaluation of a card on something that could or could not happen.

Dobbler said:

I'll probably now discover I've been playing it wrong- which will really please my wife who plays mostly Stark and never Lannister, but what about Lannisport Brothel? Play it once, and it's there, preventing a card of your choice from ever being standing in the challenges phase unless there's an event card to stnad it.

Nope, you're essentially right on the Brothel.

Okay, my quick top 5 would be:

1. GTM - duh
2. Venomous Blade - automatic in any Martell
3. Fear of Winter - the stats just combine to make too good a card, lower initiative or gold would balance it out
4. Robert Baratheon [Core] - Still the best power rush card in the environment, imho. Close with Viper, but without Lost Oasis Viper just isn't as scary as this.
5. Lost Oasis - Best repeatable kneel in the game? (less weaknesses than Castellan)

Other definite contenders: Valar, Iron Mines, LIV, Castellan, Viper, Seductive Promise...

Good thread Dobbs:

My Top five (in order);

1. Valar

2. Fear of Winter

3. Red Viper (built in immunities makes him the strongest character out there - can close out games really fast)

4. Castellan

5. GTM - I hate to be in the crowd - but it IS the best draw in the game.

1. Valar Morghulis - This card defines the metagame, every deck is built on the concept that the opponent is likely to have this card. It encourages not blowing out quickly, saves, draw, etc. (I think there are enough posts and articles on how this card shapes the game). I also sort of feel that this card is the best representation of the game.

2. Val - She is sort of the Samwell Tarly (WED) of the metagame right now.

3. Lannister House Card - It's not the individual repeatable kneel, its the house card that allows you to choose from Brothel, Castellian, AGH, YKR Dwarf,and the three or more other kneel characters.

4. Power of Blood - I actually think the Red Viper by himself is good, but this is the card that makes him shine. A CBK Viper that is immune to everything but locations is the bread-winner.

5. Brienne of Tarth (B/S variant) - Shuts down Vengence, shuts down Greyjoy.

Including game and metagame influences, here's my top 5:

1. GTM

2. VB

3. Valar

4. Fear of Winter

5. Red Viper*

* There's other cards (some have been mentioned, some haven't) that can go into the #5 slot since TRV can apparently have his power removed/blanked. If his power was untouchable, he's easily in the top 5, IMO. Castellan doesn't make the cut for me, despite being very good.

Personally I think Kings of the Storm changes this list quite a bit.

Shadows hate plot could knock down Venomous Blade and Forgotten Plans definitely weakens both Valar and Fear of Winter.

Syrio Forel - well not sure he is top 5 most powerful but he is my favorite and hella good.

Varys - Have not seen anyone list this card yet tied Valar for being in 7 of the Top 8 from GenCon

Red Viper (PotS)

Castellan of the Rock

Val

LaughingTree said:

Yeah, Kings of the Storm may very well change the list. Forgotten Plans won't work against Valar since it doesn't blank out cards in the Plot Phase. It will knock-out Fear of Winter in all non-Plot Phases. As for Venomous Blade, it's a tad more vulnerable, but it can pretty much circumvent all the new Shadow control. Come out before Marshalling when King's Law is out. Kill Maester Pylos. Say thanks to the Sister of Truth for returning it back to the Shadows. King's Law and Frozen Solid can stop it, but given Stark's card pool, I don't see much of reason for Stark to run King's Law when it can run stronger plots.

I think unless you're lannister then you'll have trouble with Baratheon.

Having Baratheons host with lineage and legacy, is pretty disgusting canceling out 2 challenges you can do that turn

Stag Lord said:

Narrow Escape will help the Valar problem (also Stark murder)- and may well be on this list if we revisit it around the holidays.

1. Valar

2. Fear of Winter

3. Red Vengeance

4. Burning on the Sand

5. Venomous Blade

I'd like to propose the new Beric Dondarion for this list. Even now, when there is so little Brotherhood cards in the environment, we have a Martell/Brotherhood deck that is using Beric to create an insane powr-rush deck. His abilty to be both CBK and CBD is powerful, and having renown combo'd with To The Spears is creating some very fast games. As Brotherhood decks start getting more options, this card may just become more meta-defining.

JerusalemJones said:

A good point. What can somebody possibly do against a Brotherhood agenda and a Beric besides blanking its text?

Steal him? Bounce him? Kneel him? Drop Core Set Mel?

Not impressed. He's not Top Five.