Here are two new Strategy roles for, ideally, Shattered Empires expansion. (They will permit five-player games with each player fulfilling two roles per round -- as well as the arguably ridiculous but probably entertaining nine- and ten-player games. It also permits markers to pile up on unchosen roles in double-roled four-players games.)

(9) Economy

Primary: Innovation

Receive two Command Counters from your reinforcements, and four Trade Goods.

Secondary: Exploitation

Receive one Command Counter from your reinforcements, and two Trade Goods.

(These benefits occur automatically unless declined in whole or in part. There is no cost.)

(10) SUBTERFUGE

Primary: Level the Field

Mercenaries hired by your covert operatives (1) steal one Trade Good if available, or if not then one Political Card at random if available, or if not then one Action Card at random if available, AND (2) hijack one build unit*, from EACH player with MORE Victory Points than you. You determine which build units are stolen. You then receive one Trade Good from supply for each player with more Victory Points than you. You keep all trade goods and cards. The stolen build units are then distributed to players with LESS Victory Points than you (with the player in worst position getting first choice; one ship per player maximum. The recipient players may either place them on the board immediately in any controlled system, or receive their equivalent value in trade goods (1 if fighter).

*The value of a build unit hijacked may be no more than build cost (unmodified standard) = highest player's victory point total divided by three, round up.

Secondary: Damage Control

Spend 1 Command Counter from any location (including ships) to negate losses. The player of the strategy card and the recipients of stolen build units keep their plunder. If an action card or political card was plundered, it is replaced with a new one.

I really like both of these.

The first one is basic enough to not be overpowered, but it's also never going to be useless.

The second one, I didn't like it when I first read it, until I got to the secondary. The ability to counter it is nice. I'm not sure how this would play out in a 10 player game. I suppose the people in the lead will need to take this card for themselves to protect themselves from others. I might change the wording on the secondary as well. It was unclear at first that you meant you may pay 1 command counter from strategy allocation, fleet supply, or command pool. Maybe just change it to be Strategy Allocation, which is along the same lines as all other strategy cards.

I like the first one. It will keep things moving in a large game with (presumably) more tiles than the current 8 player games. Not sure I would want it in a 5 player game though.

The second one is a very cool idea, but it's also complicated. I can see a lot of time getting wasted each time this SC gets played as players try to remind themselves how exactly it works again. Might also be tricky to fit it all on one SC card, if you're so inclined to make homebrews. Something a bit easier but along the same lines:

10 - Subterfuge

Primary: You may request a PC, AC, 3 TGs or units totaling 3 resources from the player with the highest current VP. That player must comply if he is able to provide the item requested, though that player gets to choose which units or cards are given. This ability has no effect if you are currently the player with the highest VP when it is activated.

Secondary: Other players may pay 1CC from Strategy Allocation to receive the same item you requested (the same units if units were chosen), from the bank or reinforcements instead. The player with the highest VP may pay 1 CC to replace what was given from the bank. If the primary has no effect then the secondary cannot be used by any player.

The primary purpose of Subterfuge is besides keeping in the theme of scheming and stealthy maneuvering is to even (if ever so slightly) what can be a very long and frustrating game for players in poor positions. Note that Subterfuge is not particularly powerful of a role; for example, in a six-player game with the three leading players between 6 and 8 points, if chosen by the player in 4th position, he will receive five Trade Goods (or fewer + cards), while players five and six will swipe a Cruiser (2pts) at best. The worst that can happen to a player with 9 points is that he loses a Carrier (3pts) and a card the player might consider a Command Counter to be more valuable than that, and choose not to even exercise Damage Control, and fear the loss so little that he preferentially chooses other roles even if Subterfuge is available especially if it near-equally hurts other players "breathing down his neck" in the points-race.

(Simplification of Subterfuge)

(10) Subterfuge

Primary: Level the Field

Agents steal one trade good and one ship* from each player with more Victory Points than you. If unable to provide Trade Goods or ships, targeted players forfeit Political and Action cards of their choice. *Ship maximum value equals targeted player's VP/3, round up. Every player with fewer Victory Points than you, starting with lowest, now takes one stolen item (place it if a ship); you receive one Trade Good from the bank for each item distributed. Remaining ships are returned to stockpiles.

Secondary: Damage Control

Spend one Command Counter from any location (including Fleet) to negate Subterfuge losses; lost cards are replaced with new ones

Mike18xx said:

Fair enough. Much easier to read, accomplishes the same goal. Personally I would just say "maximum ship value of 3 resources," because why do all that math when answer will basically always be 2 or 3? I know it's not hard math, but there's a limit to how much thinking I prefer to have to do for a single card, especially in a game this complex. Maybe make it a static 2 if the loss of a carrier proves too unbalanced, but I'd have to play test it a bit to see whether or not that's true.

Still, very exciting additions to the game. Thanks for sharing with us. =)

Steve-O said:

Note that since (9) Economy provides everyone with Trade Goods, no one should be lacking them when (10) Subterfuge goes off, unless the (10) player sandbags a couple rounds and the other players imprudently spend all of them before he activates.

IMO the one unaddressed problem is what to do with Subterfuge on the first game turn (and possibly also the second or third), when it's basically valueless since nobody will have scored any VP prior to activation . To fix that, add the following line:

Special: If all players are tied, then... Primary: take one Trade Good, one Political Card and one Action Card. Secondary: none.

Tweaks to restore potential random card loss, and provide value to the role in first-round scoreless games.

(10) Subterfuge

Primary: Level the Field

Agents steal one trade good and one ship* from each player with more Victory Points than you. If unable to provide Trade Goods or ships, targeted players forfeit random Political and Action cards. *Ship maximum value equals targeted player's VP/3, round up; you choose the ship taken. Every player with fewer Victory Points than you, starting with lowest, now takes one stolen item (place it if a ship); you receive one Trade Good from the bank for each item distributed. Remaining ships are returned to stockpiles.

Secondary: Damage Control

Spend one Command Counter from any location (including Fleet) to negate Subterfuge losses; lost cards are replaced with new ones.

Special: In a scoreless game, the activating player receives one Trade Good, one Political card and one Action card. No secondary.

I would suggest wording the cards the same as all the other cards.

"Agents take..." should be replaced with "Receive 1 AC/PC ..."

One of my reactions is: What agents?

You also have the math problem of saying, round up.

If you had 4 points, that would be worth 2 points of ships.

7 points would be 3 points of ships.

It should be round down, so that

1-2 is 0

3-5 is 1

6-8 is 2

9+ is 3

If a carrier is stolen and then replaced.

Do the fighters/ground forces being held on it blow up as well?

Or is the replacement immediate?

1. "Agents" was "flavor-text"; remove as you see fit.

2. I want the round-up with round-down, you couldn't lose anything "serious" until 9VP. With round-up. the break-points are 1VP(1pt ship), 4VP(2pt ship) and 7VP(3pt ship). ...It's pretty tough to get nailed at 1VP, however, because the player taking Subterfuge would have to be at 0VP to hurt you...it's also possible that you don't have any fighters or destroyers at that stage, in which case he only gets a card (and you might not have any of those either!).

3. Stolen ships cannot be ferrying.

I would say a carrier is fairly serious, and nothing costs 4, unless you factor in L1Z1X's Dreadnaughts.

examples:

1.1 rounds up to 2

2.1 rounds up to 3

3.1 rounds up to 4

whereas

1.1 rounds down to 1

2.1 rounds down to 2

3.1 rounds down to 3

With round down, you actually need to have at least 3vp before anyone can steal from you.

I like this, as 1 and 2 vp is not even close to a leader yet.

I like the idea of somebody with 7pts having to worry about guarding things less trivial than cruisers. People at 7pts are often capable of winning that game that turn.

Subterfuge would be myeh if it didn't have any bite.

Just wanted to put my two cents worth in. Why not make it VP/2 rounded up instead? Now THAT would be bite! AND one could choose a combination of ships lost adding up to VP/2 rounded up.

In retrospect, Subterfuge seems to be a pain to administer and would probably just bog down the game, so I've come up with a different tenth card which is probably more fun anyway:

(10) Reorganization

Primary: Cunning Plan

Optionally perform both of: a) shift one Command Counter in Fleet Supply, Strategy Allocation or Command Pool to one of the other locations; b) exchange one possessed Technology advance to a different one you for which you are qualified.

Secondary: Logistics

Optionally perform either a) or b).

Special: 1) A player may not have made use of a Technology he seeks to replace during the game turn in which it is exchanged; i.e., if he used XRD Transporters to move a Carrier two spaces, or Deep Space Cannon to fire into an adjacent hex, he may not exchange that technology that turn. 2) An eliminated advance may not break a chain of prerequisites for other possessed advances. 3) If an exchange creates illegal units on the board, they are removed. 4) Neither War Sun nor X-89 Bacterial Weapon tech may be exchanged or obtained via Reorganization.