Publish rules for a new chapter each week. A couple of pages of Fluff and a Page of Chapter advancements, formatted like the book so we can print them out and throw them in a binder. If you feel real ambitious throw together a binder specifically to hold them (Cool cover art). With a thousand chapters you could do one a week for almost 20 years. A good source would be fan submissions. This of course wouldn't proclude a book of Chapter data, or even publixhing a compilation per year, each volume with 52 Chapters in it.

Except, since they've already said that rules for Chapters are going to be out in a different book, and that book won't be out for a few months yet:

1) Why would they do so when they can put it in that book instead; and

2) This all assumes they've already written the Chapter Creation rules, or aren't already busy doing other projects to carry out your suggestion.

I just seriously doubt this is going to happen, sorry.

On the other hand, it is a good suggestion for a fan site . The only difference is that the author would not get quite the sense of personal gratification or achievement from having it validated by the FFG bods. Well, if that is really an issue at all.

So, yeah, try it as a fan project. I'm tempted to steal the idea myself for DR, but that's not quite the way that I roll. It would make a somewhat excellent project and resource and, further, might be something that could be connected to Phil Sibbering (et al.) and the "1000 Chapter" database. Then again, I tend to be a fan of the, erm, fan stuff.

Kage

Aye, now fans doing it would work, though, given we can almost guarantee that the other First Founding Chapters will be included in Rites of War, and we will likely see rules for the other Chapters that are in the Jericho Reach with the Crusade forces (such as the Angels Vermillion, White Consuls, Relictors, etc), it means that, by the start of year (since Rites of War is meant to be released in Q1 2011) a lot of work will likely be invalidated (regardless of whether the official stuff is better or not, most people I know tend to go with the official rules over fan-made rules).

This means that if fans decided to do it, it'd either be with the understanding that their work will be invalidated in the near future, or do Chapters that are unlikely to be covered with specific rules in Rites of War.

Millandson, again - at 52 a year it would take 20 years (mostly) to do them all. I am guessing there is plenty of material BOTH for weekly chapters and books, though I could see splitting the effort would detract from accomplishing other things (point taken ). Question, If a years worth of these were posted and then at the end of the year they were compiled in a book with artwork, would you buy it? I know I would . oh and how does one get involved in Playtesting stuff for FFA?

Kage2020, If you can do something with this at DR, I give up any and all claim to the idea and grant you free reign (pun intended). If it actually starts happening, well more power to you. I would like to be involved in the project if at all possible. My suggestion would be to limit it to non-canon fan material, so it doesn't step on whatever FFA comes out with.

The other 103 people that glanced at this thread: Is this something you would be interested in? Is it something you would contribute to? If FFA compiled a book of these at the end, would it be something you would buy?

Darq

I think it would be interesting, but I doubt its worth FFG's time/money to create free weekly content, even if they do publish it in a compilation. Those resources could be better used to create product people are more interested in buying that isn't also free on their website (and just because you, and maybe I, would buy the compilation doesn't mean everyone will).

It'd work great as a fan thing though. But most fan things never make it far.

Invalidated? Hardly. FFG would have just created a new canon by which the fan work would have to be moderated, if they feel that the FFG materials had merit, or left as they are if it is felt that the FFG version is... lacking. It would never be canon either way, but FFG's materials do not invalidate the work of a fan. Maybe this comes from my own perspective as a converter, but I do not consider my own work invalidated merely because FFG selected a different way to go with it. The same goes with other fan materials, so it's not just ego. Okay, ego is a part of it, but it's not just ego.

Often it seems that people are too considered about what is canon so that they forget about what it is good . That's not to say that FFG material is bad, so please don't even go there—"that dog just don't hunt."

Of course, this is all subjective. When I look through Deathwatch I'll consider the information and determine whether something is not only good, but whether it is better than the method that I selected. If it is good, I'll see if there is anything that I can pilfer from it. My material is not canon, is not going to be published, I cite everything so that's not a problem. If it's better? I'll look at how I can translate that in the most elegant, efficient way. If it's bad or doesn't achieve the goal that I personally see as being more valid? I'll ignore it as "not-good" (which doesn't mean bad).

Invalid? No. Just different. Non-canonical, of course, but not necessarily invalid, worse, or whatever.

On the other hand, if you're bound up into the FFG mechanics, have a tendency of running RAW, or whatever, then fair enough.

Sorry, brought out the inner nerd angst. In the words of martial arts instructors in the north of England, "He's only a plumber."

Kage

Darq said:

Thanks, Darq. It might be one of those topics that has to wait for the new site software to get up and running, which at the moment might admittedly put it into next year anyway. (Just kidding, Skallagrim. ) If something (big IF) gets set up, and I would like it since it's a cool idea, I'll let you know and since you originated the idea you should take some form of creative lead.

As to limiting it to non-canon material? I don't see the point, to be honest. It's not going to be stepping on FFG's toes in the slightest, and might actually show them what the fans are interested in, how they approach things, and perhaps even given them something to work on. Hell, it might even get some a freelance job if they were asked and wanted to work for FFG. Who knows.

Kage

Darq said:

I would think that the basic idea of a new sourcebook with chapters every year is good. One has to do it right though. Every year book needs to have some somewhat important chapter or else only collectors and die-hard fans will buy it. Since fortunately the most important chapters will be covered in Rites of War, I wonder if its going to be economically viable.

And perhaps 52 chapters per book is too much too. Plus you don't want to detail all chapters anyway. You want to keep a few 100 for fan creation, to leave room for imagination, etc. But you can't publish them all on the web before. Any free web material could only be included as a small bonus to the actual chapters.

If properly done and the will is there it might work. Having a good basic idea is one thing. But implementation and making it economically sustainable matters. Unless it's the pet project of someone willing to invest money for the fun of it. :-)

Alex

Thanks for the feed back folks! Kage, if there is anything I can do to help lemme know (Mostly straight html and a lot of Cold Fusion, but I'm willing to learn ). Alex, sorry I keep harping on this but 20 YEARS to cover um all - guessing there will be some left for EVERONE

Thanks again! Darq

Darq said:

I'm guessing that, if it went anywhere, it would be a combination of PHP and MySQL (Drupal) web-side, and Acrobe, In-Design and Flash publication side. Not sure, though. Again, just thinking hazily about the subject.

Kage

Darq said:

I'd rather have a book with 26 chapters and 2 pages (or more) about each rather than 52 chapters and 1 page about each. The actual numbers may vary but you get the idea.

I think GW has been deliberately keeping a mystery to it and has avoided giving a systematic account of all chapters. Don't think they'll change that. But who knows?

Alex

Cause it worked so well for the Dark Heresy planet/sector guide.

The one that had no support and subsequently hasn't been republished by FFG? Or do you mean something else? (Not being sarcastic!)

Kage

It would be lunacy for GW to ever define all 1,000 chapters because part of the charm of the setting is the feeling that you're involved in it somehow with your own small collection of miniatures. If there are still 500+ undefined "canon" chapters, who's to say your own pet chapter isn't as valid as anyone else's? I can't see a fan-based project like this getting "official" approval from GW or FFG, nice idea though it is.

MILLANDSON said:

You mean Legion

I think a better suggestion to FFG is to look at some popular chapters, that aren't going to be directly covered in the book; the ones that require you to otherwise use the build your own and using their "build your own" rules just codify and present the fluff on a number of these chapters. Or it could be just some of the homebrew chapters of their staff, utilizing those rules.

That way they're giving us something interesting but not really new, but nothing that invalidates their books or otherwise makes it not worthwhile. If anything it sells the book by showing us its flexibility and gets us thinking.

Lightbringer said:

As you say, who would want it to be "official?" As an exploration in creativity, though? It really is no different from, say, Philip Sibbering's 1000 Chapters Project . It's called having a bit of fun for those interested in it. It seems that fans have a bit more desire to explore the universe in a bit more detail than the official bods are willing to put down on paper. Of course, the lack of desire to put things down on paper is what engenders the exploration in the first place so... Well, just pointing it out there so that people don't take it as a criticism.

For the first "big 18," though? Seems pretty much a no brainer, and if MILLANDSON's reply is to be taken as a slight hint, also quite likely.

And, once again, none of it is worthless.

Kage

Kage2020 said:

That very one.

Peacekeeper_b said:

Thought so, but thanks for taking the time to clarify.

I think that in this case the lack of support is all at FFG's end (too busy, probably) rather than the desire of the fans to see something like this reappearing once again. Indeed, one of the suggestions over on DR is to create a "living sector," whereby fans can add content to the official worlds of, say, the Calixis setting, as well as contribute their own fan worlds. Of course, official material will be differentiated from fan-produced material, but it is an interesting way that information focused around the official setting can be created. Thus, Jo Q Fan could add a city, a segment of a hive, a hive gang, cult, or whatever that is associated with a specific planet (or whatever).

It requires some conceptual work, and DR isn't the busiest its ever been (except the Actual Play forum), but still... There does seem to be some broad interest and while it would not replace the original, official "living sector," it's about as much as the fans can do without the support of the official bods...

Edit : Dang'nam'quotation system.

Kage

miss dee said:

To be fair: in the Rogue Trader era 40K Compendium they were called First Founding Chapters.

Alex

To be technical each Legion was split into chapters

miss dee said:

Yes, but the Chapters that retained the title of their Legion are First Founding Chapters, the other chapters that split from the original Legions are all of the Second Founding.

I'm sure the point is that if they cover the founding chapters/legions those can serve as templates for 95% of all space marine chapters, since the second founding chapters are similar enough to the legion/chapter they originated from.

It will be interesting to see how the build your own chapter rules go; hopefully they work well.

aka_mythos said:

I just reread the description of the Crimson Fists on Lexicanum, they sound like the natural candidate for a Deathwatch Marine chapter. Wonder why they weren't made part of the first wave.

Aled