Most decent Las and SP weapons are weapons that are good for poorer characters (eg, starting acolytes) or if you want them in bulk. But very few of them are good enough to be useful as the personal weapons of a Rogue Trader and his closest companions (the other PCs) because they have enough wealth to afford better weapons.

So which Las or SP weapons remain worthy of being used by RT PCs when cost is no longer an issue ?

If your group is using any house rules which make Las/Sp more effective, or the alternatives less effective, please state them.

Looking at them I can see that the Assault Cannon, Autocannon, MP Lascannon and Multi-Laser look like useful heavy weapons.

The Nomad and Long-Las are useful with the damage bonus from the accurate quality. While the Exitus rifle is a better weapon (unless the larger clip on the long las matters), possessing one could attract negative attention from various parties.

Are there any others I missed ?

If so, what makes them useful ?

For example, if you are going to mention shotguns, tell us why a shotgun is better than the crux beam gun.

If you are going to talk about how long the weapon goes between reloads, assume that the person using it is conserving ammo. For example, if you were comparing the ammo capacity of an autogun with a lasgun, assume that they autogun user is sticking to single shot and semi-auto to conserve ammo.

Anyone who does not carry a las pistol in 40k is making a mistake.

The simple truth is that a rogue trader is likely to have to kill a fair number of relatively unimportant individuals, for who, a bolt shell or two would be serious overkill. When the game assumes that PCs will carry three clips of ammunition for each weapon, and explorers might concievably have to use a full clips encounter with a moderate to serious threat, it seems reasonable to have a cheap, easily rechargeable weapon as both a back up, and for use against the dregs which so often stand between the dynasy and profit.

They're fine for what they are, a reliable weapon that has logistically, no support required to sustain it for extremely protracted periods of time aside from rudimentary care and recharging. People won't really be all that impressed with it, but sometimes, you don't want to impress anyone with your huge bolt gun and just want to quietly go about your business looking like any other bloke without being swarmed by dozens of hawkers, pick pockets, charletans and assassins every time you step through the boarding hatch.

There is the Archeotech Las Pistol.

It's a decent prestigeous weapon. I mean, Factories build plasma weapons and bolters on a daily basis. Everyone can get one of those. However, archeotech is unique, it is a one of a kind and superior to everything we can create nowadays. It tells that you are a person of culture and refinement. Plus it is quite good actually for a Pistol.

The lasgun is very useful as a backup emergency weapon. A good survivalist weapon. Reliable, easy to have loads of shots with you. You can recharge them with just a simple camp fire if need be. They are useful for hunting as well. Hunting with a bolter or plasma weapon will blow the prey to smithereens, while the lasgun kills with less mess.

It makes also a nice gift for the warlord of a primitive society. Powerful enough to be of real importance to the ruler but not a real danger for the RT and his retinue.

There's always the lascannon. As far as more portable weapons go, remember that the RT and players might not carry them, but you can bet that the RT will outfit his/her household troops with las and hellguns. Decent power and high dependability in any enviroment are high end priorities.

And if you're using bolters, plasma, or meltas aboard ship you're an idiot. On missed shot and you're sucking vac.

The Flametongue howdah pistol is an awesome little side-arm for those occasions when over-penetration would be bad, or (as my players have decided/discovered) for formal duels. Sure, it's got a small ammo capacity, takes forever to reload and has the Primitive quality, but you hit anything unarmoured (like the opponent's face) and they will **** well know they've been hit. Hell, get a best-quality version, and not only do you have an elegant and beautiful weapon, you can make called shots with no penalty, doing 1d10+7 I damage. Add a red-dot scope, and Robert is your parent's sibling.

Shotguns, well, I can see two main reasons why shotguns are better than crux beam guns:
1) versatility. A shotgun can be loaded with different ammo types (hell, you can even fit it with a shot selector and other upgrades), unlike the crux beam, so you can pretty much always have a round suitable for the situation. Of particular note are the Inferno and Blazer rounds, which can set their targets on fire, although the Amputator and its X damage deserve an honourable mention.
2) Ubiquity/legality. Crux beam guns are not only Near Unique (and so something people will comment on/take note of), they're also xeno tech. As a general rule, the authorities of the Imperium look on that as a Bad Thing™. True, Rogue Traders and their retinue can get away with far more than the average citizen, but it will still attract attention from certain intolerant and powerful parties (the Inquisition, for one). Shotguns, on the other hand, are not only imperial, they're everywhere, so carrying one is barely going to be remarked on.
3) Ease of use. Following on from the previous comment about them being everywhere, they're a bog-standard SP weapon. Most classes will be able to carry and use one from the very beginning (either a pistol version or a full-size), while the exotic crux beam gun requires either Hand of War on the origin path, or a significant amount of XP sunk into acquiring the talent (most careers don't get access to Exotic Weapon Training 'til rank 4, and generally for 500 XP). I don't know about you, but unless I'm playing an Arch-Militant (who gets it for 200 XP), then I've got better things to spend it on.

As an aside, I recently had a player (and this is his own words) "trade up" from a bolter to a combat shotgun and recoil glove (well, actually, a pair of them, but he's stated he'll only carry one until he gets Ambidextrous and Two Weapon Wielder (Ballistic)).

Las weapons? Aside from the ones already mentioned, the Belasco Duelling pistol (and the Khayer-Addin 'Valentine' duelling las) fit wonderfully in high social situations (and have a decent chance of killing/seriously wounding something with their one shot), and can be made practical for battle with the simple addition of the backpack ammo supply.
Las Gauntlets are also pretty good to take along, mainly because the long, raking beams are far more awesome than the short blasts of most las-weapons, but the damage and pen are also pretty good, and it technically still leaves both hands free for other stuff.

Best quality reliable Hellpistol. The quality makes it a +10 to attack and +1 to damage. The same can be applied to any of the Las weapons to make them better. If you add customized to it, you decrease the reload time. With the Best Quality Reliable Customized Hellpistol you are getting excellent firepower with excellent damage and some prestige too.

Grand Inquisitor Fulminarex said:

The increased accuracy and damage with higher quality only applies to melee weapons. If it did apply to ranged weapons, it would also apply to other ranged weapons. Either way, it doesn't help.

We shouldn't forget that most las and sp weapons don't have the penetrating power to fire through a bulk head that other weapons do. Could be very dangerous for players to be firing plasma or melta weapons if a fight breaks out in a space craft.

Well, more if combat brakes out in a control room, flyer, engeneering or a crowd. I don't think there's much danger of a man-portable weapon penetraiting a starship's hull. If there was they wouldn't need to stock Macrocannons for starship combat, now would we?

The nice thing about Las over Bolt or Slug is that there's no fragmentation or riccoshay. Also, as noted, theres no overpenetration, so you can fire much more safely into crouded areas. The bigest advantage though, really, is just ammunition capacity. A lasgun is fine to kill or wound most unarmored people/things, and with 3 or 4 clips, you'll almost never run out of shots.

Well, more if combat brakes out in a control room, flyer, engeneering or a crowd. I don't think there's much danger of a man-portable weapon penetraiting a starship's hull. If there was they wouldn't need to stock Macrocannons for starship combat, now would we?

This.

I always have a laugh when people compare 40k voidships to modern day airplanes. If my puny bolter has any chance of punching through my ship's armour, it's time to get a new ship - or install that bolter in place of my ordnance.

That said, there may indeed be times where you don't want to mess with the stuff around the enemy, like electronics. In that case, using SP weapons with dum-dum bullets may help.

Hand Cannon loaded with hyper-density penetrator rounds - for those times you need bolt pistol firepower without the obviousness of one. It should be noted that unlike bolter rounds, these don't explode (Impact damage rather than explosive), which may or may not be a plus. Of course, be mindful of how often you use these rounds, 'cause I suspect that even Rogue Traders are going to have serious trouble acquiring in any substantial quantity . . .

The Minerva-Aegis lasgun and the Fury laspistol are worth consideration as well, if only because they're the few (maybe even the only) non-heavy las-weapons capable of automatic fire. Certainly, you don't have to hesitate as much about laying down suppressive fire with these two weapons since the ammunition for them is so plentiful.

-Kirov

Quicksilver said:

Agree whole heartedly Quicksilver. Only reason I didn't list specific situations was for brevity

Kirov said:

This actually got me thinking, SP weapons are the only weapons that get the silencer upgrade as an option. If you don't want to spend talents on exotic weapon proficiency for the needle weapons, an SP weapon with a silencer would be a great alternative. Furthermore you can make even that hand canon with the hyper-density penetrator rounds covert!

I did not see that! I totally overlooked it. Thanks.

Somebody mentioned the hellgun. Which by my book is a great weapon. Sure the damage output might not look to be that impressive. But the Pen of 7 means it shoots through anything, even Space Marine Power Armour. It is a serious nasty weapon.

from france

the nomad is classified as almost unique and only available in the calaxis sector. it should be counted as unique. so i will not count on the object available on rt but.......it s up to the gm.

angelus bolt carbine has the probleme of supply. so i would put it uin the same categoerie as the nomad.

forget the exitus it s a unique weapon and the temple will go to any length to recover a stolen one. don't play with the temple or their assassin will play with you.

the 8 spider said:

And the explorers will most definitely not be enjoying the game the Vindicare is going to play with them. I believe it is called " I AM the better killer ."

Kirov said:

The D'Laku Crusade -pattern hellgun ( IHB page 133) is also capable of full-auto bursts. Of course, it has an availability of Scarce in the Lathes, and Very Rare on other Forge Worlds, so not an easy thing to get a hold of even for a Rogue Trader.

-=Brother Praetus=-

A void master in my campaign was using twin best quality carnodon hand cannons with bleeder rounds, silencers, fire selectors and motion predictors

a 3 round semiauto burst doing d10+9 damage pen 2 (he had mighty shot) was pretty effective against most foes.

Last week they came up against some word bearer veteran marines (TB 12, armour 8). He is now looking to upgrade - possibly to something like an exitus pistol if the seneschal's illegal weapons contact is up to the task.

It shouldn't be too hard to make it look like something else and pass it off as a xeno weapon. Plus when there are traitor marines in your face pissing off the assassins is the least of your worries.

I find that the autopistol and autogun are often over looked as a backup weapon. Against heavily armored foes a bolt, plasma or melta is a better option. Against lightly armored foes without out massive toughness an autopistol can do impressive damage compared to a bolt pistol. Sure the bolt pistol does tearing, but the auto pistol will do x2 the number of hits. Also a best quality auto pistol that is customized is a great option for pinning large number of foes or mowing down large numbers of mooks. Against certain types of force fields an auto pistol is your best option to knock it down.

PS- Note that all of above said when my players gear for heavy combat it's storm bolters, and power armor. The melta/plasma pistol is the side arm of choice.