We play a couple games of AH a week (Base and King in Yellow Expansion). We usually have a 70 to 80% win rate with the game but since i took out KiY and put in the Dunwich Horror we are terrible!! We have won 1 and lost 14. What are we doing wrong? It seems like no matter what we cannot close gates fast enough and the extra unstable locations added in the Dunwich area just seem to make it impossible to close all the gates. We rarely get monster surges, and some of the new Rumor's just destroy us. Does anyone agree or can anyone advise us as what we are doing wrong? We've even tried picking characters rather than drawing randomly and we still get beat down. We usually play with 2-4 players depending on who shows up. Other than that we just try to play by the book. Please advise. THanks.

gylvan2002 said:

First of all, Dunwich is a major difficulty boost when you've only had the base game before. The monsters are tougher and the higher gate number makes it more difficult. That being said, you can adjust, but it takes a bit of time. You say you close the gates? Not seal? Closing victories are very difficult. Go for sealing. Do you use the Newspaper for retainers and the Science Building for clues? Do you prioritize sealing of high frequency gates?

Nope, it's not you: Dunwich adds a lot of difficulty, and the additional unstable locations are the primary cause for it. I had a big issue when I first got the expansion, until I figured out the problem—I was using only two investigators—which leads me to ask you: how many investigators are you using?

My rule of thumb is that to stand a decent chance of winning, you should be using one investigator per third of the board. So base game with Dunwich is 4/3rds of a board: use at least 4 investigators. I guess you could get away with 3, but it will be really tough to prevent the AO from awakening. (Note that this rule of thumb loses clout as more expansions are added, on account of dilution. FFG user Solan frequently plays games with all three expansion boards with only 4 investigators and uses no anti-dilution rules to my knowledge: he seems to get by just fine.)

Now that there are more places for gates to open, you should consider with more seriousness the duty of closing a gate just for the sake of closing it and keeping the number of open gates down. This act will also prevent monster surges, which are partly or directly responsibly for fortifying Glaaki, Abhoth, Shudde M'ell, the King in Yellow herald, and the Dunwich Horror itself. Of course, this is where the additional investigators will be helpful.

So if your game is entertaining 2, 3, 4, 5, or 6 players, you should be controlling a total of 4, 6, 4, 5, or 6 investigators, respectively.

Hope this helps. And good luck!

We use 1 investigator per player, unless we have only 2 people then we each use two. So 3-5 investigators depending. We did used to only seal gates not just close them but that didn't seem to work either. I did NOT know that gates are more likely to open in certain unstable locations more than others. Is there some reference that has which gates open where with what frequency? Thank you so much for your help. We feel as though we are being drawn through gates by the tentcles of the dunwich horror.

We frequently play the King in Yellow and the Lurker in the Threshold, but its the Dunwich Horror that butchers us on a regular basis. (I never mix expansions other than the Lurker. Which we added to the dunwich horror, without using the lurker herald. We still suck.

I think learning the metagame (odds of success, good & bad locations, probabilities of best skills needed to survive encounters per location, etc.) can help make winning much more likely. To some people, this knowledge spoils the game and destroys its thematic value, but to others (like me), the game becomes a logic puzzle to solve each turn to make informed decisions with the most probability of success.

If you want to find materials for the metagame, look in the Files section for Arkham Horror on boardgamegeek.com (and try not to get overwhelmed). In any case, I recommend you find what is the most fun for you and stick with it. Often the most exciting games are the ones you "almost" win, or the ones that come down to a single die roll at the end.

Dunwich Horror is a huge jump in difficulty from the base game and any small box expansion; that you're losing a lot right now is to be expected. Tibs and Avi have nailed the two most important points already: First, that with Dunwich added you really need to win by sealing rather than by closing all gates, and second, that the number of Investigators is critical. Why do you say that sealing hasn't worked for you? Do you have trouble getting the five Clues? Remember that Elder Signs are your best friends, since they not only provide a seal but also set the Doom Track back, giving you more time. Also, as mentioned previously, the Science Building is vital for getting Clues. Then, too, I hope every player isn't just grabbing Clues willy-nilly; it's important to prioritize so that you can seal gates as quickly and efficiently as possible. Once Dunwich is in the mix the Investigators really need to work as a coordinated team rather than a group of individuals.

Do you use the Injury and Madness cards? Those can be potentially be a great boon to the Investigators, healing them immediately and preventing them from losing half of their Clues and Items.

Yes, the Rumors in Dunwich can be a real pain. If it makes you feel any better, though, they get even worse in later Horror expansions .

Another point that may be worth making is that you should try to avoid getting bogged down fighting monsters (while still killing enough to keep them from awakening the Dunwich Horror). If you can sneak past the creatures in your way, great! If not, maybe another Investigator not yet ready to seal can kill them and clear the way to a gate for the Investigator who already has five Clues.

Out of curiousity, why haven't you won more Final Battles? I know some of the first twelve AO's are tough customers, but there are also a number of weaker ones in there. Do you ever shop to try to get decent weapons (We almost always shop at the Curiousity Shoppe, since you can get Elder Signs, weapons, and items such as the King in Yellow or Mi-Go Braincase there)? Do you ever have your Investigators start grabbing Blessings at the Church if it becomes obvious that the AO is going to awaken in a turn or two?

I don't have the exact statistics, but in general Independence Square, Unvisited Isle, the Woods, the Witch House and Wizard's Hill are all high-frequency unstable locations. The Unnameable, the Black Cave, the Graveyard, and Gardener's Place are medium frequency unstable locations. The remainder are low-frequency locations, where gates will seldom appear.

There are some times with Arkham and Dunwich when there is really nothing you can do, such as when ten different locations open in a row, but hopefully this information will help you score some wins. Let us know!

Oh, and Aeaea, I agree with you wholeheartedly that the best games, win or lose, are the ones that come down to the wire. For my group the combination of base Arkham and the three Horrors seem to achieve this quite often, with the outcome frequently hinging on the last Mythos card drawn and the final roll to close and seal.

By the way, Tibs, I do indeed use no anti-dilution rules, since I honestly don't think you need them with just the Horrors. Last night, for example, we had three gates open in Arkham, three in Dunwich and three in Innsmouth, with one double doom token rumor; such a spread actually isn't that unusual for us.

What are anti-dilution rules?

Solan said:

Yes, the Rumors in Dunwich can be a real pain. If it makes you feel any better, though, they get even worse in later Horror expansions .

I disagree. I'd say that the Rumours in Dunwich are really badly thought out - so bad in fact I've removed them from my deck.

They are meant to scale, but the challenge is usually too hard for the Investigators to stand any chance of defeating them. For instance, presuming that everyone could get to the appropriate street, each Investigator would have to sacrifice 3 Stamina to stop the Riots - but the chances of every investigator getting to the same street within one turn are pretty slim, as usually someone is blocked by a monster, doesn't have enough Stamina, is too darned slow or is in an Outer world. However if you let it slide for a turn suddenly you need X additional stamina where X = the number of players. Even with one or two investigator shedding every of blood, they just can't keep up with the tide. The only use for the Dunwich rumours is to pay 1 Stamina / Sanity / Buck so that the rumour lasts one additional turn as a Rumour shield.

Every other rumour requires some level of a sacrifice (even if it is only moving to the Hospital to get a jab) and, sure, some are hard to accomplish, but with the exception of Cursed Relics (which fails due to deck dilution and the lack of Exhibit Items), they can usually be dealt with. Of course, whether or not the Investigators want to make the necessary sacrifice or suffer the consequences is another matter.

Drakson said:

The more expansions you mix in, the less likely it is that you will draw any given card. This leads to issues with DH where Dunwich gates will be drawn less often, and KiY where it's much safer to let an Act go by because the odds of drawing three The Next Act Begins dramatically. This is called dilution. Anti-dilution rules aim to correct it.

I should point out that all of the anti-dilution rules are fan-created; the only official method given to avoid dilution is to use fewer expansions .

Kingsport's Cover-Up and Mistrust Rumors are, I woud maintain, at least as devastating as the Dunwich Rumors. Furthermore, one could certainly argue that Plans in Motion is the worst Rumor of all. The Dunwich and Kingsport Rumors, however, do get considerably easier if you use all three expansion boards, since you are able to proceed as if you had two fewer players.

gylvan2002 said:

Um, just off the top of my head, Wizard's Hill is high frequency in Dunwich (I forget the rest of the frequencies there). In Arkham proper, Witch House, Unvisited Isle, Independence Square, and Woods are high frequency, Science Building, Silver Twilight Lodge, Hibbs Roadhouse, and Historical Society are low frequency (the others appear with medium frequency).

Jake yet again said:

My take is that "Riots" was designed to make you draw Injury cards via the most powerful player(s) draining their entire stamina, drawing injury card(s) and then repeating until rumor cleared. Of course, the more cards you draw the greater the chance someone will be get a duplicated and be devoured. After you defeat the rumor, retire the investigators you used to clear it.

Same thing for "NIghtmare pool" except this time it's Madness cards.

"Mad Bomber" requires a run on the bank.

Yes, they are very hard rumors ... but as others have noted, there are worse.