How do other GMs handle PCs just disposing of inconvenient & innocent NPCs when things get difficult?

Okay my party are a bit mad. They didn't discuss their characters before creating them so instead of the nice balanced party of I've got a bunch of lunatics who lean to the combat heavy encounters. Now up to know they've managed to keep them on the straight and narrow. Not really asked for many Deceive and other FEL based rolls when the party have managed to roleplay there way into and out of trouble.

What I have encountered is a tendency, if they suspect an NPC is either suspicious of them (and they often act suspicious in the course of their investigations) or an NPC has blown their cover (even by accident), to arrange for a fatal accident for the NPC. Now I'm not wanting for them to be the Nanny State with fluffy towels but I believe PCs that are acting for a force of good (essentially) cannot murder random people without consequence. My house rule is a Corruption point per unjustified killing (the point cannot be reduced/negated by talents)

Two cases in point...

1. During the finale of Illuminations one of the players said he was opening up on the Crow Father whilst the CF was standing in front of the frozen members of Stern Hope. I warned the player that firing at this point would risk the townspeople and if they waited they might get a safer shot next round. The player declined and shot and killed two members of Stern Hope = 2 corruption points to the PC.
2. During HoDaA the PCs thought that one of the bidders (Lord Krin from RFYAT) might recognise them. He didn't and in an earlier session I made of point of him ignoring the PCs. A few sessions later, one of the PC's takes a round out of a hectic complex combat encounter to kill Krin quietly = 1 corruption point for the PC.

Neither killing was done in a way which would put the blame back on the PCs, however I personally really do not like the "just in case" attitude when confronted with situations like this. I much prefer the PCs to think their way out of or into situations like this. Previously they have and they will again. Also I see this as lazy investigating.

What do other GMs think of this? How do you handle the above in your group?

I think your decision to give a corruption point is reasonable. In the case where two murders were perpetrated, I'd still only give one corruption point since it was done as part of one act/decision. Also, most careers gain the ability at some point to gain Armor of Contempt which blocks the first corruption point from an event that generates corruption. In these cases where you are warning them the act is a corrupting event and still they commit it, I'd rule that the corruption piont resulting bypasses the armor of contempt because they knowingly performed an act that would corrupt them.

While I agree that these acts should result in corruption, I don't think that it's outside of the realm of being in the inquisition and needing to remove possible threats. That means threats to your lives, threats to blowing your cover and exposing you as acolytes, etc... can and should result in the players having to make difficult decisions for their characters about how to handle these events.

I'd even go so far as to say, there is a possibility I'd hand out insanity points instead depending on how well roleplayed a scenario was. For example, some characters decide to kill of an innocent bystander that witnessed their actions as acolytes of the inquisition and could betray them later, but one character in the group objects. If this plays out and the character is horrified at the depravity of his peers, he would gain an insanity instead of corruption since he is scarred by the actions of his acolyte cohorts and not corrupted by them.

I don't think that bad acts should go "unpunished" in game just because there are no witnesses. The punishment itself is corruption because by committing these acts they are officially telling you they prefer depravity to more noble options.

Remember, the acolytes have a hard road ahead of them being members of the Inquisition. They are asked to make hard decisions on a day to day basis and the Inquisition is not a forgiving organization. Sometimes the best method is to eliminate all witnesses. In the eyes of the inquisition it can even be justified.

Innocence proves nothing is a mantra of the Inquisition, at least parts of it. It all really depends on their Inquisitor.

I think it's a viable tactic, but it is a tactic that will raise suspicion and the notice of PDF, Local Enforcers or Arbities.

Honestly, people go missing. People die. People disappear.

But when it happens often enough, or to the wrong or right people, it draws attention. Attention of the friends and loved ones of the person who dies. Attention of their various social circles. Attention of the authorities. For simple dregs and degenerates, unless they were well conected in the underworld, no one is likely going to notice at all. As the person increases in importance, the likelihood of someone taking notice increases. Beyond that there is always the concept of that one member of the Arbites, in the Divisio Immoralis perhaps, who notices a pattern, and then the heat as it were is on.

Being an inquisitorial agent has incredible powers. As long as you master backs you. However if your party causes enough headaches that can be eventually traced back to the Inquisitor, he/she may have to make a statement. And depending on the Inquisitor's temperment and ideology they may well have crossed the line.

Honestly, I would suggest mapping out the consequences of the deaths a bit. If the person is unimportant, then likely nothing happens. That being said, when nobles start dying, their families generally ask why.

First of all, I think you are doing it plain wrong with the CP points for callous killings. If this would lead to corruption, the majority of the leading figures in the Imperium would be drooling tentacled horrors.

Your problem is that your players tend to solve all the problems with the same old routine again and again and again. They kill everybody the find obnoxious. As it was already stated, make sure that at some occasions things like this fall back on them badly. There are a lot of movies where one murder to solve a problem leads to attention and more problems. Okay, those movies are campy. But find a way to turn this against the pc.

This WILL happen if a)they kill somebody well known to other b)they are the only strangers in said setting. If strangers show up and some out of your trusted group of everday faces just disappears, the fingers get pointed towards the strangers. It is easy. It is natural. It is very imperial and 40Kish.

Do it. Plan it right now and then do it. TWICE.

I wouldn't. and don't, use CP for such instances. CP's are for warp taint only and instances where the warp has a direct say in the actions of the PC -murdering to gain the attention or appease Khorne, that's corruption a plenty! Murdering to just shut someone up, no CPs as it was strictly the human element alone sans warp attention. Of course, the argument could be put forth that the murder alone would attract the attention of Khorne (him being the blood-god and all that) but that's a slippery slope. After all, the Imperium is in constant war slaughtering billions upon billions. He's the god of war so all IG's vets should be walking sacks of corruption, never mind the commissars who have a habit of murdering folks by shooting them in the back while they're running away... and then there's the question as to why the entirety of Malfie hasn't been completely corrupted by Tzeench (plots and intrigue are his domain after all). Hell, the Inquisition regularly makes use of folks for whom murder is a religious devotion and a way of praying (Death Cultists) and a lot of them are quite pure (pure murderers, but still pure). It takes the intervention of the Warp (as with the Astral Knives) to actually turn their pure acts of devotional murder into something that is corrupting.

IP's are much better suited to callous murder Whether the murder is justified or not, it's still a hard thing to do because of that nasty human trait known as empathy. People who lack empathy are some truly scary crazy bastards, a state that high amounts of IP models a lot better then high amounts of CP ;-) Besides, with IP instead of CP, you open up a wide range of possibilities when it comes to the PC which has acquired them due to wanton murder and slaughter. Their first insanity could be the idea that the dead, the ones they killed, are restless, waiting for them on the other side. They could start having nightmares of those they killed coming back for them for revenge. That is a hell of a lot of fun to GM, let me tell you. Or perhaps they start seeing those they've murdered in the faces of the living. That boy whop just looked at him briefly looked like that boy he had to deliverer the Emperors Mercy to after the psyker melted down and summoned those daemonic voices. In times of stress, they might confuse some random NPC or who-ever they are dealing with as one of the many people that they have killed come back from the grave for revenge... which could result in another murder and more IPs. They could get it in their head that the restless and vengeful dead have started possessing the living to seek revenge upon their murderer and when someone looks away too quickly from him or acts a touch off, why, they must be possessed. More murder fallows and more IP as the PCs life and mind spiral out of control into that wonderfully dark and beautiful layer of horror perfected by the likes of Poe and Hitchcock -an opportunity you should relish and not turn away!

Beyond that, the Inquisition, to my mind, is not a very soft and fluffy organization. They sometimes murder entire worlds after all and the acolytes will have a hell of a lot of blood on their hands before their careers are over. The TFTD that the =][= seems to subscribe to beyond all else would be "Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise." Meditate on that one for a bit.

Heck, in your examples, by Imperial standards, there were no innocent townspeople in #1. Once the daemon was dealt with, every man, woman, and child that was left who was at ground-0 of that warp incursion would have to be purged -there's no telling what was left to fester and grow in their soul. Remember, CP's are for PCs as they are usually stronger in mind and purpose then your run of the mill citizen -once the warp gets it's claws in them, there's no telling what could happen. They might be fine for a few days or a few years, but the daemon would be in their head, warping their dreams, calling them out to do it's bidding and, in ten years time, they could have managed to spread out, sewing the corrupting thoughts that were planted in minds and souls into all they come in contact with. Where the Inquisition could have wiped out 200 people in a purging of ground-0, they now could have 11 cities compromised, over 10,000 dead due to the actions of the survivors and the cults that grow in their wake, and no less then 5 warp incursions potentially corrupting a total of 2 million more souls who were in the area. Where 200 could have been sacrificed early (possibly saving their souls in the process), those same 200 would have to be eliminated and would have taken 2,010,000 with them that wouldn't have had to die if those 200 were purged at ground-0. Granted, those numbers are just random big crazy numbers I pulled out of no-where (that seems to be the 40k way), it is meant to show how a situation, if not nipped in the bud, can escalate, and leaving the corrupted alive is definitely not nipping said situation in the bud... that's allowing that bud to blossom Remember, "ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise." It seems to be standard Imperial procedure to exterminate anyone who was present during any kind of warp incursion. Better safe then sorry, and it's far more merciful to deliver their souls to the Emperor before they lose them and the souls of thousands more besides ;-)

Perhaps you should play up the murder for all it's worth and what it is to murder someone. If you don't want the players resorting to murder at the of a hat, make the act it self an emotionally hard thing to do. Have their targets for murder be people the players could identify with. When they do kill them, don't just have the NPC die quick and easy with a rapid gloss-over or a simple Hollywood-esq clean body dropping silently to the floor. When killed, people just don't die instantly (unless their brains are scattered across the back wall). It can take seconds to minutes for death to come, and usually not from the first blow. Make the player work for the kill -it has to be something they really want to accomplish. When murdering someone, the player must realize that their PC is well and truly murdering someone and want to continue to push forwards with it to the end. After the first stab of the sword, the victim might be fleeing, or hit the ground crawling away pleading for his or her life. The second blow would take off fingers, ripping and shredding the hand or smash through their forearm, taking most of it in the mutilating strike as the victim tries to block the blade screaming and pleading while they continue to push themselves back and away along the floor leaving a slick trail of blood and urine in their wake. The next blow might actuary do it, but make sure the PC has to get through all of the NPCs wounds and critical levels. It takes a monster to murder someone and that span of time while the PC is murdering the NPC, they are the monster. Make the player see it and feel it.

Edit: To go along with what Nakano and Gregorius have mentioned, their second instance was a Lord Krin... as in a major player in one of the most influental and powerful houses in the Calixis Sector whop have the money to have just about anything done anywhere... ya, that's going to have incredible consiquinces. His death/gone missing status will most likely be investigated with the best investigators money can by and the peretrators besset upon with the best assassins money can by. Beyond that, his death shoud have a major impact on the game world. The nobility, especialy of the major houses, are people of importance. Theyu change things by living and by dying. Taking one of them out changes the political scene permanatly, for good and ill. They've just changed that political landscape in a major way, making some folks very angry and some others possibly very happy (even if it's just as they now realize soneone else has done the their dirty-work for them). Hell, in my game, when the players killed a minor impovrished barron of House Vukpa, that set events into motion that completely altered the power structure of Nova Castilla, almost started a civel war, forced the playwers to reviel their hand and got them caught up in so much political madness that their real reason for being there quietly slipped out the back door costing them their investigation... all because they killed one impovrished barron that no-one liked.

Well if players shoot innocent bystanders because they really want to hit the daemon behind them, that's more or less quite okay and grimdark 40k'ish. But if they are just lazy roleplayers who keep blowing their covers and ask the wrong people the wrong questions, and if they negate the consequences by blasting down Imperial citizens, I feel corruption points are quite in order as well as repercussions from their Inquisitor.

I have a player who loves to 'interrogate' ... i.e. torture and the glee with which he proceeds to do it is going to give him corruption points too. Maybe it helps the Ordo's, but maybe one cannot help the Ordo's without racking up corruption at the same time in the harsh times that are the 41st millennium ...

Its a valid tactic and CP's should not be awarded. If its not a play style you like, call your players on it, if they disagree, then work out another option. 40k is not Happy Fun Teddy Bear land, its full of people dieing for no other reason then they were there and someone was in a bad mood. This is a world where your guilty when i say your guilty, and **** the evidence if its inconvient. Unlike a lot things that happen today where you know someone is dirty and can't do anything about it, the Cadre only has to prove wbhat they did was right to their Inquisitor, and no one else. If this bothers you, play RT, its much nicer

Personally I'd just plant an under cover arbite or 2 in their path. If they kill the arbiter in cold blood they are in violation of Imperial Law and then there are the Arbite Kill squad after them. Sure they could flash something IDing theselves as members of the Inquisition, but then the Inquisitor is in the position of either pissing off his allies in the Arbites, having to apolgize or allow the Arbites to punish the PCs. Guess which one he'll choose?

Besides, if life told me anything , it is that it is bloody **** hard to kill ALL of the witnesses. There seems to be always some guy who saw you lurking in the area or enter the building... In the end, you're trying to kill the witnesses, then you must do the people who saw you when you were about to kill the witnesses and so on. It takes forever to get rid of all of them.

Seriously, it is possible to pull the "no witnesses, no problem" trick for a couple of times, maybe more. But remember that NPCs are people and people are connected. When someone disappears, people start looking for him (unless he's a lonely bum or a WoW addict). If he's found murdered, there can be some kind of official investigation or maybe his friends and family (or his gang) are trying to find the bastards who did it. Maybe they pay a couple of PIs who double as hitmen to do the job. Or maybe they will confront the culprits in a public area. Not a good thing for Acolytes who try to keep their cover intact.

On the matter of the CP, my take is that CPs can only be awarded for situations that deal with the Warp. "No witchery, no CP".

I agree with Gregorius, Graver and Kyorou here. Corruption points are for meddling with "things man was not meant to know". They should never be used for mundane horrors and immoral actions alone because, as already said, a good number of Space Marines, Adepta Sororitas, Ecclesiarchy, Inquisition and Adeptus Arbites would be hopeless, irrevocably corrupt.

Imperium is not "good". It does not do good things. It kills innocents in masses. From imperial standpoint "the end justifies the means". So, you had to execute a dozen innocents to stop a daemon. Mmm-kay, lets see... the daemon would have potentially killed hundreds and corrupted thousands. You only killed a doze. Good job, keep at it. THAT is what Imperium is. That is what the 40k world is. You just have to deal with it.

Now, as far as I see, your problem is that Acolytes are falling into a pattern of solving all problems with "easy way" of gunning down people regardless of who they are or what they represent. In theory, as long as their operations succeed, they are working exactly like Imperium does. No harm there. In practice, however, it leads to boring and bad roleplaying. So, what you have to do is instead of giving them corruption points you give them the consequences. Remember, unless their Inquisitor is a bleeding heart carebear he or she will probably accept killing innocents. However, unless he is a bleeding heart carebear he or she will also probably expect them to bear the consequences. So, instead of corruption give them personal consequences:

- Unwanted police attention

- Local family/clan/tribe blood feuds

- Insanity points for seeing the orphans and grieving family left behind

- Locals who start to deliberate lie and give false information because they are so **** scared of the murdering bastards they'll say anything to get them out of their town

- Locals who flatly refuse to co-operate because they are resigned to "you'll kill us anyway"

- Locals who fight back

Generally, you can make killing innocents an undesirable, messy and ultimately a bad solution to problems. just don't make it "you can't do that because you are good guys" -issue. Because they ain't. There is no good guys in Imperium. Just desperate people trying to survive against an uncaring universe full of daemons.

Nothing to add to Graver here. There are enough ways to make killing innocents problematic without hitting everyone over the head with the warp stick and completely compromising the time-honoured Imperial Way of solving problems.

I looked up "Dark Deeds" under the Corruption section of the core rulebook. It states that evil acts must be done with the intention of furthering a malignancy, in pursuit of forbidden lore, or done to appease the demonic powers. Since the above situations described don't have anything to do with Dark Deeds, I'll have to recant my previous statement thinking corruption was warranted.

After re-reading the rules for insanity, nothing applies in that section either.

I suppose they could continue on their rampage without thought of reprisal from insanity or corruption. I do agree with others statements above, though. Eventually someone is going to notice all of these bodies are starting to accumulate. The characters may find themselves the center of an investigation. Perhaps even their Inquisitor takes notice of the carnage left in their wake and asks them to be a bit more discreet in how they are handling things.

The death of one man is a tragedy. The death of millions is a statistic. -Misattributed to Joseph Stalin

In my game the PC's where charged with the elimination of a number of high ranking, heretical Malfian power bases on that planet, as incentive to get the job as expediently as possible they had 15 months to do it, or the Segementum Obscurus High Lord was just going to get fed up and exterminatus the planet to save a whole heap of insurrection and bother later on. Being good, wholesome acolytes roped into something so far above their heads, they where trained and equipped to the finest levels that a high lord could bring in on short notice and HALO dropped into the planet from low orbit... and then it began.

Now, as much as they where unhappy about a dangerous, long term deployment in hostile territory, surrounded by arseholes and low on allies, the simple fact remains, you can off a couple of dozen members of a corrupt, decadent and thoroughly naughty society justifiably by any means possible. To save the lives of 32billion people and get the tithe flowing back to the imperium at-large where it will do far more good than what it would do into the coffers of heretical ecclesiarchy and nobility.

They succeeded, a few of them burnt quite a few fate points and a lot of innocents died along the way. Virus missile in the middle of a packed cathedral, derailing trains, hiring mercenaries to slaughter entire city blocks and finally, their 'little friend' the assassin, did what she did by assassinating the sub-sector admiral with a cannister of toxin gas while the grand cruiser was coming into dock... that didn't quite work out (some very bad NPC rolls!) and the ship hit an orbital defence station and mostly broke up in the atmosphere. But not before some bits didn't and wiped out an enitire hive, earthquakes, impact zones and tidal waves killed 6.8billion people and caused massive damage to the planets infrastructure where it will eventually go into something akin to a nuclear winter.

As much as it was something of a pyrrhic victory with that many people who didn't really need to die, it was a good outcome, 2 months early and actually a lot better than it was going to be. Money and resources would flow back to where it was needed in that sub-sector for the first time in 40 years and the ongoing development will improve the lives of many more billions... of course, they'll be haunted, (warp journeys are particually nasty) several are having a bit of an identity crisis due to hidden former identies resurfacing, some are justifying their actions and they'll be hunted for the rest of their lives by people seeking vengence to the point they've got new ID's and hidden under a polymorphine disguise on a backwater agri-world for a while.

They did make a high lord smile, which is kind of hard to do...

The collateral damage to Malfi's infrastructure and environment is regrettable, the accident which left 6.8billion dead is but a footnote in the history of the imperium - Segmentum Obscurus High Lord Tzarine.

LeBlanc13 said:

I dunno, Insanity can cover butchered bodies and the like, which if they massacre a room full of people, there will be.

I'd go with insanity, to be honest. If you are perfectly happy about murdering dozens of people, you probably aren't entirely right in the head.

MILLANDSON said:

While I don't see the rules supporting it without reading into it a bit, I agree that someone committing murders non-challantly is not right in the head.

Of course, we're applying current day value on lives, which doesn't appear to be the case in the 41st millenium. In a game where people regularly employ chainswords, I'm pretty sure a "gruesome" murder scene is worse than what we'd come to expect.

Jaded is your talent of choice here - if you've got it, you don't get IPs from such sources. If you haven't got it, you do have a chance of getting IPs from it...

Thanks for all the replies. Lots of food for thought. Some of it I'm still digesting.

Corruption points are wrong for this, that's clear. Insanity points (for non Jaded PCs) is the way to go (if warranted).

Part of this is my fault; I'm lazy. Not wanting to derail an adventure (quite often near the finale) for suddenly the local arbitrators to pop round...

A lot of the adventures I do are the "go to planet A and fix the problem then back to base" so the PCs do not often empathise with the locals and also there is the knowledge that after the end of the emergency it's back to =][= and "relative" safety and immunity. (I don't really want the Inquisitor to do any sanctioning unless really needed, these guys do use Exterminous after all!)

There are many other ways to solve this issue. Does anyone think the Talent "Enemy (House Krin)" should be awarded? (to be cashed in at a later time)

I think that enemy might be just what the doctor ordered. Long term downsides with a powerful force in the sector should have the PCs being a little more careful. At least in target selection if not methodology.

Baldrick said:

Yes, yes, and hell yes! They didn't off Young Scion Krin, Sir Three-Times-Removed Krin, or even Barnabas, Lord Krin's favoured valet. No, they bumped off someone named Lord "Freakin'" Krin. If house Krin and this Lord's supporters get to the bottom of the who's and why's of his disappearance or murder, heck, the player's Inquisitor might start taking heat -not direct heat, but he might start having a much more difficult time with matters of finances and resource acquisition that doesn't involve he himself waving his rosette about to get things done or start catching flack, heat, resentment, and political sabotage from other Inquisitors who like to cultivate and maintain good ties with the banking house (for obvious reasons). It's not wise to go pissing on one of the most powerful houses sector wide without having the clo9ut and resources to fend off what said juggernaut could do if they felt so inclined.

A lot of the adventures I do are the "go to planet A and fix the problem then back to base" so the PCs do not often empathise with the locals and also there is the knowledge that after the end of the emergency it's back to =][= and "relative" safety and immunity. (I don't really want the Inquisitor to do any sanctioning unless really needed, these guys do use Exterminous after all!

That may be an interesting point... Personally, I prefer my campaigns to stay on a single planet for quite a while (for the campaign I've planned right now, there will most likely be exactly two interstellar travels). After all, that's why acolytes are valuable to an Inquisitor: They can get to know the locals while their master likely has to roam the entire sector. Also don't forget that planets are huge things - it's easy to treat a planet as you would treat a single town in a fantasy RPG, but most planets are as large as... well, Earth. On a single one, there's easily room for more plots than you can fit into a dozen campaigns.

As for the judgement of the Inquisitor, that's for you to decide. Some may have no problems with using disproportionate measures while others prefer to enact the minimum force necessary. Just because you're prepared to burn a world if you have to doesn't mean you won't try every other solution at your disposal before resorting to it.

Cifer is completely right in "let them stay a while". This will not help to bring up local citizens against them (at least, not if they jump from city to city) but since it is not the point to make it artificially hard to kill people off, that is fine.

One of the "bad things" that will happen if they go about their work like serial killers is that the local planetary enforcers (what ever they name themselves) will be after them. At least, after they started to kill people important to a guild or similiar. Or, if they killed one commoner to much. First, this does not sound like much since they only need to wipe out their "we-are-the-Inquisition" card. But this information will spread within the enforcers. Till it reaches a crooked enforcer. And leaks. Make sure the pc learn from a gleening arch-enemy or a captured & tortured thug that they were so well prepared since they knowed they were coming.

Another thing (even on non-planetary scale) are bounty hunters . If they kill the wrong people, their will be a price on their heads. Perhaps high enough that it will be "broadcasted" to the surrounding planets of the systems. In an interstellar world, I imagine "bounty lists" to be transported by cheap "hunter guild curiers" or by enlisted hunters as they move from world to world so that a bounty is a threat even to those able to leave to the next world (and perhaps further). Or if Astropath transmission is less expensive, this will be the method.
A bounty hunter (or team of them!) interested to collect the prize might linger near space ports or "outfits" which are known to be frequented by shady people whom just dropped planet unofficially (shadow ports, known ID forgers, well known gun traders etc.). One on the trail, simply make things disrupting by having a sniper or an ambush as the pc do not like or expect it. And of course, Inquisition documents won´t help here if the bounty is "dead or alive", since dead is easier and thereby more profitable.

In order to work, both examples need the pc to leave clues or to have been seen AND the victim to be of some importance. Or a high volume of victims. But as said in an earlier post: it is very likely that the pc will have drawn attention because they were "that strangers that where seing with Joe/Joana just before"

MILLANDSON said:

I'd agree here. I think that 'tying up loose ends' is a perfectly viable tactic, and that they shouldn't be punished for it. Chances are it will come full circle in the many other ways mentioned above.

If a player walks into a bar and massacres it for fun, then I'd give insanity points. If a few innocents get hit while trying to stop a menace, I think the Inquisition will turn a blind eye. I mean, that's kind of the definition of exterminatus. "See all those people down there? Now see the cloud of dust that proves their inexistance?"

The trouble is, this is a case of PCs derailing the adventure by doing something contra-productive. If they execute a clean kill, then it's almost certainly fair to give them a decent Willpower test to resist insanity (unless Jaded), but that's about the best of which can be mechanically justified.

The only way for the GM to illustrate this as ineffective is by introducing further hurdles because of this. One of the best moments in campaigns, I've found, is when the players realise a consequence they should've thought about beforehand. Not worth derailing all of the time, but now and then, with escalating threats and foes.

As Interrogate is pretty much a central skill, penalising its use would be akin to penalising Scholastic Lore (Astromancy) or Acrobatics: they're **** fine skills, and with some people they always have one skill to solve almost every problem. (For many it's their gun.)

I would suggest that the old 'reflect the mirror' trick is best. Have them become the target of the Inquisition's own policy. Dispatch them after the Calixian pattern killings, only to reveal themselves as the perpetrators! Enemy (House Krin) seems viable, but then only if there's evidence/suspicion.

Overwhelmingly, I think, the response has to be reasonable. Yet, except for a set amount of potential for insanity gain (WP tests/Jaded to resist), I think the repercussions must come from the same source: their solution to the problem works, it's just one you don't like.

In my campaign, a bigger problem than indiscriminate killing of civilians has been the party's inclination to steal everything they can carry. Coming from a D&D background, they naturally assume they are supposed to loot everything they get their hands on. This has limited some of my scenario options- I don't dare use a wealthy nobleman for an adversary, for example, because I know that everything he owns (priceless works of art, etc.) will eventually end up in their possession. Any suggestions...?