So 96+ is an automatic miss. Overheat and jamming on auto-fire can occur on rolls less than 96, but it doesn't say those are automatic misses.

Is it possible to have a shot jam or overheat a weapon and still hit?

The short answer, no.

If a weapon overheats or jams, it stops functioning and doesn't actually shoot anything.

As to the second part of the question: on the round following a jam or overheat the weilder uses his gun as a club and attempts to bash the head of the nearest enemy in and rolls a hit with his WS, then yes a jammed or overheated weapon could still hit a target, sort of.

Definitely no on the jammed gun. I could see how an argument could be made for an overheating shot hitting, though.

Do you have any rules references to back that up?

Page 249 > Weapon James> line 6> "...in addition to being an automatic miss..."

Since Overheat is the Plasma equivalent of a Jam, no hit on overheat. Except to the wielder as per the Overheat rule.

Except, that's not what that line says. You're quote is out of context. What it says is:

"an unmodified result of 96 to 00, in addition to being an automatic miss, also indicates the weapon has jammed." The roll of "96 to 00" is the automatic miss, not the jam.

So we're back to the original question. Of course a roll of 96+ is a jam, the rules say so. They never mention what happens when you jam or overheat and roll a 91.

Best craftmanship weapons never jam or overheat. These are just counted as a miss. See the weapon craftmanship box out. So if they just miss, those that do jam or overheat should miss too.

DarknessEternal said:

You seem to be ignoring the rest of the quote that you cited that says ", also indicates the weapon has jammed." The roll of "96 to 00" is the automatic miss and the jam.

Overheat is a sub rule for Jamming that applies to weapons with the Overheat trait (Plasma). Overheat has a higher threshold than a normal Jam. If you read the whole section on Jams the reference to Overheat is in there. If you read the Overheat description in the Armory, you will see that the discharge from the weapon that overheats, instead of being directed at someone, is applied to one of the wielders arms. Since the damage is applied to the user and not a target that means that the user did not hit his target, which is often referred to as a miss.

Basic logic should tell you that if a weapon has a higher threshold for jamming, then it has a higher threshold for jamming. The rule doesn't change, you just have a wider range in which the rule can apply. An Overheat on a 91 is the same as an overheat on a 99.

If this isn't a good enough answer then I would suggest emailing the Devs with the Rules Questions link at the very bottom of the page to get an answer directly from them.

Little Dave said:

Thanks, that's an oblique, but definitive, reference.

As a interesting reference in 40k you could overheat and hit the target.

So we play that you can both overheat and hit the target on a 91-95. This makes the decision whether to drop the gun more interesting -do i take the damage so i can kill the bad guy. its a miss if you drop it

I don't mind the idea of a weapon both hitting and jamming, or hitting and overheating. It is possible for a machine gun to jam on the last round of the burst, just as it is possible to jam on the first, second, fifth, or however many shots it fire. Ditto for Plasma Guns overheating - nothing to say it can't fire out the bolt of plasma and still cook itself (and the user!).

BYE

H.B.M.C. said:

The problem I see with weapons jamming and still hitting is deciding which shots hit. Lets say you were using an autogun on full auto, rolled a 96, but had your BS+Modifiers high enough so that you scored two hits if it weren't for the jam. How you decide if those hits still apply without slowing the battle down ?

The best option I can think of is still going to involve a lot rolls or dice of various sizes. I don't know if 3,5,7 or 9 sided dice exist, but my method will need you to simulate them*. This seems like it is far to complex a method for such a rare occurrence.

*The easiest way would be to roll a dice with more sides, but reroll every time a larger number comes up. But that will slow things down with even more dice rolls.

Overheating weapons are much easier. If the character chooses to take the damage, then all the shots come out of the gun as normal. But if you allow this then the gm might want to think about where the shot goes if the weapon is dropped, as it is still going to come out of the gun as the gun tumbles to the ground.

Bilateralrope said: