pistoliers--how much can they escape from?

By alafter, in Warhammer Invasion Rules Questions

Empire pistoliers

1) assigned damage in battle.

Say damage was assigned to the pistoliers. Then, before applying, resource was spent moving the pistolier away from the zone the pistolier was involved in a battle. Does the assigned damage become illegal and vanish? Or does it follow the pistolier and kills him later?

2) cards that targeted the pistoliers

Say someone targeted the pistoliers in kingdom with an action X. If the pistolier moved away from the zone, does the action X become illegal because it specifically targeted THE pistolier in THE kingdom zone, and since THE pistolier no longer existed in the kingdom zone by the time action X was to be resolved, action X just becomes illegal and vanish?

It's going to "chase" the pistoliers in both cases. The only time they can escape that kind of thing is if there is a targeting restriction on the effect, e.g. Blood for the Blood God, which requires the target to be in the battlefield.

Even if there is a zone restriction, like Blood for the Blood God, once it is assigned, it follows the unit no matter where it goes in the "play" area. If you were to return it to hand (or send it to the discard pile, although that would be redundant), then it leaves "play" and the damage vanishes.

Hurdoc said:

Even if there is a zone restriction, like Blood for the Blood God, once it is assigned, it follows the unit no matter where it goes in the "play" area. If you were to return it to hand (or send it to the discard pile, although that would be redundant), then it leaves "play" and the damage vanishes.

I don't think that's right. Legality of the target is checked at declaration and resolution, so if the target has moved, the effect fizzles. Under "Illegal Target" in the FAQ:

"A target can become illegal if it is removed from play,
if it is removed from the zone specified in the ability ,
or if any specific characteristics on the card that were
targeted have changed."

(emphasis mine)

If you attach a card that says "Attach to unit in Battlefield only", and then the card moves into another zone, does it lose the attachment? Something like Griffon Standard (Attach to target Empire unit in your battleield. Attached unit gets +P for each Empire unit in this zone).

I don't think it does because the card check only occurs at the time of its play. In the same fashion, once the damage is assigned, I don't see how moving it anywhere does anything to it. If you moved it just before the assign phase, then of course its an illegal target.

I'm not 100% sure but that's how I would (and do) play it.

Dam and Clamatius are right re: Blood for the Blood God.

An "attach to unit in battlefield only" attachment would check the status of the unit on which it is played 1) when the attachment is played, and 2) when it resolves. So, if you for some reason (perhaps Blood for the Blood God) activated the Pistoliers in response to your own Knight Training 'targeting' the Pistoliers, Knight Training would fizzle once it resolved. Once the attachment resolves and enters play, it can be moved around just as Ironclaw's Horde could be moved by a Forced March.

Uhm, I think we are all saying the same thing. Both my posts mention the damage already being assigned to the unit. Of course, if you activated them in response to Blood FTBG (before the damage got assigned), they would no longer be in the zone because in response effects occur in backwards order. I was confused by the question.

On further thought, my possibiliy is impossible anyway since noncombat damage like BfTBG does not have an action window between being assigned and being applied, so either you activate the unit effect in response (in which case the unit moves away and becomes an illegal target), or you activate it after BfTBG resolves (which is impossible because the unit may be dead). happy.gif

Quick question, its unrelated, but can toughness cancel all damages except for uncancellable damages?

Yes, but be careful that you don't miss uncancellable damage that isn't called exactly that. For example, Counterstrike is uncancellable.

Hurdoc said:

Uhm, I think we are all saying the same thing. Both my posts mention the damage already being assigned to the unit. Of course, if you activated them in response to Blood FTBG (before the damage got assigned), they would no longer be in the zone because in response effects occur in backwards order. I was confused by the question.

On further thought, my possibiliy is impossible anyway since noncombat damage like BfTBG does not have an action window between being assigned and being applied, so either you activate the unit effect in response (in which case the unit moves away and becomes an illegal target), or you activate it after BfTBG resolves (which is impossible because the unit may be dead). happy.gif

Or you could just trigger the ability AGAIN in response and move them back once the effect fizzles... for jerk points. Pistoliers might be the best first turn unit Empire has.