Being a turret-less vehicle, like the Stug, I hope that Bill can get them to include that that rule where the SU-122 cannot perform a Fire and Move; like the Stug and Jagepanzer is supposed to have in the Normandy expansion.

Also, I sure hope it does not get the over-run ability! The SU-122 does not have any MGs! In fact, the whole series - the SU-85, SU-100, SU-122 all based off the T-34 hull - did not have any MGs because it wasn't meant to be used to over-run infantry, instead they were purposely designed to destroy tanks.

The SU-122 was armed with a 122mmm M-1938 howitzer though, and not a 122mm AT gun. So it was used against bunkers and such, but when needed it can fire at tanks. The SU-85 and SU-100 were the Tank Destroyer with the higher velocity guns. The SU-100 being a little better, though its ROF was slower.

It needs to be noted that the SU-122 was being replaced by the more versitile SU-85 in late 1943., and the SU-100 replacing the SU-85 in early 1945. The SU-85 (and SU-100) prove to be an effective support tank when deployed in conjunction with the T-34. When SU-85's were employed as individual units, they fell pray to German anti-tank teams and guns.

Ray,

I think the vehicle included might actually be the JSU-122, which was an AT platform.

BJaffe01 can confirm this?

Bazookajoe said:

Yes, there is a difference between the SU-122 and the JSU-122 (AKA ISU-122).

Also, didn't the JSU-122 have either a 122mm howitzer or a 122mm AT gun? I know the JSU-152 had that big howitzer, but now I have to look up the JSU-122 as I recall there were a couple of different guns installed on this tank. Also, if I recall correctly, only a few JSU-122 were available by late 1943, and it wasn't until 1944 that they had more of these heavy support tanks. When I get home tonight, I'll have a look-see

RayGuns said:

The SU-122 had a 122 howitzer.

For the JSU-122, most sources (all the ones I could find) give it only AT guns, albeit either the A-19S (first models...this was the towed version) or the D-25S (same one used one the JS-2 with better penetration and ROF). BJaffe01 stated that about 600 JSU-122 had been produced by Kursk and my guess would be with the A-19S gun. Also, only the gun mantlet had the 7.75" armour on the front. The remaining front plate only had 120mm.

The JSU-152 had the beastly howitzer.

Oh... I wished for a mobile artellery peace with indirect fire ability and 'area attack'... But with an AT the question arises, how is the SU-122 different from the other tanks?

If the expansion has some massive tank battles (Kursk?) the USSR will need something to take on the German heavies. Just a guess. I suppose with a little imagination (and a modified barrel) it could double as a JSU-152.

Not sure that there will ever be mobile artillery. They have long enough range to be used as off board artillery support like in the card decks. As it is mortars can fire over a large enough portion of the board anyway. Any artillery would be able to shoot anywhere, so it might as well be off board.

Maybe with the new combined strategy decks it will be more common for artillery support to be included in a battle.

actually the Russians ne Soviets found the 122 at gun mounted on jsu/isu 122's more effective than the 152 which had a slow rate of fire and the tanks couldn't carry many total rounds. su-85/100's where stop gaps until isu 122/152's where ready kind like js-1 untill enough js-2's where available

BJaffe01

BJaffe01 said:

Bill,

Great info. Wasn't the SU-100 gun slightly better than the ISU-122 with a higher muzzle velocity (better armor penerattion?).

Here's a quote from wikipedia regarding the SU/ISU-152:

"As a heavy assault gun, the ISU-152 was an extremely valuable weapon in urban combat operations such as the assaults on Berlin, Budapest and Königsberg. The vehicle's excellent armour protection finally provided the 152.4 mm platform with good protection from most German anti-tank guns, allowing it to advance into the face of direct anti-tank fire, while the huge low velocity high-explosive rounds were excellent at blasting open even the most heavily fortified and reinforced enemy strongpoints. Such actions would be much more dangerous and much less effective for a conventional towed artillery piece, with their high crew exposure and low mobility, or even a tank, with their smaller main guns. When supporting tanks, the usual tactics of the ISU-152 were to be used in the second line of the attack order, 100 to 200 meters behind the attacking tanks, which were usually IS tanks with equal mobility."

It carried both AP and HE ammo, but the shear blast force of the HE was enough to knock out Tigers, etc. WRT it's use as mobile artillery, it was sometimes used as such, but not typical due to low ROF and only medium range.

Again, the JSU-122 model could be used as an SU/ISU-152. Yikes!

yeah the isu-152 was really an assault tank for fortified areas but yes the he round knocked out Tigers. the su-100 at's round was good but they also had issues killing tigers.

BJaffe01