Hey,

Something I think is quite strange that I wouldn't mind hearing what others think but if you follow the description text for bolt weapons in FS and if you have looked at how bolt weapons are described in DH/RT, non-Astartes bolt weapons use a smaller calibre shell than Astartes bolt weapons (except one bolt pistol in Inquisitor's Handbook). Is it therefore more realistic to say that the Marines in FS and OE cannot replenish their ammo as they have no access to Astartes compatible bolt shells as it is unlikely a unremarkable Agri-world would just happen to have Astartes equipment just lying around?

I know I will allow my players when I run it to be able to replenish their ammo, otherwise they will have to club everything to death after a couple of fights, but its interesting to think about.

Contextually I'd say you're right, there is no reason to expect that the marines can scavenge ammo from the world, but if you were really concerned about ammo supplies you could say that the pod they land in has an ammo store...or add a new twist in the form of a resupply pod that dropped when they did, but landed off-target and they have to fight their way too it, find it, or stumble upon it...whatever fits.

I love the idea of a resupply pod. I think I'll use that...

RenoDM said:

Plot twists and complications are fun!

Actually, you could say that the ship released a number of resupply pods scattered around Lordsholm before it detonated so then the players need to have some consideration for ammuntion scarcity without leaving them to kill Tyranid Warriors with the butts of their boltguns because they ran out of ammo.

Aye, really as GM you have any number of excuses at your disposal. Of course, if you wanna be smarmy, you could always have the players resort to using heavy stubbers, autoguns, etc that they can scavenge from the PDF if they run out of Astartes kit. That's happened once or twice in novels.

"Fear the Astartes and their...stubbers????"

I agree that the most logical solution would be scattered resupply pod launched with the kill team when the ship was destroyed. It fits quite well in the Astartes modus operandi of deep striking.

Deathseed said:

I could imagine a game where the Marines would be surrounded by guys with stubbers and the like and the Marine walks up, snatches the weapons out of their hands Terminator-style and then bends it like it was piece of wire.

During the introduction I created a story that had a much larger group of SM in the Kill Squad. During the landing the pod the players was in was hit by a SAM and most of the SM inside were thrown out, the pod managed to crash land with the players the sole survivors.

During the adventure they will come across these bodies and will have the opportunity to re-supply on a small scale.

Tam

having ran the adventure last night (they about 1/2 way through) ammunition has not been a problem, though they want more grenades.

Full auto on a bolter costs 4 shots and can reduce a horde by 4 magnitude. with 28 shots (assuming no jams and decent rolls) starting with 3 clips means they can 84 magnitude worth of horde at max, avereging about 60 in the main.3 grenades counts for another 15 more or less.

If one of them is the devastator it goes up more.

What I found in the group of 3 (Space Wolf, Ultra Marine and Dark Angel) the Dark Angel engaged totally in melee just using his power fist and grenades, whilst the 2 tactical marines utilised full auto grenades and melee - basically conserving ammo as they suspect they are not going to replenish it on this whole of a world.

They are also collecting PDF support through impressive roleplay and some tremendous heroics, which they are saving to attack the rebel strongpoints once they clearly identify the location of the brood lord (they know he is somwhere near the promethium works). They know there will be some thick fighting to come and will need the pdf support to conserve their ammo.

Basically the lack of ammo means they will have to make tactical decisions rather then just mowing through civilians and rebels alike.

Give them more ammo!

I imagine the marines have a whole stack of ammo for their missions (I can not see them relying on chance to resupply).

The problem is where to store it all: I shoved a stack of mags behind the back pack, in the lower back. You can see an image on my site: Ammo Storage

Fully loaded this gives them 8 mags in storage and one in the weapons for 9 mags in total.

To access the mags the marines operate a buddy system, where the marine behind takes from the marine in front as they leap-frog forward raining constant bolter shells on the enemy. They can access their own mags too, they 'pop down' for easy reach.

All very unofficial (and if you read the rest of that page you'll see how unofficial it really is!)

Philip

From France (excuse my spelling mistake)

I will be the GM for final sanction with 7 players and i have think about it. I will use a lots of hordes and genestealers so i will give them one supply point for astartes, and a lot of "supply point" for human-size weapons.

Imperial Stores : supply for krak and frag grenades, some weapons for human (RPG, Stubber, Shotgun, chainsword, shock maul,... -10 to Ws or BS when used by an astartes).

A crashed Thunderhawk : the player's Thunderhawk, not ready for the launch during the kraken's attack, so they were gone to the pod. Lots of ammo in here, maybe some survivors who need help (like serfs and tech-priest). During the Fall of the frigate, the thunderhawk try to escape without being fully prepared and was hit by some pyro-spore, he's crash near the Spaceport.

Then in Oblivion's edge, they will use the thunderhawk for resupply at avalos spaceport.

I'm not sure after that, maybe the Imperial troopers will carry some ammo for them, or some supply servitor will follow the squad.

LordNikro said:

It is unlikely they would have access to a Thunderhawk, as Thunderhawks would normally be based on Space Marine ships, which don't show up until the end of Oblivion's Edge. The Kill-team are launched from a regular Imperial Navy ship.

Aye, Thunderhawks are used to transport several squads worth of Space Marines, not one group of 4-6. They'd either use drop-pods, or Stormraven gunships.

carrotcolossus said:

I was thinking that an imperial navy frigate will not have pod either (never seen fluff about that in my Gi codex, but it's not a Navy codex), so it was a spec-ops frigate for deathwatch use only. The frigate's Valkyrie bay was replaced by a Thunderhawk... But you're right, it's a bit huge for just some marines.

Storm ravens are a good idea, or just pod and supply pod... Less complicated.

Thanks.

Given the scale the Imperium produces and stockpiles war material, I decided that the Imperial Ammo Stores does have ammo for the marines. Why? For just such a situation as this. The Imperium is in an unending state of war, and hot spots can spring up anywhere. If the Astartes need to deploy to a world, it is quite possible for them to do so on short notice and without proper supplies. Even if they have proper supplies to start a campaign, ammo runs low. Local sources for key supplies can be essential.

It's not enough to run a company for a sustained battle, but there is enough ammo and equipment in a sealed armory for a small force of marines to at least renew their basic loads. I've ruled the supply of Kracken Bolts is very limited (perhaps a single magazine for each of the tactical marines, and the presence of such ammo is unusual), but there is plenty of standard bolter and heavy bolter ammo. They will also be able to renew their supplies of grenades.

With the forces attacking the stores, I'm not going to be just giving the ammo away, but it will be possible for them to renew their supplies.

Of course with the fact that Oblivions Edge has just been released, being able to resupply is even more important

Jalinth said:

I love the reasoning behind this. Very good show.

So where does it specify how much ammo, the characters start with?

It doesn't. I read a suggestion somewhere here that 3 mags for each weapon. That is what I went with. It seems to be working so far.

Rogue Trader also suggests the rule of 3 for reloads.

on the sheet it says what they have, dont forget there is an ammo dump in the first one.

Jalinth said:

I like it. Something I love about the 40k universe is the dysfunction of sheer bureacratic incompetence on a galactic scale. This fits in well with the 'one size fits all' approach to supply in the Administratum.

Jalinth said:

Like Carrot said, that's not a bad rational and fits the administrative nonsense the Imperium is known for. It could also be rationalized that the world being fairly well established, it's bound to have one or more Arbites precincts, and it is well known that they stock a significant storehouse of munitions. The composition of the precincts is usually pretty hide-bound to standard template methodologies that the Imperium is so fond of, so they could have a wide range of firepower just waiting for loyalist use. Of course, by this point in the insurrection, that firepower may be in the possession of the enemy

Plenty of possible answers to the situation, just depends on how generous (or sadistic) the GM feels.

Another thing that occurred to me is that there might be room for ammo stores in the pod under the duck-board at the marines feet. Granted that's awfully close to the retrorockets and not exactly where you want explosive things in a machine that crashes into things for a living, soooooo maybe not so much.

I still like my resupply idea, seems like the sort of thing marines would do, and I have some vague memory of the Quake space marines doing something like that in the FPS games.

I mainly like it to give the marines another objective to consider when trying to liberate a falling city.

"Conserve your ammo until we have secured the objective brothers."

"And once we secure the objective?"

"PURGE THE UNCLEAN!"

your right it does not say how many clips ......

I've been trying to ask the Mod Ross to clarify this, but they don't seem inclined to do so...