My brothers and I had a couple of conversations that led to some interesting overlap. We were talking about how Protection decks are good at what they do but are pretty boring (to us). Too much reaction, not enough action. Simultaneously, there are very few cards that stop treacheries and one of those cards is in Protection but ends up being so costly that it is not worth playing (Get Behind Me)

What I mean by cost is...yeah, it only costs one resource but if you don't have a resource generator down, you lose 2 cards from your hand which, being on hero side is likely around 5 so now you are down to 3. The opportunity cost of holding on to Get Behind Me (GBM) means you lose the use of that card for however many turns you hang onto it before a treachery worth playing it on comes up. So if it is say...3 turns before you play it, that is total of 5 resource cost and there are very few treacheries that come up I cannot handle with 5 resources. Hence it becomes a bad card in a vacuum (you can always build a deck around any particular card and there may be a hero or build that wants to hold cards)

Meanwhile, a hero I have often struggled to come up with a fun build for has been Black Panther. I have had good builds, effective builds...but they were not particularly fun as Black Panther. Probably my most fun version was the one that got Goliath to do 20-25 points of damage multiple times. But that build can be done better by others...it is not specific to Black Panther and there is also some thought it interferes with what he does best.

So I started thinking that having built effective but not fun protection decks, effective but not fun Black Panther decks, maybe there was something there. I started thinking about Black Panther's strengths: he can deal with a lot of small to modest threats, whether with damage or small amounts of threat itself. When he gets multiple Wakanda Forevers off in the same turn he can do shockingly huge amounts of damage although it feels small as 4 pips is the most at one go. Second, he is resource rich as Vibranium is so strong for him.

So the idea was born; build a version of Black Panther designed to get as many cards on the board long term and enhance card draw to try to get multiple Wakanda Forevers off every turn. To this end, protection offers a lot of value. I don't want to use the cards that need to be in hand to be valuable...no Desperate Defense, Expert Defense, GBM...but Defensive Stance, Armored Vest, Indomitable, Unflappable, Energy Barrier, Electrostatic Armor...ah yeah, come on down!!!

Additionally, Protection has a great card for Black Panther in Brother Voodoo. With a thinned down deck, his search for an event in the top 5 cards only has one event to search for...Wakanda Forever but he is going to find one pretty much every time.

With Avengers Mansion, Golden and Nick Fury I have a ton of flat out card draw (not to mention Unflappable).

Knowing how many resources I have, I filled it with expensive allies...Brother Voodoo, Luke Cage, Iron Fist, War machine, Lockjaw (who serves double purpose with his ability to be a resource and get played in the same turn) Heimdall, Nich Fury...only Clea and Shuri are cheaper.

The biggest problem I have is a weird one: with Armored Vest and 1-3 Energy Barriers out, I might not be damaged all the time thus invalidating Vibranium Suit...a first world problem to be sure. Needing to be damaged but defending too well to take it.

So my brother ran unaltered Black Widow and I played him for our first test run and he had Klaw already out so Klaw it was.

Sometimes a test run goes too good. I had Golden City and a piece of armor in my opening hand, with his ability I got 2 pieces down. By turn three I had all four pieces of his armor down and was doing multiple Wakanda Forevers. In less time than it takes to type it I had Avengers Mansion, Helicarrier, Armored Vest, Electrostatic Armor, allies, Unflappable, Indomitable, an evergy barrier...I had at one point I think 17 cards out and was blasting 2-3 Wakanda Forevers every turn but only use some of it as there was no threat to handle, no minions alive and I could not heal as I was taking no damage....

Klaw had one o those classic 2-3 surge on each of us, put out side schemes and you are looking at 2-3 minions each, I think there were 4 side schemes, might have been three, each with 6 or more threat. In one turn there was nothing on the table for Klaw.

It was as good a first run as possible. I plan to play ithis deck through my testing gauntlet; running through every scenario on the game basic, then advance, then Heroic 1 and more and am looking at: Taking out 1-2 Med Teams, taking out iron Fist (I don't want the villain stunned, I need to take damage), taking out an energy barrier (same reason) or 2. But I would want to put in 2 cost or less cards that stay on table. Plan to start a sideboard of cards i think might work. Not needing more resources, never felt resource poor so have some room and options. I often have Black Widow being played by someone in the group or that ally would be plan 1, 1a and 1b but I like this problem; a deck working exactly as designed that has room for improvement.

For the first time I have a Black Panther deck I enjoyed playing. For the first time I have a Protection deck I enjoyed playing.

Not sure there is any point to this post, just wanted to share. Hope it had some value

I really like the idea of BPP but only seriously tried it when I had just Core + Ms. Marvel. It was okay then and I figured it would be better when the aspect grew, which it really did with Dr. Strange so I'm glad to see someone's gotten good use from this hero/aspect combo. BP definitely does his best work when you can reliably play a Wakanda Forever or two every turn. I highly recommend a copy of Target Acquired for one of those 'stay on the board' cards, especially for Protection. It's a unique effect that's nice to have around.

GBM is not great outside of Spider-Man since he gets a card back from being attacked, and even then I'd only run one or maybe two copies as a backup for Enhanced Spider-Sense. Nerves of Steel from Quicksilver's pack will help with some of the other good reactive cards in Protection but not GBM since it's not a Defense card.

8 hours ago, darthweasel2 said:

Not sure there is any point to this post, just wanted to share. Hope it had some value

It absolutely was. I enjoyed reading it very much. I'm also trying to make protection work in a fun way, my current Ant Man protection deck is interesting but just doesn't do it for me if you know what I mean. Felt the same wasy about Cap Protection.

I always enjoy it when people share ideas that they ran with, and it's all the more fun when those ideas work out. Please keep sharing!

I know these forums are shutting down, will you be posting somewhere else? I haven't decided where to go for Champions LCG discussion but I love posts like this (even if I'm back on a LOTR LCG kick) and would gladly follow!

did run it a half dozen games last night. basic Rhino is not really a good test but it worked out as despite a full hand mulligan, I only started with the piece I could search for. Nevertheless pretty easy game. Expert got more interesting when I ran into Exhaust (surge, exhaust your hero)/villain attacks/shadows of the past in the same turn but was able to overcome that easily.

Interestingly enough, I have found I really want Shadows of the Past to come out early. Killmonger is not affected by BPs stuff so I can just leave him there for 5 turns. Sounds weird, but I NEED him. Because of the deck design, I can easily stop virtually all damage, but to maximize damage output I need to be using the Vibranium suit. I had several turns where neither Tactical nor Vibranium fired as there was no threat and I was fully healed.

But then came heroic and I loved Shadows less as all three games it hit me the first two turns and I definitely realized quickly this deck does not have enough threat redeuction to play heroic solo.

On to Klaw and it works decent...struggles early, I cannot afford to stay down the 2 turns to get stuff rolling and a Clea is nice to clear his side scheme, so it starts slower but still works as intended.

I typically get 7-9 cards on table first time through my deck and with Nick Fury being in the deck, and usually having Golden City, Helicarrier and Avengers Mansion down, I have so much card draw I am going through the deck every 2-3 turns. The extra encounter card is a trivial matter at that point.

So the deck shows promise, will start on Ultron tonight probably. Definitely a lot of fun.

As to the posting...I don't currently plan to. I did read the thread about my contention over on BGG and will continue to read there and a few other places but it is not my cup of tea for participation unfortunately. On top of that, golf season is approaching so I will not be online much anyway 🙂 Plus my youngest brother and his wife have their first child due in a few weeks so I will be doing more uncle stuff huzzah. But I hope the game keeps rolling for many, many years and looking forward to getting Wasp Friday and starting a run through of all the scenarios with Ant Man

so far running it two handed with a very sub-par second deck (Leadership deck with 1 signature and 4 leadership allies...not nearly enough. I have more things to put on allies than I have on allies...this is a function of keeping every hero built all the time and at some point you just run out of good cards)

Yesterday made it up through the two Green Goblin scenarios. I was doing everyt scenario in order first standard, then expert, then Heroic, but around Ultron I started just doing expert so I will have time to finish before Wasp comes out tomorrow hopefully)

Anyhow, Mutagen Formula was particularly funny. On top of the 2 encounter cards and minions you get on stage 1, I got so many surges I ended up with I think 9 encounter cards first turn. When I flipped him to stage three, both decks happened to run through their decks (for BPP, that is expected...I had something like 22 cards on the table, and between Nick Fury, Avengers Mansion, and Golden City it is not unusual to go through the deck every 2 turns or less) I got 5 encounter cards per deck and again had some surges. Nothing quite like going from clear enemy board to multiple side schemes, multiple minions, being exhausted...lol

The good sign is by game end BPP actually was sitting on more HP than he started, had full board of great allies (War Machine, Luke Cage, Heimdall...yes, I have that many resources), had cleared off all the side schemes and minions and could have comfortably done an extra 10 damage if needed....it takes a bit to get the engine going but once it is, it can handle pretty much anything. Really liking this build. I am thinking of taking out a second Med Team to put in a cheap ally if/when one comes out. Either that or putting in the basic resource generator that gives science so I can use Black Widow without using card from hand. So far the only resource generator I use is Helicarrier and it is never a problem when I have 3 Wakanda Forevers in hand.

Some of the stuff I mentioned previously...I like keeping a minion engaged and not defending him so I have 4ish damage to use with Vibranium Suit. Kind of fun killing minion for free with Retaliate and him having done me favors by damaging me. And with Wakanda Forevers and those allies, I don't care about being exhausted on my turn so can easily defend for others. I usually have Armored Vest and Elecrostatic Armor out (along with a couple Energy Barriers0 not for their use but to get them out of my deck, so defending big hits is laughably easy.

It is so different to my normal playstyle where my goal is to have no threat and no damage that it has completely freshened the game for me yet again.

well, ended up playing 8 solo games mixture of standard, expert and heroic, then 14 games 2 handed working my way through all the scenarios mostly on expert, couple heroic and I definitely like this build

I have found that one of the biggest problems is a first world problem; once I have the deck thinned down, I am so strong defensively that often Vibranium Suit is wasted. I deliberately take undefended attacks, keep minions in play I could easily take out, etc just so it is of some value.

The other problem is the deck sings with Golden City and Avengers Mansion, but I seldom need to flip down. It is hard to motivate to flip down for the bonus 4 cards (over 2 turns) but when I do it is always worth it so I force myself to but I could legit be in hero mode pretty much 100% of the time once I get the armor down.

He does not do huge amounts of damage in one go but he can do 20 points in one turn with 3 Wakanda Forevers...it feels smaller because the most you do at a time is 4 (1+1+4x3=18+2 for BP himself) but at the same time, it has so many resources it is not unusual for me to have Heimdall, Luke Cage and War Machine out so there is another 7...so he ends up doing a ton of damage, it just isn't "8 for giant stomp, 8 for Giant Stomp, 4 for Ant Man attack" and can happen 2,3, 4 turns in a row.

Conversely, if I need thwart I can use Tactical to take off 2,4,6 threat a turn, more with the aforementioned heroes or Brother Voodoo who I like to get in and out as quick as possible for his ability to go get another Wakanda Forever, and I love bringing in Nick Fury, draw 3, thwart or attack as needed, get out.

Overall the deck is a lot of fun to play and has room to get better. I would take out Armored Vest for card draw or some permanent card that stays down, take out another med team and maybe two for resource or card draw generators or maybe another ally as they come available.

So now off to purchase Wasp and start an Ant Man-Wasp run through huzzah

okay, so this happened, the ultimate turn for this build; playing 4 player, with Hulk, Spider Woman and Ant Man as the other three, playing Mutagen formula.

The Hulk Player, playing a deck designed to stay on Hero form the entire game, was flipping every turn for...reasons.

The Ant Man player, playing a leadership deck designed to mitigate threat, use Allies to defend and do huge bursts of damage with Goliath played I think 3 allies in the entire game and was on Giant side the majority of the game (it actually worked well, it just in no way, shape or form resembled the way the deck is designed)

So one one turn we have cleared the board but 2 of us have gone through our decks, I had defeated the minion that dealt me an encounter card. We flip Goblin during the turn, garnering each of us 2 more cards. By the time we are done surging and what have you, we have gone through something like 15 cards. Hulk is down to 4 HP, has 3 minions, Spider Woman has 2, Ant Man 3, I have 3, we have multiple side schemes and the main scheme went from zero to verging on flipping.

Spider Woman does work, eliminates all the side schemes. Ant Man takes out the Goblin Knight and does 1 to each minion with a Giant Stomp. We still have 10 minions on the table and some threat.

Golden City, Avengers Mansion, Nick Fury, Brother Voodoo, and 5 Wakanda Forevers Later...behild the power of 5 Wakanda Forevers. The board is almost completely cleared of minions (I saved one Hulk Minion with 1 HP so Hulk could Moment of Triumph him back to full health). The main scheme has zero threat.

I had played 3 Wakanda Forevers numerous times. A couple times I had played 4. This was the first time I had gotten to play five and it was epic. I had not told everyone I was sitting on 3, got one with Nick and Brother Voodoo gave me the rest. So even after Spider Woman had drilled the side schemes, and Ant Man took out is biggest threat, then had to flip and the board looked awful. As the Wakandas hit the table and problems disappeared it just got better and better.

This was the deck at its finest so I did what any intelligent person would do...solved three problems at once. I was stuggling to find Wasp build I wanted to play, the two people who have played Hawkeye found him squishy, and I usually don't like playing Aggression so I took down this deck, the Justice Hawkeye deck, and ported everything green over to Hawkeye, moved the justice to Wasp, and turned Black Panther aggression...but I know I now have a very fun, very effective Black Panther build I can go back to at will. I just will never again do 40 damage in one turn so...time to go!