Hey you. Yeah, you there, feeling punished because you didn't exercise shrewd target prioritization on a crew carrying, medium-base chassis. Just stop with all of that nonsense. Sloane's been out for two years. She won something. Some out of print ships and a non second release edition expansion ship crew upgrade Did A Thing. No big deal. Sky isn't falling. You got this. FFG won't let that stuff fly for long, since there is no money to be made anymore off of them anyways. There's plenty of stuff that that "punishes" an opposing player for playing the game. She's priced just fine for what she does, and those silly TIE Aggies are just fine too. I want you to get your dusty butt off the canvas, crack some knuckles, and get back in the game. You got this. Now go get her.

That's right, Cloaker is back to being an optimist again. If I can get past my original trilogy gets screwed by new faction whininess, you can hunt down a **** Reaper. Now get to it.

Peace.

Most forum dwellers: “if it contradicts how I like to play xwing, it’s broken and must be removed!”

Wrong: there are multiple ways to Play, and the correct answer is to play smarter and around the other pieces you see across the table. The only time something is truly broken is when there just are impossible match ups, and those have been handled pretty well (even if it took a bit for nantex fixing to come in).

Wanna get this on the table...

Swarmet of Legend

(54) Soontir Fel [TIE/in Interceptor]
(2) Daredevil
Points: 56

(47) Captain Feroph [TIE Reaper]
(9) Admiral Sloane
Points: 56

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
Points: 22

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
Points: 22

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
Points: 22

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
Points: 22

Total points: 200

I just like having SOMETHING besides multiple copies of the same chassis doing the same thing. Efficiency smefficiency..... 😛

Anyone have the original list to which the OP is referring? I’m interested to see it.

Sloane is undercosted IMO. Especially given the cheap generics we have now. NPE is debatable, and likely depends on if you brought Silencers or Awings versus bringing, say, Nantex to battle Sloane.

Why should the nerf bat be spared here when it's hit every other faction's consistent high-placing squads (that I can think of)?

Not broken or OP or ruining anything. Maybe a little better than cards a few points more expensive? Could be.

Is Sloane better than 7th Sister crew? 5th Brother Gunner? Emperor Palpatine? I'm kind of inclined towards yes.

Not a huge difference, though. No panic, no problem, no urgent need for a nerf.

But she's also a 9 point crew with an archetype-enabling large area buff, with both offense and control elements. That's a heck of a bargain at 9, and probably still playable at 12.

Was she rare before? Sure, but I'm inclined to think it was more a case of folks just not being interested in playing Sloane lists. There were Sloane Swarms since day 1, even if they weren't the most popular, and they've never been too bad. Not always top tables, but again, I think that's got more to do with the strength of other stuff (early 2e was the Phantom Menace), and folks just not being interested in loose swarms.

//

To be sure, however, FFG gotta leave the aggressors alone.

She ain't no Spamtex that's for diggity.

I wouldn't cry if she ends up in the low double digits though.

I have played Sloane lists a few times.

I do find some lists have such a hard time against them, especially as you get the rerolls when ever some one is stressed, so it makes your opponent have second thoughts about K turns, red man and linked actions.

Which again can have massive effects on ships. I have had good people not enjoy games against it, which yes it is at a tournament however I never like to have opponents not enjoy the game.

this is on top of the large range reroll it offers and it offers a massive force multiplier when ships are stressed. I think it is better then howl runner and look how costly howl runner is

then if you do engage and destroy a ship you are double stressed so can't even get rid of the stress next turn.

Now at 9 points it is a steel.

it really forces you to shot and just shot the Sloane carrier first, which is some times easier said then done.

I do think it needs a points increase, I would still use it at 14 -15 points, easily in a swarm list.

I like the concept of the card and think on second review you could rain in certain parts of Sloane and make it cheaper and more fun.

for example I would love them to add:-

when a friendly ship range 0-3 is stressed when defending the attacker can reroll one attack dice.

when a enemy ship is destroyed at range 0-3 the attacker gains 2 stress.

so its a double edge sword so effects you and the opponent, not sure on costs or if it would even be useable, its just some thing that may be interesting.

Doing what one needs to do to win the game incurring a bad outcome is something of a problematic experience that not everyone is going to handle with poise. Sloane and Hate are considerably annoying cards in my opinion that challenge my ability to separate emotions from intellectual detachment. There is an aspect of being forced to step into the trap or you can't win the game. We should not fault players for finding that prospect disagreeable.

19 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Not broken or OP or ruining anything. Maybe a little better than cards a few points more expensive? Could be.

Is Sloane better than 7th Sister crew? 5th Brother Gunner? Emperor Palpatine? I'm kind of inclined towards yes.

Not a huge difference, though. No panic, no problem, no urgent need for a nerf.

But she's also a 9 point crew with an archetype-enabling large area buff, with both offense and control elements. That's a heck of a bargain at 9, and probably still playable at 12.

Was she rare before? Sure, but I'm inclined to think it was more a case of folks just not being interested in playing Sloane lists. There were Sloane Swarms since day 1, even if they weren't the most popular, and they've never been too bad. Not always top tables, but again, I think that's got more to do with the strength of other stuff (early 2e was the Phantom Menace), and folks just not being interested in loose swarms.

//

To be sure, however, FFG gotta leave the aggressors alone.

She's arguably better than 5th, 7th, etc., in the same squads, but to get the most out of her you have to take a lot of ships that are not the best ships in the game. So the Coruscant winning squad is better with Sloane than 7th Sister, but that's probably not the case for all crew carriers in any squad. The much more common 3 ship lists tend to like getting a force point on a ship than Sloane, or more accurately not taking a crew carrier at all.

I've only played against Sloane a few times but I've enjoyed the games... Even when she was on Whisper...

I do think she s too cheap though and I dislike that an entire list pivots so totally around 1 single card.

I'd much rather that she was playable at a lower cost, enabling a touch of variety in her builds and lessening the massive importance she has in her squads. Like most squad buffs, her range should have been 0-2. Then you've got an interesting, playable card with some nuance to it. She becomes a strong element, rather than a dominating one.

Unfortunately, that Pandoras box won't close, so awkwardly priced and lacking in nuance it is.

Again though, I have no qualms about playing against her, I'm all for solving board state puzzles and having to totally alter my decision making to deal with different things. She's just not what she might have been, which makes her disappointingly mono culture.

14 minutes ago, Cuz05 said:

I've only played against Sloane a few times but I've enjoyed the games... Even when she was on Whisper...

I do think she s too cheap though and I dislike that an entire list pivots so totally around 1 single card.

I'd much rather that she was playable at a lower cost, enabling a touch of variety in her builds and lessening the massive importance she has in her squads. Like most squad buffs, her range should have been 0-2. Then you've got an interesting, playable card with some nuance to it. She becomes a strong element, rather than a dominating one.

Unfortunately, that Pandoras box won't close, so awkwardly priced and lacking in nuance it is.

Again though, I have no qualms about playing against her, I'm all for solving board state puzzles and having to totally alter my decision making to deal with different things. She's just not what she might have been, which makes her disappointingly mono culture.

This would be my assessment. Sloane isn't a game breaking problem, but she could/should have been designed better to provide the opponent with more choices to make when playing against her.

The last time I played against a Sloane swarm I killed the Sloane carrier last, and still won the game.

Sloane seems fine as is.

Is it too easy to fly a Sloane swarm? Both cheap carriers have awkward mobility and a naked Decimator is not really good either.

If you suppose she is too cheap, consider the following:

Naked Decimator Generic + Sloane + 5 TIE Fighter has 14 points left for upgrades,
Naked Lambda Generic + Sloan + 6 TIE Fighters has 16 points left for upgrades
Naked Reaper Generic + Sloan + 6 TIE Fighters has 20 points left for upgrades.

Does that mean Sloane should be 30 points?

3 hours ago, Cloaker said:

Sloane's been out for two years

And a powerhouse for almost one of them. If that's news then you didn't pay attention.

3 hours ago, Cloaker said:

and those silly TIE Aggies are just fine too.

They'll likely fade back into obscurity after official Org Play starts due to their poor availability.

3 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

And a powerhouse for almost one of them. It that's news then you didn't pay attention.

Data please.

Just now, Hiemfire said:

They'll likely fade back into obscurity after official Org Play starts due to their poor availability.

I wonder if the more-available Y-Wings see more play. They don't fly as well, but are meaningfully tankier.

That said, they can't bring Sloane.

Say. If anything that's an illustration of how good Sloane is. Similar ships to the ones Empire brings often don't succeed, because they don't have anything nearly as strong as Sloane to enable their swarms.

7 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

Data please.

Had you not heard of it yet? Or you don't believe it has been strong for that long?

Have a read here for starter

https://stayontheleader.blogspot.com/2020/02/sith-taking-with-admiral-sloane.html?m=1

https://stayontheleader.blogspot.com/2020/02/dr-sloanelove-how-i-learned-to-stop.html?m=1

Results, brother. Not just blog opinions and perspectives. (love his columns though)

If you're gonna use "Powerhouse", that means it's been winning. Placing. Beating meta lists down consistently and decisively, even in average player hands.

Without cuts and wins, then that's just like, your opinion, man. 😉

(all due respect, I love ya Dragoon)

As for the aggressors probably fine but I think the turrets should probably go up one point apiece and some of the turret carriers (Rebel and Scum Y's?) could come down one point.

25 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

If anything that's an illustration of how good Sloane is. Similar ships to the ones Empire brings often don't succeed, because they don't have anything nearly as strong as Sloane to enable their swarms.

Agreed she's good. But not broken, or OP. Other ships bring force charges or networked calculations to the table and are highly competitive despite being blocked or performing advanced manuevers or landing on an obstacle. If anything that's an illustration of how good the Force and Networked Calculations are. Similar ships to the ones those factions bring often don't succeed because they don't have anything nearly as strong as the Force or Networked Calculations to enable their swarms.

(See what I did there? 🤣 🤣 🤣 )

Stressed Force users don't give AF sometimes, because they got, you know, the Force.

We don't want to confuse learning how to prioritize targets more effectively with something being all of a sudden broken or too cheap for what it does. Any argument made against Sloane Swarm can be made for plenty of other facets of squad design.

But again, the answer isn't in always seeking continual point adjusts when something emerges, it's in understanding what aspect of the game is most essential sometimes to negate perceived advantage.

3 hours ago, ScummyRebel said:

Most forum dwellers: “if it contradicts how I like to play xwing, it’s broken and must be removed!”

Wrong: there are multiple ways to Play, and the correct answer is to play smarter and around the other pieces you see across the table. The only time something is truly broken is when there just are impossible match ups, and those have been handled pretty well (even if it took a bit for nantex fixing to come in).

Yeah, you’d think, given you many people complain about tractors and ions “taking away agency” and scream about effects that take more than one sentence to get across like struts and the new hidden conditions, that all the average forumite wants to do is roll dice and take focus actions.

In every pvp game, you need to be able to mess with your opponent’s stuff somehow. That said, just because the effect is fine, it doesn’t mean it isn’t overtuned. That’s just an entirely different discussion that I have no relevant experience to get into.

There might be some type of rule paradox that comes from this, but is there anything preventing FFG from giving a card like Sloane variable pricing based on the size of the player's squadron?

This would obviously solve the problem of how Sloane is being used currently, but would still allow her to be used effectively for smaller squadrons where she activates less frequently.

37 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I wonder if the more-available Y-Wings see more play. They don't fly as well, but are meaningfully tankier.

That said, they can't bring Sloane.

Closest I can think of is Drea with some Goons, but they don't have Sloane's mother goose ball kick from them getting destroyed. The area of Drea's effect is massively smaller, even with a turret equipped to her and there are allot fewer guns in the squad if I'm head simming it correctly.

40 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Say. If anything that's an illustration of how good Sloane is. Similar ships to the ones Empire brings often don't succeed, because they don't have anything nearly as strong as Sloane to enable their swarms.

Her ability, combining the penalty for destroying her squadmates with the re-roll her squad mates get against stressed targets, is probably the most powerful in the game and exceeds Huge ships in how far it can reach.