Asking for a friend who got Afterburners in his most recent Fang Fighter expac purchase and thinks that it's dumb they put it in there

It's on the quickbuild as far as I know, that made it a good excuse to distribute more afterburners

Generally, you do absolutely not want to adopt an obviously broken ship and list as new benchmark.

13 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

It's on the quickbuild as far as I know, that made it a good excuse to distribute more afterburners

Generally, you do absolutely not want to adopt an obviously broken ship and list as new benchmark.

Yeah, but is it REALLY broken now, seriously? Think Fenn Rau survives against Spamtex Turrets? I'd imagine he dies fast and easy, you know? With new game space design coming into the game, is the Fang living somewhat on borrowed time? Fenn Rau isn't even in the top 20 anymore since points change. Fang has only made two cuts as well as a chassis. Only going to be worse with HMP and Auzitucks flying around more with their 180s....

11 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

Yeah, but is it REALLY broken now, seriously?

It's not the fang that is broken. I believe @GreenDragoon is saying that the spamtex is broken so it's a bad example to use. Honestly they have experimented with enough break points that I don't see why they can't try adding the mod slot to the fang. If it's too much they can just remove it.

1 minute ago, reqent said:

It's not the fang that is broken. I believe @GreenDragoon is saying that the spamtex is broken so it's a bad example to use. Honestly they have experimented with enough break points that I don't see why they can't try adding the mod slot to the fang. If it's too much they can just remove it.

Ah, right. I need coffee.

15 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

Yeah, but is it REALLY broken now, seriously? Think Fenn Rau survives against Spamtex Turrets?

I think you misunderstood me. Spamtex is broken. If you buff Fenn to compete with that, then he is also broken. Otherwise he could not compete. It does not prove anything when he doesn't survive against spamtex. What does prove a lot is how extremely good Fenn was before Spamtex. And that should tell us he should definitely not get a mod slot.

FFG would have to nerf him again with the inevitable nantex nerf.

I'd not complain about mod slot on Fangs personally, but what I would really want is for them to just errata Nantex completely so they aren't either A) so spammable that they become broken. B) Actually work without Ensnare following A (that is to say, change the aces abilities to not revolve completely around a card they CLEARLY do not want you to use anymore)

42 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

Think Fenn Rau survives against Spamtex Turrets?

We have compelling data that suggests almost nothing survives against Spamtex turrets, so Fenn is nothing special in that regard.

In fact, Fenn Rau (Fang) is still arguably one of the best ships in the game. He's I6 with an excellent choice of repositional linked actions off of Focus and generous Blue maneuvers to clear stress. He is nigh invincible against 2-Attack ships with front arc weaponry and can fly more aggressively than most aces because of it, and even 3-Attack front arc ships struggle to put damage onto him even when they manage to create get those rare "killshot" opportunities that might bail them out against other aces.

Should one of the best, fastest ace ships in the game have access to Afterburners, a powerful enabling upgrade to reach range 1 where they are best?

While I agree with GreenDragoon's sentiment of "Don't base anything off of Nantex for fairness" I would like to see a mod slot on the Fang, if only for one season. You could take Fenn out of Hyperspace for that season out of an abundance of caution, or just leave Afterburners out of Hyperspace for another season.

Also, Joy Rekkoff needs to go down to 47 points.

9 minutes ago, Npmartian said:

Should one of the best, fastest ace ships in the game have access to Afterburners, a powerful enabling upgrade to reach range 1 where they are best?

But what if that's what I want? Doesn't that count for something ?

jeez dad you never take my side

10 minutes ago, 5050Saint said:

While I agree with GreenDragoon's sentiment of "Don't base anything off of Nantex for fairness" I would like to see a mod slot on the Fang, if only for one season. You could take Fenn out of Hyperspace for that season out of an abundance of caution, or just leave Afterburners out of Hyperspace for another season.

Also, Joy Rekkoff needs to go down to 47 points.

You know, I have no problem with one season wonders. I'm also not bothered by spamtex for that reason and it's why I think calls for emergency nerfs are unnecessary.

But it looks like we are in a severe minority in that regard, so maybe rather not

14 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

But what if that's what I want? Doesn't that count for something ?

Personally, I'm not sure that Nantex are really the main bother for Fangs. I stopped using the four Fang list a while ago, simply because R2/3 time on target and crit effects rose in the meta and made it difficult to do well in a wider sense.

The Fang is still a powerful ship, but now you need to balance your squads weaknesses more wisely. I don't think that's a bad thing tbh.

I don't think it needs a mod slot, I've never missed it and it would certainly edge certain squads towards broken, in the wake of another round of nerfs.

Not that I wouldn't find it amazingly fun.

I wouldn't use the slot for Afterburners, I'd use it for Stealth Device. Because 5 greens at r1 + concordia would be a thing of beauty, and also makes him less fragile to r2 shots.

49 minutes ago, Npmartian said:

Should one of the best, fastest ace ships in the game have access to Afterburners, a powerful enabling upgrade to reach range 1 where they are best?

When did this thread become about removing the mod slot from Vader?

52 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

You know, I have no problem with one season wonders. I'm also not bothered by spamtex for that reason and it's why I think calls for emergency nerfs are unnecessary.

I was thinking emergency nerfs (at least, nerfs that shipped with the new releases) only because I thought the season would be lasting until January, not probably November.

1 hour ago, 5050Saint said:

While I agree with GreenDragoon's sentiment of "Don't base anything off of Nantex for fairness" I would like to see a mod slot on the Fang, if only for one season. You could take Fenn out of Hyperspace for that season out of an abundance of caution, or just leave Afterburners out of Hyperspace for another season.

Yeah. The two issues (Spamtex, modi-FANG-cation slots) are separate and should be considered independently.

1 hour ago, 5050Saint said:

Also, Joy Rekkoff needs to go down to 47 points.

Joy at Skull + 0 points, or even Skull + 1, would be a lot of fun to test out. With cheaper Ion Torpedoes, she's basically a Skull with both Fearless and Outmaneuver, and that's kinda sweet.

To that end, Kad Solus also needs a cut. He's not worth Skull + 7. He can be Skull + 3 or even +4, but not +7.

3 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Joy at Skull + 0 points, or even Skull + 1, would be a lot of fun to test out. With cheaper Ion Torpedoes, she's basically a Skull with both Fearless and Outmaneuver, and that's kinda sweet.

To that end, Kad Solus also needs a cut. He's not worth Skull + 7. He can be Skull + 3 or even +4, but not +7.

Completely agree. Joy currently costs 57 points with Ion Torpedoes. That's more expensive than Wedge who can do it more than twice. If she dropped to the Skull price, she would be 52 points, old Wedge's price which seems much more fair. Certainly she has the Faceoff, but also is two initiative lower and with two less shields. 52 sounds good.

Kad also is 2 points less than Old T, which seems off. 50-52 sounds much workable for him.

I miss Kad. I just can't see past that much cheaper Skull these days.

15 minutes ago, Cuz05 said:

I miss Kad. I just can't see past that much cheaper Skull these days.

Triple Fang Aces (Elusive Kad, Fearless Old T, Outmanever Fenn) is probably one of my three favorite 2e lists, next to Palp Defenders, and 5 Optics SFs.

21 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Triple Fang Aces (Elusive Kad, Fearless Old T, Outmanever Fenn).

I meant to fly this near enough a million years ago but never got round to it. Kinda feels a bit late now

Flying that Kad and Old T with the bus was amazing but not very much the same

1 hour ago, Cuz05 said:

I meant to fly this near enough a million years ago but never got round to it. Kinda feels a bit late now

It's just such a pure list to fly that I think it's too late. It's a clean expression of what Fangs can do, and even if Fenn + 3 or 4 Skulls is better, Fang Aces is like... a classic car, or an old fully-manual film SLR. Whatever features get added to newer cameras or vehicles, there's something about the old stuff.

Will it be fully competitive? Probably not, but as a fun list, I think it's still worth.

Ok what is Spamtex Turrets??

6 minutes ago, Wayne Argabright said:

Ok what is Spamtex Turrets??

The turrets on spammed Nantex fighters, particularly 6x Petranki [sp?] Arena Aces. Lots of firing arcs, space for Crack Shot, easy to keep guns up on stuff with mods, and resistance to being blocked.